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djoseph
Aug 30, 2006, 9:55 PM
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I'm posting this in case anyone knows this person. Boulder County Sheriff's press release copied below.
In reply to: Boulder County authorities are coordinating a search for a missing injured hiker in Eldorado Canyon State Park, five miles south of Boulder. Lance Hering, 21, of Boulder, was hiking in Eldorado Canyon State Park late Tuesday evening with a companion, Steve Powers, 20, also of Boulder. While free-climbing on a rock face near the trail that runs between Eldorado Canyon and Boulder County’s Walker Ranch open space preserve, Mr. Hering fell, striking his head. Mr. Powers estimated that Mr. Hering fell approximately 10-15 feet, but then rolled down a steep slope another 30 feet before coming to rest. Mr. Hering reportedly lost consciousness. Mr. Powers reported that he remained with Mr. Hering until he regained consciousness, then left him to summon help. He notified the Sheriff’s Office of the accident at approximately 5:00 a.m. Wednesday morning. Sheriff’s deputies and search and rescue personnel returned to the scene, which Mr. Powers had marked with articles of clothing, but were unable to locate Mr. Hering. A ground search of the area has been initiated under the direction of Sheriff’s office emergency services personnel. Three search dogs from Front Range Rescue Dogs (FRRD), and approximately 25 members of the Rocky Mountain Rescue Group are presently conducting the search. Additional resources from the Boulder Emergency Squad and Alpine Rescue groups have been requested. A media helicopter from KCNC-TV assisted by conducting a fly-over of the area early Wednesday morning. Paramedics from the Pridemark Ambulance Service are also standing by at the scene. Local residents have been alerted to his disappearance as have area hospitals. His family has also been notified. Mr. Hering is a white male, 21 years of age, approximately 5’8” tall, and was last seen wearing long white pants and a torn black T-shirt (fabric from the shirt was torn away to fabricate a bandage for his head wound). Anyone with information is asked to contact the Boulder County Sheriffs Office immediately at #303/441-4444. This media release will be updated as additional information becomes available. This media release may also be found on the Boulder County Sheriff’s Office web-site at: www.bouldersheriff.org
Dan
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majid_sabet
Aug 31, 2006, 4:07 PM
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BOULDER - A Marine visiting home on leave from Iraq remained missing Wednesday night, one day after he injured his head in a climbing accident.
About 40 searchers with dogs, horses and a helicopter scoured the steep trails and creek beds in Eldorado Canyon State Park, five miles south of Boulder.
Lance Hering, 21, of Boulder, had been "bouldering," or freestyle climbing, with friend Steve Powers, 20, also of Boulder, when Hering fell about 10 to 15 feet. Hering slid another 30 feet down a steep slope before coming to rest, Powers told Boulder County sheriff's deputies.
"It's very ironic that he survived all the combat that he saw and that he's injured here at home doing the thing he liked to do best," said his father, Lloyd Hering, who was at a command post waiting with his wife, Elynne, for news about their son.
Hering was unconscious for about four hours after the fall, according to Powers, who remained with his buddy.
Later, Hering came to, but he appeared to be disoriented, Sheriff Joe Pelle said. "Lance was described as what I would call 'loopy,' " Pelle said near the command post that had been set up outside the park's visitors center.
"He knew Steve and he knew he was hurt, but he would keep repeating things," Pelle added.
Neither man had been wearing a helmet, the sheriff said. The pair used fabric torn from Hering's black T-shirt and fashioned a bandage for his head wound.
Hering fell about 10 p.m. Tuesday. When he began to regain consciousness about 2 a.m. Wednesday, Powers said, he decided to get help.
"Steve told Lance, 'I need you to stay here. I'm going to get help,' " Pelle said.
It took Powers about 90 minutes to two hours to hike back down the trail. The 911 call to sheriff's deputies came in around 5:15 a.m., Pelle said.
Deputies quickly assembled a rescue team that returned to the point where Hering had last been seen on a trail that runs between Eldorado Canyon and Boulder County's Walker Ranch Open Space Preserve.
"They found Lance's climbing shoes - he's wearing sneakers. They found some blood and they found a water bottle," Pelle said. "They couldn't find Lance."
Searchers from Rocky Mountain Rescue, the Boulder Emergency Squad and the Boulder City Park rangers took part in the daylong effort.
Deputies also utilized five dogs and three horses, plus a helicopter that the sheriff's office had hired. Hering is described as about 5 feet 8 inches tall.
His parents were at the command post fielding calls from relatives and friends, and helping authorities to make calls to area hospitals on the chance that their son had wandered out of the park.
"He's in terrific physical condition," his dad said. "He's a very determined, very self-reliant young man. He's not in the habit of calling for help. I wished he'd stayed where he was.
" 'Lance, if you're out there please make yourself known. Don't be embarrassed.' My gut feeling is he'll get out. He's tough."
The search ended at 8 p.m. and was to resume at dawn. Pelle said he planned to keep a small crew of deputies on the trails in case Hering wanders out on his own.
"Your heart bleeds for the parents. They're brave people," Pelle said. "I hope we can deliver for them."
Hering's parents said their son had returned from Iraq about a month ago, and he had returned to his Boulder home during the last week. Hering is familiar with the area where he fell because he had climbed it when he was attending high school in Boulder, his parents said.
"He's a very self-sufficient person," his father said. "It would be like him to hike out and try to take care of his wound. We're afraid he might be confused in walking around."
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catbird_seat
Aug 31, 2006, 10:20 PM
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Mr. Powers faced a terrible dilemma in having to choose between leaving his partner to go get help or staying with him and hoping they would be found.
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kricir
Sep 1, 2006, 2:01 AM
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In reply to: Lance Hering, 21, of Boulder, had been "bouldering," or freestyle climbing,
:?:
From now on Im going to use the term freestyle climbing instead of bouldering.
In a seriousness, I hope this story has a happy ending, there have been enough sad tales in Eldo already.
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anykineclimb
Sep 1, 2006, 2:50 PM
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Listening to the radio here, the SAR crews are back out this morning to search for him.
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netteinboulder
Sep 2, 2006, 4:35 AM
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Saturday morning 9/2/06
Sheriff Pelle has led an impressive search for Lance Hering but has said that he will end the search Saturday night.
He is also allowing volunteer amateur searchers as long as they follow safety guidelines.
Meet at NCAR in the parking lot between 7am and noon to be put into a search group (parties of 3 or more). Bring water and food you can carry. Wear good shoes, a hat, and long, lightweight pants.
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ewtotel
Sep 2, 2006, 4:39 AM
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I wish I was out that way so I could help... still praying for Lance and his family, and hoping that lots of folks show up to help search.
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leomedic
Sep 2, 2006, 4:46 AM
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Another long day working the Eldorado Canyon/Walker Ranch area and no signs of Lance. We've got lots of experienced SAR talent out there. A moderate weather front moved across earlier this evening kept choppers grounded. Once weather clears and the winds drop we're hoping copters with IR spotting equipment will be able to overfly the area tonight.
Lots of bear and lion signs throughout the area with a few direct sitings have made the search that much more interesting. There is NO indication that Lance met up with one of the large predators. Several kill/feeding sites have been found and investigated. All remains were of typical prey animals, mostly deer.
Dogs have not registered any strong hits despite the number of handler/dog teams and many hours put into gridding the area.
Family, friends, and caring community have been unofficially supplementing the SAR teams. Well over 100 searchers were onsite today. We are not giving up hope!
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ericthebat
Sep 2, 2006, 4:55 PM
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I will be the first to apologize if he's really out there, but am I the only one who finds problems with this whole story?
1) "Bouldering at 10 pm" - it is really dark up there. I've lived and bouldered in Bldr for 30 years, and maybe they were just up there B.S.ing for hours - but they were not bouldering at that time of night.
2) It's a tough call, but a head injury and unconscious for 4 hours? That's a medical emergency necessitating ASAP treatment; you dont sit for 4 hours. You strip down to your shorts, put everything else over the injured person to keep them warm, then race for help.
3) After his friend left him, "at 2 am," it took him 2 hours to go a mile and a half downhill?
4) Especially for an athletic soldier, going uphill to Walker Ranch would only take an hour, even in the dark on that trail. From there, a prearranged ride could be waiting.
5) Trained search dogs couldn't follow a trail, even with fresh blood to start from?
I'm sorry, but this cries out as an AWOL ruse, and at the very least a serious interrogation of the friend is overdue.
I sympathize with any conscientious method of refusing to return to Iraq - but if this turns out as I suspect, they need to throw the book at his friend and any other accomplice, for risking the lives of 100+ volunteers, chopper pilots, etc.
If I'm wrong: The whole search and rescue concept is flawed. As with the lost RMNP ranger last year, these searches somehow miss the person, despite all the manpower. Then, hikers stumble upon the victim later -- inevitably, not far from a trail. What the hell's wrong w/ the search system?
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billl7
Sep 2, 2006, 6:16 PM
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In reply to: I will be the first to apologize if he's really out there, but am I the only one who finds problems with this whole story?
In reply to: 1) "Bouldering at 10 pm" - it is really dark up there. I've lived and bouldered in Bldr for 30 years, and maybe they were just up there B.S.ing for hours - but they were not bouldering at that time of night.
In reply to: 2) It's a tough call, but a head injury and unconscious for 4 hours? That's a medical emergency necessitating ASAP treatment; you dont sit for 4 hours. You strip down to your shorts, put everything else over the injured person to keep them warm, then race for help..
In reply to: 3) After his friend left him, "at 2 am," it took him 2 hours to go a mile and a half downhill?.
In reply to: 4) Especially for an athletic soldier, going uphill to Walker Ranch would only take an hour, even in the dark on that trail. From there, a prearranged ride could be waiting.
In reply to: 5) Trained search dogs couldn't follow a trail, even with fresh blood to start from?
Mostly being devil's advocate. I don't see that anything is quite all that clear although I'm sure people are wondering.
Bill L
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ericthebat
Sep 2, 2006, 9:09 PM
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Bill, the time and event specifics as reported by are repeated in every newspaper update - and earlier in this very posting.
here's the official sheriff's site w/ continual updates.
http://www.co.boulder.co.us/sheriff/hering.htm
- he fell while bouldering, about 10pm... friend sat w/ him, leaving him about 2am only after he regained consciousness. Friend contacted authorities after 5am
Not even the most zealous superboulderer I have ever known has any tips or power left after a couple or 3 hours hard bouldering, and the power stuff in Eldo isnt moderate low jug traversing a full moon or headlamp is adequate for.
It's hard, lots of highball, and crimpy. By dark, you're trashed and you've gone down for beers.
I was involved in a high peak rescue many years ago, and believe me, I ran all the way out the several miles from Cathedral Wall to the Bear Lake trailhead in RMNP on all adrenaline, in about 1 hour. Dark or not, I cant understand anyone taking 3 hours (2am to 5am) to go an easy 1.5 miles when a friend may be dying.
As I said, I will apologize if the story holds up, but I wont be surprised if he turns up healthy in Canada or somewhere.
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billl7
Sep 2, 2006, 9:15 PM
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ericthebat,
It's also possible that his friend killed him and made up the whole story about the fall, etc..
Bill L
Edit: The only time given on the sheriff's site is when they were notified: 5:00 a.m.. I'm a little skeptical of the accuracy/precision of what is being reported through the news services. Again, you may be right. Any number of alternatives to the story's face value could be right.
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climbingnurse
Sep 2, 2006, 10:02 PM
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I will admit that it occurred to me that this poor guy just couldn't stomach another trip to the Sandbox. Can't really say that I blame him.
It was quite cold and rainy last night on the Front Range. Though I do know that a climbing party survived a night spent on top of the 3rd Flatiron, and I'm pretty sure one of them wasn't wearing more than a cotton T-shirt.
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majid_sabet
Sep 2, 2006, 10:26 PM
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ericthebat
You are trying to think logical but out there things are done differenlty.
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teddyp324
Sep 2, 2006, 10:26 PM
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I talked to a friend of mine who was a part of the volunteer SAR and according to what he was told the injured man wasn't moved because it would have been more dangerous to move him than to leave him there. Unfortunatly it is more and more looking like a search for a body. It's sad but I don't know why they would only be wearing cotton t-shirts at that time and up at around 7000ft where it has gotten to freezing at night. I hope that he ends up being found alive, marines are resourceful.
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htotsu
Sep 4, 2006, 12:17 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: It's also possible that his friend killed him and made up the whole story about the fall, etc.. ...ala J-Tree 2004!
Huh? Fill me in, don't know what you're talking about.
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timstich
Sep 4, 2006, 2:29 AM
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Just to get this point straight, Lance did not fall while bouldering. He slipped off of the Colorado Trail while hiking back down to the car. As he slipped off the trail, he hit his head on a what looked like a Juniper tree. I was there and saw the scene. It's in a gulley one or two rises to the West of West Ridge.
You can still volunteer to do searches at the NCAR parking lot at the end of Table Mesa Drive. We hiked in Walker Ranch yesterday for several hours. The official search teams flag the trees and write the date and search group information on the tape. If you do a search, you'll see this tape all over the place. The official search has covered quite a lot of ground already, but obviously this is not enough. So go out for a little while and help out if you like. Do a little something on Labor Day.
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shaggyj
Sep 4, 2006, 3:06 AM
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sounds like they've called off the search in Eldo from what we've heard today.
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teddyp324
Sep 4, 2006, 3:36 AM
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The search has been called off, I talked to a friend who was a searcher today. It was a total of 7000man hours, minus all the volunteers. It's to bad, hopefully we can learn from this so that future accidents can be avoided.
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billl7
Sep 4, 2006, 4:12 AM
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What a tragedy. Best wishes for the friend, other close ones and family. I hope there may yet be a positive outcome.
Bill L
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squamishdirtbag
Sep 4, 2006, 5:40 AM
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I hope he faked his death and hes gonna hide
out in the mountains to crank and deek the man.
were here for you up north!
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porcelainsunset
Sep 4, 2006, 5:54 AM
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In reply to: I hope he faked his death and hes gonna hide out in the mountains to crank and deek the man. were here for you up north!
Hahaha. Hell yeah! We need an underground railroad for dirtbag climbers who got sucked into this whole mess in Iraq unwillingly. I'll put a candle in my front window so people can go squat in Squamish.
I don't mean to make any offense to those serving in Iraq or to the family of the victium, or possible escapee.
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clausti
Sep 4, 2006, 11:43 AM
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edited to delete unnecc. coments.
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leomedic
Sep 4, 2006, 11:12 PM
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In reply to: I will be the first to apologize if he's really out there, but am I the only one who finds problems with this whole story? 1) "Bouldering at 10 pm" - it is really dark up there. I've lived and bouldered in Bldr for 30 years, and maybe they were just up there B.S.ing for hours - but they were not bouldering at that time of night.
They had been freeclimbing (bouldering) all day, having bushwhacked up from the bottom that morning. When the fall occurred they were working their way back down the trail in the dark without lights. Where Lance went off the trail is only about a foot and a half wide traversing a 50-60 degree slope. Look at a map of the North Draw, they were only a hundred feet or so past the hairpin at the top when Lance fell. From the signs I saw, he misstepped off the trail between two trees (may have struck his head), tumbled at least once downhill, then slid (probably headfirst on his back) down a grassed slope. The slide path is quite clear for 20+ feet of slope, breaks through a thin brush screen, and off a small terminal drop of perhaps 8 feet with an impact point on a couple large flattish rocks at the bottom. There is significant blood that has run and pooled on the rock surface.
In reply to: 2) It's a tough call, but a head injury and unconscious for 4 hours? That's a medical emergency necessitating ASAP treatment; you don't sit for 4 hours. You strip down to your shorts, put everything else over the injured person to keep them warm, then race for help.
During daylight, if the patient was still unconscious after 30 minutes I would agree. At night in those hills I would not leave an unconscious person undefended. During the search there were several direct sightings of bears and lions, and the area is thick with tracks, lie-ups, kill/feeding sites, and other sign. I crossed paths with a sow bear and cub while searching the west face of Shadow Canyon on Thursday. That's the canyon east of the North Draw.
In reply to: 3) After his friend left him, "at 2 am," it took him 2 hours to go a mile and a half downhill?
Don't rely on the media for accurate details. Half the time they can't even get the major facts straight and I speak from over 20years of experience dealing with news media. Steve estimates it was 9:30 or a little later when Lance went off the trail. Steve stuck with Lance hoping he would regain consciousness and be able to walk out, maybe with Steve's help. When Lance finally roused he was acting "loopy". Steve is not medically trained and is not familiar with concussion patients. He didn't understand why Lance kept repeating the same questions, but it was obvious that Lance was not fully oriented. Steve started down for help somewhere between 2am and 3am at best estimate.
In reply to: 4) Especially for an athletic soldier, going uphill to Walker Ranch would only take an hour, even in the dark on that trail. From there, a prearranged ride could be waiting.
Possibly. If this was staged then the trail side fall area, the slide and impact site would have taken careful engineering. I saw nothing to indicate that anything other than a human body made the signs on that hillside.
In reply to: 5) Trained search dogs couldn't follow a trail, even with fresh blood to start from? I'm sorry, but this cries out as an AWOL ruse, and at the very least a serious interrogation of the friend is overdue.
Search dogs are not a magic wand. I've seen experienced dogs and handlers under strictly controlled practice conditions fail to find someone in a predefined search area.
Steve controlled bleeding from Lance's scalp injury with a bandage torn from Lance's t-shirt.
And you better believe the Sheriff's people interviewed Steve several times. He was also accompanied at all times by Sheriff's personnel during the search.
In reply to: I sympathize with any conscientious method of refusing to return to Iraq - but if this turns out as I suspect, they need to throw the book at his friend and any other accomplice, for risking the lives of 100+ volunteers, chopper pilots, etc. If I'm wrong: The whole search and rescue concept is flawed. As with the lost RMNP ranger last year, these searches somehow miss the person, despite all the manpower. Then, hikers stumble upon the victim later -- inevitably, not far from a trail. What the hell's wrong w/ the search system?
Your question as phrased sounds a lot like armchair quarterbacking. The SAR community is constantly seeking ways to improve search percentages. A typical acre of mountain terrain can contain 100-200+ potential hiding/shelter places to crawl into. Not including the possibility of climbing a tree, belting in hidden by foliage and then succumbing to injuries. In 20+ years of emergency service I've seen off-ground finds on several occasions. Frequently those later finds you refer to are after the foliage has dropped in the Fall or before leafout in the Spring.
If you are truly interested in your own question about search methodologies I suggest checking out either
--- Boulder Emergency Squad, http://www.bes-rescue.org
"...feel free to stop by one of our trainings or meetings. We meet every Monday night at our headquarters at 3532 Diagonal Hwy. in Boulder at 7:00PM. "
--- Rocky Mountain Rescue Group also based in Boulder, http://www.rockymountainrescue.org/html/calendar.html
"RMRG practices and training meetings are free and open to the public. Participation may be limited by experience and ability."
Regards to all and sympathies to Lance's family.
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htotsu
Sep 4, 2006, 11:16 PM
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Yipes. Just say no. Thanks, mbez.
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climbingnurse
Sep 5, 2006, 12:05 AM
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In reply to: this is still a volunteer army in the states, buddy. you sign a bunch of papers saying you'll do 4-8 years for uncle sam if he'll pay for your college, then, well, you have signed up for it.
Strong words from someone whose parents could afford to send them to college. It's volunteer, but it's also one of very few options for poor folk in this country.
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billl7
Sep 5, 2006, 12:21 AM
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deleted insensitive off-topic reactionary post
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clausti
Sep 5, 2006, 1:49 AM
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edited to remove unnecc. comments. following retained comment to refer to what might remain as quoted statements:
I would like to say that i got a PM that made me reconsider my statement [about our volunteer army], at least in part. specifically: those individuals who are serving out what they signed for, the four years of active duty, i would stand by my earlier statement. for men and women serving under stop-loss, or national gaurdsmen and women far past their contract, i apologize. not all of the things our military is doing right now are fair. and, i should have read a little bit further before i opened my proverbial mouth.
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socalclimber
Sep 5, 2006, 3:14 AM
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Uh do you guys think you could take your bullshit elsewhere and stay on topic.
Since you've forgotten, SOMEONE IS INJURED AND MISSING IN THE WILDERNESS. THIS PERSON HAS FRIENDS AND FAMILY READING THIS THREAD!
Having worked SAR here in JOSH and running OP's during the Eric Sears search I can tell you first hand how hard this must be for all those involved.
My best wishes in the search and the outcome.
Robert
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clausti
Sep 5, 2006, 4:02 AM
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In reply to: Uh do you guys think you could take your s--- elsewhere and stay on topic. Since you've forgotten, SOMEONE IS INJURED AND MISSING IN THE WILDERNESS. THIS PERSON HAS FRIENDS AND FAMILY READING THIS THREAD! Having worked SAR here in JOSH and running OP's during the Eric Sears search I can tell you first hand how hard this must be for all those involved. My best wishes in the search and the outcome. Robert
further apologies for having introduced and perpetuated off topic bullshit in a serious thread. to friends and family that might be reading this, my hope and sympathy goes out to you in a dark situation that is poorer than could be wished on anyone.
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timstich
Sep 5, 2006, 4:43 AM
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Well, it looks like this was all faked. Better than the event being real, if you ask me.
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socalclimber
Sep 6, 2006, 12:41 AM
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"I know it's a pain in the ass all of you relatives and friends of Lance, but this is pretty typical of threads regarding accidents. If you read enough of them you would see that. People in general get riled up about this sort of thing. It resonates with them in ways they don't quite get. You'd be surprised to see what some people say at times when an accident occurs and it makes them feel something. I used to say some extremely stupid things myself, until I was involved in an accident and had to explain this and that in public, etc. In the end, however, this annoyance doesn't equate to squat and I'm sure you know that.
Most everyone does care deep down, they just don't know how to express it sometimes. "
What you are missing is that RIGHT NOW, THEY ONLY FEEL ANGST, FRUSTRATION, FEAR, CONCERN, UNCERTRAINTITY ETC. Maybe in 6 months to a year that will change. Right now your observations are moot. I've done rescues on MANY people, I can assure you that your assertions are incorrect. That's all I'm going to post on this. If you would like to discuss this further with PM's, I would be happy to engage in that dialog, but not on this thread.
Again, my heart felt wishes for the best possible outcome for the search for Lance.
Robert
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majid_sabet
Sep 6, 2006, 3:06 AM
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update
The search for a missing Marine in Eldorado Springs Canyon has now turned to a missing-persons investigation, according to the Boulder County Sheriff's Office.
"The ground search for missing injured hiker Lance Hering, 21, was concluded late Sunday (Sept. 3) afternoon as the effort now transitions from an active search to a missing persons investigation," states a press release from the sheriff's Commander Phil West.
"Over 100 people were officially involved with the search Sunday under the auspices of the Sheriff's Office. Untold others, recruited by family and friends, were involved in private efforts along the Mesa Trail and the open space areas south of the National Center for Atmospheric Research (NCAR)," West said.
"Division Chief Dennis Hopper made the decision to call off further ground search efforts after consulting with Sheriff's Office Emergency Services personnel, search team leaders, and Mr. Lloyd Hering, Lance's father. The consensus of opinions was that, after five days' intensive effort, search and rescue personnel had searched every probable location in the Canyon and environs, and on many occasions, had re-searched the same area repeatedly," the release states.
Now confident that Hering is not within the search perimeter, the Sheriff's Office concluded its search efforts and began a missing-person investigation. Hering's father made a personal appeal Sept. 3 to his son to call home via the television and newspaper reporters present at the scene, concerned that the head injury sustained by Lance in his climbing fall late Tuesday night may have affected his memory and that he may be confused or disoriented.
The Sheriff's Office, and Hering's father, hope is that publicity, will enable the missing Marine to see the coverage and call home. Hering suffered another temporary memory loss after a fall when he was 11 years old, his father said.
The Sheriff's Office is continuing the investigation by conducting interviews with family and friends, sharing information with other law enforcement agencies and publicizing the circumstances of the young Marine's disappearance, West said. Anyone with information to offer is asked to contact Detective Steve Ainsworth at 303-441-3627.
Assisting the sheriff's search efffort were the Boulder Rural Fire Protection District, Alpine Search and Rescue, Boulder City Parks and Open Space, Douglas County Search and Rescue, Front Range Rescue Dogs, Garfield County Search and Rescue, Grand County Search and Rescue, Larimer County Search and Rescue, Rampart Search and Rescue, Summit County Search and Rescue, Western State Search and Rescue, Strasburg Fire Department, High Country Fire Protection District, and personnel from Rocky Mountain National Park. A contingent of 34 retired and active-duty Marines also participated.
The Denver Police helicopter assisted for a two days, providing a perspective from the air and using its Forward-Looking Infrared (FLIR) equipment to look for unattributed heat sources in the heavily-forested and rocky terrain.
Lance Hering is described as a white male, 21 years of age, 6'1" tall, approximately 180 pounds, with close-cropped blond hair in a military style cut, and blue eyes. He was last seen wearing a torn black t-shirt and light-colored khaki pants. He sustained a head injury in a climbing fall hours before he disappeared and had a bandage fashioned from the fabric of his shirt wrapped around the wound.
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timstich
Sep 6, 2006, 4:31 AM
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Thanks for the update, Majid.
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reno
Sep 6, 2006, 5:02 AM
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A bit off topic, but I want to send my admiration to those folks who managed to keep personal politics out of this thread. It's easy to speculate and bash and insult, but a few of y'all stayed above that.
Big ups to you.... you know who you are. The rest of you can... well, use your imagination.
I hope his family gets some sort of answer soon... must be terribly difficult to deal with such a situation.
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ericthebat
Sep 6, 2006, 8:22 PM
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To Leomedic,
Thanks for the detailed, concise, and well-reasoned responses to my postulates. The general trend in too many of these sorts of Forums (not spec. rockclimbing.com) is for the initial query and/or responses to become targets for scorn, condescension, or ridicule, and the conversation degenerates to petty insult exchanges.
Your firsthand description of the particulars at the scene is a reality check especially for forum readers 1000 miles away who have never been to Eldorado Canyon.
I take no pleasure in hoping for the sake of all that I am (cynically) right, that this is some awol cover up; after this length of time, should he really be missing in the canyon area, his chances are rapidly fading. Time spent means nothing compared to life lost.
I wonder if the authorities are now just trying to be especially thorough, by announcing that the blood found will be DNA-tested. That doesn't seem like a necessary or useful thing within the context of a search-and-rescue.
As I just read the most recent updates, it is now officially a missing-person case, so I suppose they're covering all their bases.
Good luck to all involved in this sad endeavor.
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majid_sabet
Sep 7, 2006, 7:26 AM
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update 5/9/06
BOULDER, Colo. A team of volunteers searching for a missing marine hope a set of footprints they found could lead them to his disappearance.
Lance Hering, 21, disappeared Aug. 29 after a fall while hiking with a friend in Eldorado Canyon.
"We're very encouraged," said Rick Baum, a veteran who formed his own search team after the official search ended Sunday.
Baum's group believes Hering is disoriented and lost after suffering a head injury in a fall. The crew said the footprints match the tread on Hering's shoes.
"There might be a trail here and so consequently we're pursuing that," Baum said.
Even as the sheriff's office pursues leads outside the canyon, it entered Hering's information and fingerprints into a national crime and information computer.
"If he's contacted by a law enforcement officer and they request his identification and he provides it, it will hit and reflect him as being a missing person from Boulder, Colorado," said Commander Phil West from the Boulder County sheriff's office.
Investigators have also posted fliers at the main RTD hub in Boulder where thousands of people pass through everyday.
"We're also distributing to the homeless shelters, all the local law enforcement agencies have received it," West said. "He may have caught a ride with somebody; he may be hundreds of miles away."
The sheriff's office has volunteers with Rocky Mountain Rescue were investigating the footprints Wednesday night and will determine whether or not they will send a dog team in the canyon.
The emergency services coordinator with the sheriff's office plans to meet with the volunteers to talk about the possibility of searching the canyon further.
"Bottom line is, we're going to find him," Baum said.
The sheriff's office is also trying to rule out the possibility that Hering disappeared by choice by comparing blood recovered at the scene of his fall with his DNA.
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killclimbz
Sep 7, 2006, 4:24 PM
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Wow, the accident was staged. Things didn't seem to make sense on this one. Looks like someone may have gone AWOL.
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ewtotel
Sep 7, 2006, 5:12 PM
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That moron... each and every person involved in the rescue should get five minutes alone in a room with him...
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wvsupernoob
Sep 7, 2006, 6:07 PM
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In reply to: I will be the first to apologize if he's really out there, but am I the only one who finds problems with this whole story?... ....I'm sorry, but this cries out as an AWOL ruse, and at the very least a serious interrogation of the friend is overdue....
Dude, you called it spot on! I mean, a lot of us were thinking it, but you nailed it. They'll make a "Lifetime Movie of the Week" out of this one.
Before Bil O'Riley gets ahold if it, I'll say this: I sympathise with the dude, after doing 3 Iraq tours already and not wanting a 4th, and I respect his high-school bud for helping him out to such a wild extent, but they still totally f**cked over a lot of people who were sincerely trying to rescue the man.
It's messed up.
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petro
Sep 7, 2006, 6:26 PM
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According to 9 news here he admitted to helping his friend set the whole thing up.
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rockscars
Sep 7, 2006, 7:38 PM
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Can't say that I blame Lance fo not wanting to go back for a second tour, but this was very poor decision making. Instead of breaking his parents' hearts, he should have just bit the bullet and served time in the brig and gotten a court-martial. I would think the penalty would be less than what he is looking at now. Not to mention the disrespect shown and intergrity lost!
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leomedic
Sep 7, 2006, 9:03 PM
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As the list now knows this was a faked scenario. I took part in the search, was one of the many unofficial volunteers that went out, including another 5hrs this morning....
Last night I learned that Lance had supposedly made a $2000 ATM withdrawal some time in the past two weeks but the money had not been used for it's supposed purpose. That cash in hand and some additional tidbits into Lance's personality made me head out early this morning to review the fall site. I arived at Eldo Canyon before any of the staff.
I spent 3hrs cutting traverses up the Draw just on the off chance. Then 2hrs at the site. There were inconsistancies at the scene that I had missed the first time out when we were focused on searching. The slide track I had thought was made during the accident actually was made by one of the responders. The "fall" line was parallel to the slide marks which had lined up directly with the blood spattered rock below. That alignment had fooled me.
I am by no means an accomplished tracker, but with leisure to go over the scene it became apparent the geometries of various tracks from the trail above to the reported impact site at the bottom were incorrect. I then reviewed the trailside evidence. Lance was reported striking his head on one of the trees before tumbling down the slope. There is an impact mark on one of the trees, but it appears to be from a branch or similar object. The bark is very rough and a human head hitting the tree with enough force to leave the marks would have left hair, skin and likely blood traces. The mark and surrounding bark is pristine with no trace I came down about 1pm wondering at the inconsistencies.
On my way out I stopped at the now manned entrance shack and asked the Park Ranger if there was any official news. I was stunned to hear it was a hoax and the news released while I had been traversing up to the site.
It is an immense relief to learn we don't have a corpse in the woods up there. At the same time I am terribly disappointed in both boys and do not understand how Lance could have put his parents and family through such an emotional ordeal. I wonder if in time they will come to realize how badly they let down the people who cared enough to go out and hike that terrain searching.
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majid_sabet
Sep 7, 2006, 10:17 PM
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lets change the title from FYI: fallen hiker/climber in Eldo (Lance Hering)
to FYI Pus**y hiker loose in Eldo Co.
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tradmanclimbs
Sep 7, 2006, 10:37 PM
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marine fakes death to go AWOL
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veganboyjosh
Sep 7, 2006, 11:12 PM
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while i can certainly understand a person's unwillingness to go back to a warzone--for a multitude of reasons, but let's keep the politics out of this thread--for as long as possible, anyway-- and i can maybe understand how youth and naivete would blind such a person into thinking faking this would makeit easy to dissappear, i'm thinking/hoping that neither of the two guys considered the consequences of reporting this as a fallen/missing climber.
i think back to when i was that old, and a lot of my decisions were made not taking things into consideration the way i could/should have. for better or worse, i had to deal with those decisions, just like these two will.
i would certinly hope that anyone considering dissappearing would now think twice about what all search and rescue circumstances will arise as a result of them faking a fall, or whatever.
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kricir
Sep 7, 2006, 11:57 PM
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The first thing I thought to myself when I heard this story was, right, the dude is probably in Mexico right now. Any one who’s spent some time in Eldo knows how constricting the area is, and how unlikely it would be for an injured man to escape unnoticed. A guy with a head wound is not going to climb up and out of the area; he is going to be pulled down hill to the parking lot. If the story had been true, they would of found him quickly. I must admit that my immediate skepticism was due in part to a recent episode in which my friend also wanted out of the marines.
http://www.reporterherald.com/Top-Story.asp?ID=5904
72 hours after Ace’s standoff, he was back home. He is now out of the marines on a general discharge. In my opinion, what Ace did was worse than what Lance or his friend did, but so far Lance’s friend is getting to worst of it. Before judging anyone, think to your self, would you have done any better? Would you of gone back for another deployment in hell rather than risk a slap on the wrist and maybe a little jail time? I’m not saying that what Lance (or Ace) did wasn’t bad, but who are you to judge them? People should stop being angry for no reason. If you went looking for Lance then that should say something about the goodness in you, don’t spoil it by wanting revenge.
And to all those slinging insults from out of state, who have no idea about what’s really going on, who got their information from the media and this site, shut the hell up. I’m not saying I know what’s going on, but I know from experience how misleading reports on such events can be, trust me.
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rockscars
Sep 8, 2006, 12:44 AM
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edited for space-case mistake 8^)-~
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kricir
Sep 8, 2006, 12:55 AM
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Two people died? Is that for real?!? :oops:
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rockscars
Sep 8, 2006, 1:15 AM
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Read about the wreck on page one of this thread. It was a car accident on the way there. Fate is a screwed up deal, but it was a result of going out to search. Consequences are ALWAYS greater than what we think they might be.
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usmc3073
Sep 8, 2006, 1:20 AM
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In the Marine Corps it is called U/A or Unauthorized Absence. AWOL is an Army term. It is a good thing the Marine is alive, a bad thing that so many were misled. Be wary before making judgments about his motives. Being a Marine is tough by itself, combat is an unspeakable horror most people have no concept of. His friend is a moron and should be prosecuted as well as the Marine once he is caught.
Semper Fi,
A Former Marine
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rockscars
Sep 8, 2006, 1:33 AM
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In reply to: In the Marine Corps it is called U/A or Unauthorized Absence. AWOL is an Army term. It is a good thing the Marine is alive, a bad thing that so many were misled. Be wary before making judgments about his motives. Being a Marine is tough by itself, combat is an unspeakable horror most people have no concept of. His friend is a moron and should be prosecuted as well as the Marine once he is caught. Semper Fi, A Former Marine
Thanks for the correction on AWOL v. U/A. Gold goes to you for :"Being a Marine is tough by itself, combat is an unspeakable horror most people have no concept of."
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djoseph
Sep 8, 2006, 2:48 AM
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Edit: I believe that in the above posts, rockscars is confusing a 2004 Joshua Tree SAR incident, in which two SAR personnel died in a car accident. There were no SAR personnel lost in this search, as far as I know.
Dan
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sausalito
Sep 8, 2006, 3:07 AM
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sad shit any way you slice it. Sad for pretty much everyone. I will say that is one good f*cking friend to even stick with the story this long.
To all those that searched for him I will say that I think its better to be wrong for all the right reasons than to be right for all the wrong reasons. So searching for a missing/injured person is exactly what you were doing. Perception is reality ya know? To you he was injured and needing help. The fact that he wasnt doesnt really change any of that.
I will say it again because its worth saying. That is one good friend. He is going to take probably more heat then the kid because he saw how big this thing got and still kept his mouth shut in plenty of time for the guy to bolt. I will never fault someone for being too good of a friend.
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timstich
Sep 8, 2006, 4:25 AM
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I'm certainly not sorry I helped out with the search and would do it again. Hell, I'd be happy if everyone I went out to search for was playing an April Fools trick. It's a lot nicer than doing a goddamned body recovery, I can tell you that much.
Good luck Lance. Hope you don't get raked over the coals too badly.
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anykineclimb
Sep 8, 2006, 5:11 AM
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Fucking coward.
makes me sick
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majid_sabet
Sep 8, 2006, 5:54 AM
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Time to start washing dishes PENDEJO
.......................................................
The Boulder County Sheriff's office may seek restitution for the manpower used in the search for a missing marine that turned out to be an elaborate scheme.
Lance Hering, 21, disappeared on Aug. 30 while hiking with his friend Steve Powers, 20. Powers told officials Hering fell and hit his head and when he went to get help, Hering disappeared.
The 5-day search cost thousands of dollars and the sheriff's office said they would tabulate the overall cost for the search in the rugged Eldorado Canyon.
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hare
Sep 8, 2006, 7:56 AM
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Can't really seek restitution for the 7000+ volunteer hours put into this search. That's just lost time that hopefully won't take away rescuers ability to respond to the next person that actually needs a rescue. These are mostly people that have to take vacation time to respond to this stuff with no compensation and often little appreciation for their efforts.
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tibetan_wander
Sep 8, 2006, 3:55 PM
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I respect and admire all the SAR folks for all they have done. Amazing--and many honors to you.
There's no words I have for the parents and family of Lance. My prayers are with you.
Steve Powers, what a great friend you are. We all have good traits and bad traits, and you're clearly no saint--but this loyalty blows me away.
To all the people criticizing Lance for lying to get out of returning to this mess in Iraq: I think he was lied to when he went to Iraq. I think that's the bigger lie, with the greatest and most grave losses for all involved.
Peace to all.
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erisspirit
Sep 8, 2006, 5:24 PM
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In reply to: To all the people criticizing Lance for lying to get out of returning to this mess in Iraq: I think he was lied to when he went to Iraq. I think that's the bigger lie, with the greatest and most grave losses for all involved. Peace to all.
While there may be truth to that, I think it's incredibly selfish to put your parents and loved ones through the torment of thinking you might be lost/ dead in the wilderness, as well as wasting the time of good hearted volunteers . I have many friends who have served in Iraq multiple times. One was shot all the others have seen gruesome things that they never want to relive. None of these people would ever consider faking their disappearance to get out of the responsibility they accepted.
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fmd
Sep 8, 2006, 6:09 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: To all the people criticizing Lance for lying to get out of returning to this mess in Iraq: I think he was lied to when he went to Iraq. I think that's the bigger lie, with the greatest and most grave losses for all involved. Peace to all. While there may be truth to that, I think it's incredibly selfish to put your parents and loved ones through the torment of thinking you might be lost/ dead in the wilderness, as well as wasting the time of good hearted volunteers . I have many friends who have served in Iraq multiple times. One was shot all the others have seen gruesome things that they never want to relive. None of these people would ever consider faking their disappearance to get out of the responsibility they accepted.
I am sure that some of Lances friends said the same about him.
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fmd
Sep 8, 2006, 6:12 PM
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In reply to: f---ing coward. makes me sick
You ever been in combat. Ever see your friends get thier leg blown off? If not....STFU
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njbourne
Sep 8, 2006, 6:14 PM
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Everyone seems to be sharing their opinion based on the assumption that the Marine in question perpetrated this lie because he is a coward or that he can no longer, in good conscience, participate in the Iraq conflict.
I has been my experience, as a former Marine and someone who worked with our servicemen and women in Iraq and now here in Africa, that it is just as likely that his motivation is something as simple as his girlfriend left him or has threatened to leave him. Another possible motivation is that he is not good at the job he has been assigned in the Marine Corps. I'm sure all Marines reading this post will join me in saying that unless you have experienced it, you will never know the immense pressure Marines place on each other and themselves when it comes to job performance. Often a Marine who does not perform adequately at work is ostracized both at work and outside of work. This isolation can lead to low self esteem, instances of unauthorized absence and in extreme cases suicide.
Everyone who participated in this search represents the highest ideals of service. The same ideals that have led many to serve the country. I hope this experience will not dissuade anyone from future volunteer work.
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krusher4
Sep 8, 2006, 6:27 PM
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I spent one day in the rain looking for what I thought would be a dead body. I would like to hear Lance say sorry to everyone that looked for him. I wonder if his GF knew, she was in my search party and at times seemed really pyched about routes and boulders which I thought was odd.
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dingus
Sep 8, 2006, 6:41 PM
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In reply to: Everyone seems to be sharing their opinion based on the assumption that the Marine in question perpetrated this lie because he is a coward or that he can no longer, in good conscience, participate in the Iraq conflict.
Not everyone bro. It isn't for civilians to judge this man (outside the SAR thing itself) AT ALL. They have no bearing on the subject, nor do the possible reasons the Marine had for trying this.
AWOL is AWOL and there is no two ways about it, esp. in a time of conflict. Excuses are irrelevant.
It is a military matter, start to finish.
But the 'coward' labelers, well, lets just say I share fmd's distaste for their opinions.
DMT
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njbourne
Sep 8, 2006, 6:46 PM
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Please don't think I was making excuses for this guy.
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krusher4
Sep 8, 2006, 6:48 PM
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Could he be considered a deserter during time a war? With the penalty being death?
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climbrc
Sep 8, 2006, 6:51 PM
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From: http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_4300154
"West said Thursday that detectives had yet to verify much of what Powers told them...... calling Powers "a very polished liar."
Maybe there is no Lance.. Hmmmm..or perhaps Powers has it out for him and Lance is really off backpacking somewhere, picking daisies..
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dingus
Sep 8, 2006, 7:06 PM
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In reply to: Please don't think I was making excuses for this guy.
Didn't think you were dude. Just pointing out that in the military excuses are like assholes, everyone has one and they all stink, haha.
DMT
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dingus
Sep 8, 2006, 7:10 PM
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In reply to: Could he be considered a deserter during time a war? With the penalty being death?
No, desertion is specifically fleeing combat I think.
He is presumably AWOL... absent without leave. Punishment can vary depending upon circumstances.
Faking an injury to avoid service in a time of war is subject to dishonorable discharge and 10 years in a miltary brig, Ft Levenworth most likely, hard time.
UCMJ is easily googled.
DMT
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wvsupernoob
Sep 8, 2006, 7:10 PM
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In reply to: From: http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_4300154 Maybe there is no Lance.. Hmmmm..or perhaps Powers has it out for him and Lance is really off backpacking somewhere, picking daisies..
Dude, that would make powers... a MASTERMIND! Off Hering somewhere, and fake a fake accident, play the double role of hiking bud, then extreme friend, but all the while he's just eaten him like Alferd Packer. Omg the intrigue!
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usmc3073
Sep 8, 2006, 8:28 PM
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If he deserted in a combat zone he could be killed. Since he is U/A they will catch him and I guarantee you that whatever slap on the wrist he gets in the civillian world will pale in comparison as to what is going to happen to him once the Marines get a hold of him. Besides the fact that he will be totally shunned by every Marine, he will do hard time in the brig, and I do mean hard. He will not be sitting in some cell watching cable TV. Most likely he will be on a chain gang doing labor or doing meaningless physical tasks ie. Coolhand Luke. After that he gets to enjoy a dishonorable discharge which carries harsh lifetime penalities with it.
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timstich
Sep 8, 2006, 11:20 PM
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All Lance has to do is show up at Camp Pendleton on Sept. 11 and he will avoid the whole AWOL charge. He would be pretty stupid not to just do that and figure out how to avoid deployment some other way. The cat is out of the bag, dude. Give it up.
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majid_sabet
Sep 9, 2006, 12:24 AM
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What do I have for you guys today, let see
--------------------------------------------------------------
Steven Powers, 20, was arrested at the Boulder County justice center after he had been brought in for an interview with authorities. Investigators were looking into discrepancies and inconsistencies in his story.
Powers reported to police on August 29th that Hering, 21, had fallen during a climbing accident in Eldorado Canyon and had a head injury. Powers says once Hering regained consciousness he left the injured Marine and went for help. However, when Powers returned with rescue teams, Hering had disappeared.
http://www.9news.com/acm_news.aspx?OSGNAME=KUSA&IKOBJECTID=89253f6b-0abe-421a-0016-e5d5c48d21b0&TEMPLATEID=0c76dce6-ac1f-02d8-0047-c589c01ca7bf
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thegreytradster
Sep 9, 2006, 1:13 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: ... he will be totally shunned by every Marine, ... Indeed we must all shun the non-believer!
Yep! talking unicorns are about your speed.
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wvsupernoob
Sep 9, 2006, 3:22 AM
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In reply to: All Lance has to do is show up at Camp Pendleton on Sept. 11 and he will avoid the whole AWOL charge. He would be pretty stupid not to just do that and figure out how to avoid deployment some other way. The cat is out of the bag, dude. Give it up.
Yep, he walks into the base, and he avoids the brig and the UA charge.
He also avoids Iraq, because the Marines are going to turn him over to Boulder County for the felony arrest warrant for breaking probation.
They're going to discharge him anyway, because they weren't supposed to accept him in the first place with that criminal record.
I wonder how far away he really is by now?
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teddyp324
Sep 9, 2006, 4:06 AM
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The entire SAR cost over $750,000 including the helicopter and over 7000 man hours by pro SAR. They are apparently giving the bill to the partner, to bad for him... he's also facing fraud charges and I was told 25yrs in jail for one of them, can't remember which one.
-Ted
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timstich
Sep 9, 2006, 6:57 AM
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In reply to: The entire SAR cost over $750,000 including the helicopter and over 7000 man hours by pro SAR. They are apparently giving the bill to the partner, to bad for him... he's also facing fraud charges and I was told 25yrs in jail for one of them, can't remember which one. -Ted
The false police report does not carry a 25 year penalty, since it is only a misdomeanor. You are thinking of the AWOL penalty, which could still be avoided if Lance shows up where he is supposed to. As for the bill, I am happy to pay the taxes for that. I personally spent $12 in gas driving to the searches! Lordy. I'm just glad it's over.
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anykineclimb
Sep 9, 2006, 2:15 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: f---ing coward. makes me sick You ever been in combat. Ever see your friends get thier leg blown off? If not....STFU
Well, in fact...
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alexmac
Sep 9, 2006, 3:59 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: f---ing coward. makes me sick You ever been in combat. Ever see your friends get thier leg blown off? If not....STFU Well, in fact...
Hmm, just because someone calls the dude a coward does not automatically mean they did not seen combat. As for this person using the resouces of SAR to go AWOL; frankly the punishments are not enough and anyone issusing a false report should get the full bill; as for AWOL or not, its still cowardance and the worst of all crimes to put SAR to work to cover up. It would have been better if he just went to some big city and hid in plain sight
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fmd
Sep 9, 2006, 9:10 PM
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Hmm, just because someone calls the dude a coward does not automatically mean they did not seen combat. As for this person using the resouces of SAR to go AWOL; frankly the punishments are not enough and anyone issusing a false report should get the full bill; as for AWOL or not, its still cowardance and the worst of all crimes to put SAR to work to cover up. It would have been better if he just went to some big city and hid in plain sight
What I mean by my statement is that no one should judge this guy here. We don't really know him to judge him. Of course, what he did is wrong. He will be judged by the appropriate authorities when the time comes. The presumption is that he went AWOL to keep going back to the Middle East. But if someone is going to call him a coward, maybe one should try to understand what he had went through over in a war zone. Sorry, but Paramount pictures does not really portray the horrors of war very well.
Not sure of your comment though of "the punishments are not enough" for we dont know what consequences he is going to face.
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mitguy
Sep 9, 2006, 10:48 PM
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I'd say it takes a certain amount of courage to hack up and then follow through with a plan that involves becoming a fugative from the US military. If you were being dragged off to hell, would it be more couragous to fight for your life to escape it, or to meekly go and fight the demons when you are there? Seems to me it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other. It also seems to me that despite everyone being upset they were dupped, as far as escape plans go, this one was pretty clever. He kept everyone busy with their eyes down for several days, giving him time to escape. Perhaps it would have been more responsible for him to take a road trip to Montana and never come back, but then again it lacks a certain flair...maybe what he was doing was trying to find a way to run away with honor (now I know that's gonna raise some contention...not really interested). If he creates an escape, he's like the hero in his own movie. There's an element of danger, the chance that he'll get caught, and the hubris of tricking the authorities. It's like Captain Rameus' escape in Hunt for Red October. Defectors are all cowards from one side, and heros from the other, it just depends upon your point of view. There were many draft dodgers in the Vietnam War, and it seems to me the responses were similarly mixed and polarized.
And now back to Alpinist 17, which just came in the mail :D
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alexmac
Sep 10, 2006, 3:53 AM
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I think folks miss my point, when I refer to punishment I refer to him using the "accident" as a cover. What the military does to him is not my concern; but the use of "accident" and the resouces.
Can you imagine some time later when their SAR budget is nearly empty and say a little girl goes missing and cause of this clown, less then 110% of the resources can go into searching and helping (fictional in this case , used to make a point). Also, I wonder if someone in that area had a accident and could have been airlifted to hospital and had to suffer longer cause they could not to get the hospital cause the chopper was out looking for this person.
Never mind what the courts will do to him, never mind what the military will do to him; I suspect karma will get him much worse later in life. Lets hope he's a smoker and his medical insurance runs out.
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shanz
Sep 10, 2006, 4:13 AM
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Was bored at work and did some investigating on AWOL in this country. Since the war in Iraq there are (roughly) some 6000 soldiers currently AWOL in the country. Many are reservists and many more are simply soldiers opposed to the war. As many of them have said its a war for oil not for terrorism. I don't agree or disagree with this I'm merely showing what i have found. They one thing that repetitively has been said was that they raided homes of Iraqis with no provocation or suspicion of insurgents being in the homes. I also found numerous soldiers whose time was served in the military and were due to be discharged honorably then the "stop-loss policy clause was instituted and their enlistment contract was null and void. They were forced to serve additional tours of duty. From what i have gathered this stop loss policy was instituted due to declining numbers of active and non active duty military personnel. I did my time in the military and i am glad to have served my country. Though if it was time for me to be discharged and the pulled this crap on my id be F;ing pissed but i would have continued to serve my country. It takes someone willing to make sacrifices to ensure the freedom of the rest of us. Personally i think that this stop-loss policy is a load of crap come up with my some ass-clown politician and i don't get how you can serve your country to protect freedom while being a slave yourself. Lance on the other hand you are not a patriot and could never be considered a climber if you were willing to stage this and put other peoples lives at risk. Whether or not you are convicted you still have to live with yourself and answer to a higher power when this life ends.
Boy that should get the liberals all fired up - go hug a tree and eat tofu ya wankers
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majid_sabet
Sep 10, 2006, 6:28 PM
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In reply to: The entire SAR cost over $750,000 including the helicopter and over 7000 man hours by pro SAR. They are apparently giving the bill to the partner, to bad for him... he's also facing fraud charges and I was told 25yrs in jail for one of them, can't remember which one. -Ted
$750.000 +$ 12 for the other SAR guy's gas , $750.012 worth of bill
$ 7.50 per for washing dishes at local restaurant x 40 hrs per week @ $300
x 52 = @$14.000 per year / $750.000 that will make it to about
60 years of hard work , no I got it Wrong, there will $$ on min wages in the next 60 years so how about 45 years of work !!!!
washing and washing for mighty long time my man
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veganboyjosh
Sep 10, 2006, 7:12 PM
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In reply to: Can you imagine some time later when their SAR budget is nearly empty and say a little girl goes missing and cause of this clown, less then 110% of the resources can go into searching and helping (fictional in this case , used to make a point).
a good point, and one which i think often goes unconsidered.
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wvsupernoob
Sep 26, 2006, 4:48 AM
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Don't know why I'm still following this story, but I have been.
Last week was the big announcement that he was caught on camera buying a bus ticket the same day the search started.
But the latest news is Rambo-funny: (if it is late news, what with the old date)
09/16/06, officers received information that Lance Hering may be avoiding civilization in the Gunnison National Forest near the Spring Creek area. A credible witness advised that they talked with an individual who matches Mr. Hering's description near Mosca Lake. Boulder County was advised and Gunnison County Sheriffs Officers attempted to locate the individual without success.
http://cbs4denver.com/...story_268191015.html
Lance Hering is now BIGFOOT! Where will he be spotted next???
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timstich
Sep 26, 2006, 4:54 AM
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Also in the Gunnison police news blotter!
"09/23/06, officers located an underage drinking party at a location near County Road 17, Antelope Hills. Seven underage persons were identified but only warnings were extended."
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raoulthepoolboy
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Sep 27, 2006, 5:03 AM
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timstich
Sep 27, 2006, 5:16 AM
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In reply to: Well that's all really conclusive evidence. :boring:
Please beat your meat in private. No one wants to see that you disgusting little man.
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majid_sabet
Oct 9, 2006, 4:20 PM
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BOULDER - Missing Boulder Marine Lance Hering's family has created a Web page in the hope of establishing contact with him.
Hering, 21, was reported missing Aug. 30 by a friend who told authorities that Hering had a climbing accident in Eldorado Springs Canyon State Park. More than a week later, and after an extensive manhunt, investigators learned the accident story was a hoax.
They eventually recovered videotape of Hering at a Denver bus station the same day
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krusher4
Oct 9, 2006, 6:30 PM
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I heard something about Lance not wanting to go back because his unit was convicted of war crimes and he was going to testify against them and was afraid of them??? Any one have anything on this?
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wvsupernoob
Oct 9, 2006, 6:58 PM
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In reply to: I heard something about Lance not wanting to go back because his unit was convicted of war crimes and he was going to testify against them and was afraid of them??? Any one have anything on this?
Yes, that's the latest "shocking twist" I've heard too. Last week it was an 'amazing' insurance fraud plot, now it's moved into hollywood territory.
here:
http://www.denverpost.com/ci_4448131
And also, http://www.lancehering.com/ is the page his family just put up - featuring 3 heartwarming photos and a blog link.
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krusher4
Oct 9, 2006, 9:00 PM
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When's the movie coming out?
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majid_sabet
Oct 9, 2006, 9:50 PM
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I got some on report, I could posted it if that make a difference.
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timstich
Oct 10, 2006, 3:57 AM
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In reply to: I heard something about Lance not wanting to go back because his unit was convicted of war crimes and he was going to testify against them and was afraid of them??? Any one have anything on this?
Sounds conveniently similar to recent news items involving killed civilians in Iraq. I don't buy it for a second. He was just tired of serving in that war I think. I mean, three tours? That would be enough for anyone.
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majid_sabet
Oct 11, 2006, 4:19 PM
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update 10/10
Authorities have issued an arrest warrant for Hering on a felony charge of failure to comply with terms of a deferred sentence from a 2004 burglary charge and a misdemeanor charge of conspiracy to commit false reporting to authorities.
Powers also was charged with misdemeanor false reporting.
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dynosore
Nov 25, 2008, 5:20 PM
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Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too.
He was just about to turn himself in, right......
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shockabuku
Nov 25, 2008, 5:49 PM
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dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right......
Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime.
In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army).
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reg
Nov 25, 2008, 6:43 PM
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[quote "usmc3073"]In the Marine Corps it is called U/A or Unauthorized Absence. AWOL is an Army term. It is a good thing the Marine is alive, a bad thing that so many were misled. Be wary before making judgments about his motives. Being a Marine is tough by itself, combat is an unspeakable horror most people have no concept of. His friend is a moron and should be prosecuted as well as the Marine once he is caught.
Semper Fi,
A Former Marine[/quote]
no marine active or in-active would call himself a "former" marine - me thinks you speake unthruths
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knieveltech
Nov 25, 2008, 7:17 PM
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anykineclimb wrote: Fucking coward. makes me sick
Then proceed immediately to your local recruiter's office and enlist.
Edited to add: wtf is going on qith quote all of a sudden?
(This post was edited by knieveltech on Nov 25, 2008, 7:18 PM)
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dingus
Nov 25, 2008, 7:33 PM
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shockabuku wrote: dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right...... Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime. In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army).
George Bush was AWOL in time of war. They made him President.
DMT
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socalclimber
Nov 25, 2008, 8:18 PM
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dingus wrote: shockabuku wrote: dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right...... Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime. In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army). George Bush was AWOL in time of war. They made him President. DMT
Remember Dingus, this guy is probably just middle class white trash, like the rest of us. Bushy-poo and friends/family have money, lots, and lots of money.
Need I say more?
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dingus
Nov 25, 2008, 8:36 PM
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socalclimber wrote: dingus wrote: shockabuku wrote: dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right...... Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime. In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army). George Bush was AWOL in time of war. They made him President. DMT Remember Dingus, this guy is probably just middle class white trash, like the rest of us. Bushy-poo and friends/family have money, lots, and lots of money. Need I say more?
No you didn't have to say it at all. Even the former Bush supporters on this site STFU'd a long, long time ago.
I feel sorry for the kid, to an extent. I feel no sympathy at in some other respects. I'm quite conflicted by it all!
Cheers
DMT
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shockabuku
Nov 25, 2008, 8:53 PM
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dingus wrote: socalclimber wrote: dingus wrote: shockabuku wrote: dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right...... Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime. In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army). George Bush was AWOL in time of war. They made him President. DMT Remember Dingus, this guy is probably just middle class white trash, like the rest of us. Bushy-poo and friends/family have money, lots, and lots of money. Need I say more? No you didn't have to say it at all. Even the former Bush supporters on this site STFU'd a long, long time ago. I feel sorry for the kid, to an extent. I feel no sympathy at in some other respects. I'm quite conflicted by it all! Cheers DMT
Ain't.
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rockie
Nov 25, 2008, 9:51 PM
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knieveltech wrote: anykineclimb wrote: Fucking coward. makes me sick Then proceed immediately to your local recruiter's office and enlist. Edited to add: wtf is going on qith quote all of a sudden?
Why would he have to do that??
He didn't sign up, the other idiot did and therefore had to comply and fight for his country, I don't see many idiots in the U.K forces acting like this moron and they'd all agree he's an idiot.
He's right, the guys a coward, and deserves all punishment he got/ had coming to him. Prat.
Edited to add: As was his Dad and his friend, and anyone else that helped him, idiots, and if you really believe he was about to turn himself in.. emm yer right? lol.
If he was going to turn himself in he'd have done that when it first happened; in 2006?
(This post was edited by rockie on Nov 25, 2008, 9:56 PM)
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angry
Nov 25, 2008, 9:54 PM
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Isn't desertion during wartime call for the death penalty? Or is that just a rumor?
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rockie
Nov 25, 2008, 10:01 PM
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angry wrote: Isn't desertion during wartime call for the death penalty? Or is that just a rumor?
I certainly know it was how it used to be yes.
Not sure it need be that harsh, but certainly he should be jailed, and worked to earn back the money he wasted on those SAR teams looking for him when he wasn't missing, and the rest!
I think his Dad and his friend and anyone else who helped him should be penalised in that manner too. Might teach them, and anyone else who thinks of acting that way, a lesson.
PVR if you want to leave, like the rest of us who left did, or do.
You choose to sign up, then you have to comply.
I hope he reads this.
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dingus
Nov 25, 2008, 10:20 PM
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rockie wrote: angry wrote: Isn't desertion during wartime call for the death penalty? Or is that just a rumor? I certainly know it was how it used to be yes. Not sure it need be that harsh, but certainly he should be jailed, and worked to earn back the money he wasted on those SAR teams looking for him when he wasn't missing, and the rest! I think his Dad and his friend and anyone else who helped him should be penalised in that manner too. Might teach them, and anyone else who thinks of acting that way, a lesson. PVR if you want to leave, like the rest of us who left did, or do. You choose to sign up, then you have to comply. I hope he reads this.
Yes I am sure he is going to read THIS post, out of the hundreds of thousands calling him a coward. Oh yes, that is going to happen.
"Up to" the death penalty, I believe, is the potential sentence.
I think a lengthy community service sentence spent serving disabled and severely wounded combat vets would be a just sentence, for the soldier and those who aided his crime.
DMT
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socalclimber
Nov 25, 2008, 10:50 PM
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dingus wrote: socalclimber wrote: dingus wrote: shockabuku wrote: dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right...... Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime. In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army). George Bush was AWOL in time of war. They made him President. DMT Remember Dingus, this guy is probably just middle class white trash, like the rest of us. Bushy-poo and friends/family have money, lots, and lots of money. Need I say more? No you didn't have to say it at all. Even the former Bush supporters on this site STFU'd a long, long time ago. I feel sorry for the kid, to an extent. I feel no sympathy at in some other respects. I'm quite conflicted by it all! Cheers DMT
I agree with your conflicted sentiments. On the one hand, he volunteered for military service, don't whine about it. On the other hand, serving your country is one thing, it's entirely another when your "fearless" leader sends you out to die to do his and his cronies dirty work.
Not matter what, he's likely to fry for this one.
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8flood8
Nov 25, 2008, 11:10 PM
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I think a couple of years servicing Bush would actually teach him more than going to the desert to kill innocent people would ever learn him.
to quote an awesome band...
"We wave the flag of freedom as we conquer and invade"
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j_ung
Nov 25, 2008, 11:15 PM
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Awfully close to Soapbox, but maybe not there yet. Still, it's not really an accident thread yet and I'd rather not moderate it heavily. Moved to General.
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Gmburns2000
Nov 26, 2008, 12:11 AM
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[thread drift] - so what's up with the lack of "going straight to the newest post" feature? Now when I open up, I am taken to the first page, regardless of whether or not I've read it already. This seem to be hit or miss lately.
[/end drift]
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shockabuku
Nov 26, 2008, 12:19 AM
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socalclimber wrote: dingus wrote: socalclimber wrote: dingus wrote: shockabuku wrote: dynosore wrote: Man, is he in a world of hurt. I see his genius dad was helping him too. He was just about to turn himself in, right...... Be interesting to see how that turns out with desertion during wartime. In peace time, desertion is generally handled with a dishonorable discharge (which is appealable after 1 year or something like that) and that's about it (at least in the Army). George Bush was AWOL in time of war. They made him President. DMT Remember Dingus, this guy is probably just middle class white trash, like the rest of us. Bushy-poo and friends/family have money, lots, and lots of money. Need I say more? No you didn't have to say it at all. Even the former Bush supporters on this site STFU'd a long, long time ago. I feel sorry for the kid, to an extent. I feel no sympathy at in some other respects. I'm quite conflicted by it all! Cheers DMT I agree with your conflicted sentiments. On the one hand, he volunteered for military service, don't whine about it. On the other hand, serving your country is one thing, it's entirely another when your "fearless" leader sends you out to die to do his and his cronies dirty work. Not matter what, he's likely to fry for this one.
Maybe. Here's the oath:
"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962).
It doesn't leave much wiggle room in that regard.
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socalclimber
Nov 26, 2008, 1:08 AM
Post #124 of 126
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Registered: Nov 27, 2001
Posts: 2437
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shockabuku wrote: Here's the oath: "I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God." (Title 10, US Code; Act of 5 May 1960 replacing the wording first adopted in 1789, with amendment effective 5 October 1962). It doesn't leave much wiggle room in that regard.
Yup, I've read it. Long long ago. I understand it. You are right about that.
While I'm divided and have my ideals, the truth is the same. He did take an oath. He made a comitment. He chose not to follow through and run from it. And, it caught up with him. Now he's gonna have to pay the price.
(This post was edited by socalclimber on Nov 26, 2008, 1:10 AM)
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rockie
Nov 26, 2008, 7:24 AM
Post #125 of 126
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Registered: Sep 18, 2007
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socalclimber wrote: shockabuku wrote: Here's the oath: Yup, I've read it. Long long ago. I understand it. You are right about that. While I'm divided and have my ideals, the truth is the same. He did take an oath. He made a comitment. He chose not to follow through and run from it. And, it caught up with him. Now he's gonna have to pay the price.
And who could possibly argue with that?
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majid_sabet
Mar 27, 2009, 4:28 PM
Post #126 of 126
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Registered: Dec 13, 2002
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BOULDER, Colo. (AP) - A former Marine accused of faking his disappearance to avoid returning to his unit has paid back most of the cost of the extensive search that occurred after a friend reported him missing.
Boulder County sheriff's officials say Lance Hering and his father, Loyd, presented the agency with checks totaling $30,705 on Thursday.
Hering, a lance corporal and Iraq war veteran, was on leave from Camp Pendleton, Calif., when he disappeared in 2006. At the time, his friend Steve Powers told authorities Hering was in a rock-climbing accident near Boulder and wandered away while Powers went for help. That prompted a 5-day search that cost $33,000.
Powers later admitted the report was a hoax.
The sheriff's office says Powers has paid more than $2,300 in restitution for the search, and Lance Hering and his father volunteered to pay the rest.
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