Forums: Climbing Information: Accident and Incident Analysis: Re: [notapplicable] Have you ever decked?: Edit Log




csproul


Apr 12, 2011, 4:31 PM

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Registered: Jun 4, 2004
Posts: 1769

Re: [notapplicable] Have you ever decked?
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notapplicable wrote:
"cracklover wrote:
In reply to:
If you think I am foolhardy for focusing my attention on the first line of defense while making choices that lead me closer to harms way and can't see the parallel in yourself then I would suggest you suffer from severe myopia.

Then I guess I must be myopic indeed. In my climbing career, I've had one time where I seriously fucked up, and had to watch the consequences unfold. I was, I think, suitably hard on myself for my choices. At no point did I think "well, everything I did was fine, I just should have done it better." Instead, from the instant I became aware that things might go south, through the event as it unfolded, and still as years passed, my thoughts were centered around fixing, changing, improving, and how to avoid even finding myself in that situation again.

But that's not my point. It's totally up to you to draw what lessons you see fit from your accident. We each have a different process we go through.

My point is simply that as you gather the input from folks who've come close here, remember to take into consideration the people who aren't here to answer, and the stories they might tell.

GO

I don't think milesenoell's response (as he phrased it, "to focus on the first line of defense") is any different from what we see when a belayer drops a climber. The fault in both cases is user error and no ones first response to a climber getting dropped is that we should all starting having our belays backedup. "Experienced" climbers drop people, or are themselves dropped much more often than TR solo rigs fail but you don't see two-man belay teams becoming the norm.

Instead, we focus on training, understanding proper gear function and checking and then re-checking the rig for proper setup. Which closely mirrors milesenoell's response to his accident.

Oh and relax a bit. You seem to be pretty agitated by what has been, IMO, a rather thoughtful and measured response to his accident.
I still think these two situations are completely different. With a belayer, you at least have two people to "focus on the first line of defense". Both belayer and climber ensure that everything is rigged correctly. The climber should have assessed the belayer's skill and deemed them acceptable to climb with. And the belayer only has to focus on one thing...belaying. When soloing, only one person to check the system...this obviously failed. The person climbing a solo-rig is also focusing on climbing, their self belay doesn't get their full attention as it would (should) from a live belayer.

I guess I feel like rope solo-rigs are about the same as climbing with a belayer I don't fully trust. In either case, I back it/them up, or find a belayer that I do fully trust, or treat the climb as if I am truly soloing (no rope).

And I'm kind on board with what Gabe is saying. It's unpopular, but what he's trying to say is that decking isn't common, and if it has happened then you and/or your belayer really did screw up. If the lesson you learn from decking is that "you'll just pay better attention to your system next time" and not change anything about it, then I don't think you've really learned any lesson at all.

edit: after reading the OP's post below, I'd say my above statement might be a bit over the top. He sounds like he is open to evaluating his system and I'm sure will be in a better position to re-evaluate his solo rig.


(This post was edited by csproul on Apr 12, 2011, 4:44 PM)



Edit Log:
Post edited by csproul () on Apr 12, 2011, 4:39 PM
Post edited by csproul () on Apr 12, 2011, 4:44 PM


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