So for my stats class I taking a survey to determine the percentage of climbers, who have been climbing for more than 2 years, that have lead (trad or sport) a 5.12 (indoors or outdoors). If you dont mind answering these 4 questions I would greatly appricate it. It should only take a minute. I need 100 replies to do my project.

Thanks.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Thanks again for your help, I think it will be interesting to see how many people have been lead climbing for more than two years that have ever lead a 5.12.

So for my stats class I taking a survey to determine the percentage of climbers, who have been climbing for more than 2 years, that have lead (trad or sport) a 5.12 (indoors or outdoors). If you dont mind answering these 4 questions I would greatly appricate it. It should only take a minute. I need 100 replies to do my project.

Thanks.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Thanks again for your help, I think it will be interesting to see how many people have been lead climbing for more than two years that have ever lead a 5.12.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport).

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?.

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym).

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead? .

Thanks again for your help, I think it will be interesting to see how many people have been lead climbing for more than two years that have ever lead a 5.12.

I don't think you would get accurate representation, or anything meaningful at all, but good luck.

Yes


Yes


Yes. I am assuming you mean outdoor or gym. I have never led a gym 5.12.


Led -- 5.12c. Redpointed-- 5.12b. Not sure if you care, or know, about the difference.



I don't think you would get accurate representation, or anything meaningful at all, but good luck.

Yes, there will clearly be a flood of posters coming in and letting everybody know that they don't climb .12.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Yes
Yes
No
11a

Take that Sungam!

I love statistics, and that most people don't understand them...

So for my stats class I taking a survey to determine the percentage of climbers, who have been climbing for more than 2 years, that have lead (trad or sport) a 5.12 (indoors or outdoors). If you dont mind answering these 4 questions I would greatly appricate it. It should only take a minute. I need 100 replies to do my project.

Thanks.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Thanks again for your help, I think it will be interesting to see how many people have been lead climbing for more than two years that have ever lead a 5.12.

yes
yes
yes
5.8

[I'll assume this means that you led the 12c with some hangs? Unless I know they are talking about aiding, when someone tells me they led something, I usually assume they did so cleanly, without falls, hanging, or pulling on gear (I know...I'm not primarily a sport climber). If we're counting aid climbing, I've "led" in the high 13's. Not trying to be difficult, I was truly confused by what you wrote, as I'm sure the OP was.

I love statistics, and that most people don't understand them...

Please tell me that the topic you are being taught jn your stats class is sampling bias. There is no way in hell you are going to get even remotely close to a generalizable statistic in this format.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Wat?

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Yes.

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Yes.

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

I assume that means cleanly? Yes.

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

5.12a.

So for my stats class I taking a survey to determine the percentage of climbers readers of RC.com, who have been climbing for more than 2 years, that have lead (trad or sport) a 5.12 (indoors or outdoors). If you dont mind answering these 4 questions I would greatly appricate it. It should only take a minute. I need 100 replies to do my project.

Thanks.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Thanks again for your help, I think it will be interesting to see how many people have been lead climbing for more than two years that have ever lead a 5.12.

By my count, according to this survey, 61% of climbers have climbed 5.12 or above.

By my count, according to this survey, 61% of climbers have climbed 5.12 or above.

. . .

. . .

. . .

BAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Wat?

By my count, according to this survey, 61% of climbers have climbed 5.12 or above.

. . .

. . .

. . .

BAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

Kind of funny how many internet hardmen/women there are, huh? Why is it that every climbing area I go to has to the longest lines on climbs 5.10 and below?

Because 5.12 climbers don't drag 3 of their friends that have never climbed before up a route and clog up the route for an hour and a half?

Or perhaps because the areas that you're going to are predominately underhung and therefore centered around 5.10 climbing?

This of course doesn't address your implication that someone who has climbed a 5.12 is a "hardman".

I'll go beyond implying and state with almost certainty that there are far more climbers that cannot climb 5.12 than those who can, and yet once again on this website, the opposite appears to be true. You may be right about the ganging of easier routes, but that would contribute to the whole numbers thing, huh? I've climbed at many of the US destination crags and at most all of them, the majority of climbers are climbing below 5.12, including some with extensive sport climbing; Rumney, RRG, NRG, Red Rocks, Obed, ORG, Boulder Canyon etc...It is certainly true for the destinations I have been to with more trad climbing; Yosemite, JT, Gunks, IC. The only places I have seen with more 5.12+ climbers than below are places like Rifle, that are steep sport-centric places with very few easier climbs, and these in the minority.

I'll go beyond implying and state with almost certainty that there are far more climbers that cannot climb 5.12 than those who can, and yet once again on this website, the opposite appears to be true. You may be right about the ganging of easier routes, but that would contribute to the whole numbers thing, huh? I've climbed at many of the US destination crags and at most all of them, the majority of climbers are climbing below 5.12, including some with extensive sport climbing; Rumney, RRG, NRG, Red Rocks, Obed, ORG, Boulder Canyon etc...It is certainly true for the destinations I have been to with more trad climbing; Yosemite, JT, Gunks, IC. The only places I have seen with more 5.12+ climbers than below are places like Rifle, that are steep sport-centric places with very few easier climbs, and these in the minority.

Might I make a suggestion here and say that the ability to lead a "5.12" in a gym has little to nothing to do with being able to lead one outside, either on bolts or on gear. Take the indoors portion of this poll away, it means nothing.

Might I make a suggestion here and say that the ability to lead a "5.12" in a gym has little to nothing to do with being able to lead one outside, either on bolts or on gear. Take the indoors portion of this poll away, it means nothing.

Well no, I agree that the results of this "survey" mean nothing, but I figured that pretty much everyone was on agreement on that. I was more focused on your implication that there aren't lines on .12s or that there aren't (sport) crags out there with crowds of people who climb .12s. There are plenty of 12 years olds and 1-year gym n00bs climbing .12 sport these days. In fact I think on average you'll find more crowds at a 5.12 sport crag than a solid 5.10 traditional crag.

So for my stats class I taking a survey to determine the percentage of climbers, who have been climbing for more than 2 years, that have lead (trad or sport) a 5.12 (indoors or outdoors). If you dont mind answering these 4 questions I would greatly appricate it. It should only take a minute. I need 100 replies to do my project.

Thanks.

Question One. Do you lead climb? (trad or sport)

Question Two. Have you been lead climbing for more than two years?

Question Three. Have you ever lead a 5.12? (indoor or gym)

Question Four. What is the hardest route you have ever lead?

Thanks again for your help, I think it will be interesting to see how many people have been lead climbing for more than two years that have ever lead a 5.12.

Agreed...... I may have to come up with a better survey... This survey is was simply serving the purpose of establishing a null hypothesis.

Agreed...... I may have to come up with a better survey... This survey is was simply serving the purpose of establishing a null hypothesis. For the real survey I will have to obviously figure out a different technique as I totally agree, most people who have not climbed a 5.12 would be hesitant to say so for reasons of pride. Anyways, thanks for the interesting conversations and particapting in this survey.

Because 5.12 climbers don't drag 3 of their friends that have never climbed before up a route and clog up the route for an hour and a half?

Or perhaps because the areas that you're going to are predominately underhung and therefore centered around 5.10 climbing?

This of course doesn't address your implication that someone who has climbed a 5.12 is a "hardman".

Jesus, it's not rocket science. An unbiased survey looks like this:

1 - For how many years have you been climbing?
2 - Do you lead climb?
3 - What is your hardest send?

Then add some language about the constraints of the survey (inside and/or outside, trad and/or sport). Only this time take the 30 seconds to proof-read your post so it doesn't say indoor or gym.

GO

Seriously, who are you people who feel like you are in a position to judge weather or not this is a good survey? Are you my instructor? Or perhaps you are in a position to give me UNWANTED advise? The fact is neither is true. PLEASE keep your opinions to yourself. I DONT CARE IF YOU LIKE THE SURVEY OR IF IT COULD HAVE BEEN DONE BETTER. If you would like to answer the survey then I appricate it but if you only came on here to critisize my survey to make yourself feel important then move on. I am a student, a veteran, and a fellow climber and certainly deserve more respect than I have been shown on here.

Seriously, who are you people who feel like you are in a position to judge weather or not this is a good survey? Are you my instructor? Or perhaps you are in a position to give me UNWANTED advise? The fact is neither is true. PLEASE keep your opinions to yourself. I DONT CARE IF YOU LIKE THE SURVEY OR IF IT COULD HAVE BEEN DONE BETTER. If you would like to answer the survey then I appricate it but if you only came on here to critisize my survey to make yourself feel important then move on. I am a student, a veteran, and a fellow climber and certainly deserve more respect than I have been shown on here.

yes
yes
yes
12a (13 indoors but noone actually counts that)

also please don't equate your deserving respect with what jobs you have had. Try equating respect with being a human being. We all deserve respect.

the beautiful art of sarcasm.

camhead that is hilarious, thanks for brightening my day

I'm actually serious here. 13s, hell, 12s in any gym that I've been to , are hard.

I agree actually. I think that a 12 in a gym is really hard. I don't want you all to get the wrong idea here, I prefer to climb outdoors. I climbed outdoors for 3 years before I ever tried the gym. In my limited experience the time I spent in the gym in the off season has made me a much stronger climber outdoors. It also provided a platform for me to practice sport lead climbing to where I could get comfortable enough with it to try it outdoors. That has been my experience anyways.

The purpose of this survey as I have mentioned is for a stats class but the reason I choose this topic is because I wanted to see where my progress was comparatively with other climbers who have been climbing about as long as I have. Last summer I lead a 5.11 sport outdoors and have lead one 5.12 in the gym. According to this survey most people are climbing 5.12's. That is surprising to me.

I agree actually. I think that a 12 in a gym is really hard. I don't want you all to get the wrong idea here, I prefer to climb outdoors. I climbed outdoors for 3 years before I ever tried the gym. In my limited experience the time I spent in the gym in the off season has made me a much stronger climber outdoors. It also provided a platform for me to practice sport lead climbing to where I could get comfortable enough with it to try it outdoors. That has been my experience anyways.

The purpose of this survey as I have mentioned is for a stats class but the reason I choose this topic is because I wanted to see where my progress was comparatively with other climbers who have been climbing about as long as I have. Last summer I lead a 5.11 sport outdoors and have lead one 5.12 in the gym. According to this survey most people are climbing 5.12's. That is surprising to me.

Additionally I am not sure why everyone on here has to be a jerk..... Honestly, what is your problem.... I have not had one negative comment with the same survey on other climbing websites but everyone on here has been just straight up mean.

Additionally I am not sure why everyone on here has to be a jerk..... Honestly, what is your problem.... I have not had one negative comment with the same survey on other climbing websites but everyone on here has been just straight up mean.

Yea well sorry I didn't get it down to the exact month I started climbing... I didn't realize everyone was going to be sooooooo freakin anal about everything. My point was that I started climbing outdoors before I started climbing indoors and the time spent indoors was valuable in making me a stronger climber. THAT WASN'T OBVIOUS.... I can not believe that you are so anal about this that you actually tracked what I said here with what I said on MP.......

I mean don't you have anything else to do besides give me shit.

It's what we do baby, it's what we do. Also, I don't think that everyone on here is a jerk. It just seems like it sometimes.

You said that climbing indoors allowed you to practice it and get comfortable with it enough to try it outdoors. You also said that last summer you lead a5.11. And finally, that you climbed for 3 years before climbing indoors. So it seems like it's off by more than a couple months.



Not really, no.

According to this survey most people are climbing 5.12's. That is surprising to me.

Yea well sorry I didn't get it down to the exact month I started climbing... I didn't realize everyone was going to be sooooooo freakin anal about everything. My point was that I started climbing outdoors before I started climbing indoors and the time spent indoors was valuable in making me a stronger climber. THAT WASN'T OBVIOUS.... I can not believe that you are so anal about this that you actually tracked what I said here with what I said on MP....... I mean don't you have anything else to do besides give me shit.

Well, just for the fun of it, I am curious. What does everyone think the actual number should be, as define below?

What proportion of self-defined rock climbers have successfully sent at least one route consensus-rated 5.12a or above (or equivalent in other grading scales)?



I'm going to go with roughly 15%.

This survey is was simply serving the purpose of establishing a null hypothesis.

Well, just for the fun of it, I am curious. What does everyone think the actual number should be, as define below?

What proportion of self-defined rock climbers have successfully sent at least one route consensus-rated 5.12a or above (or equivalent in other grading scales)?



I'm going to go with roughly 15%.

Taking your term "self-defined rock climber” to mean most anyone who owns gear and leads AND based on how many of those same climbers I see lining up on 12a routes at the Gunks, Daks, Cathedral, etc., I’m going to say you’re being generous.
My hat is off to any of you that regularly lead at that level or higher. The only chance I would have on a 12-whatever route, would be if the first fifty feet was 5.6.

I am taking "self defined" to be when asked whether or not they would consider themselves a rock climber, they would say yes. Simple as that.

I think you guys are seriously underestimating how easy it is for someone who is young and motivated to redpoint just one 5.12 at their local sport crag.

I think you guys are seriously underestimating how easy it is for someone who is young and motivated to redpoint just one 5.12 at their local sport crag.

One of the great things about having your own golf course is that you get to set the difficulty, take that hole, it is a par 47. Yesterday I birdied the sucker

Impressive... You are the first response of someone who has lead a .14.....

Not just a 14, etiher. A 14d.

Jay

A null hypothesis, as in null hypothesis and alternative hypothesis. The null hypothesis is a statement to be tested, which has no change, no effect, or no difference. The null hypothesis is assumed true until evidence indicates otherwise. The alternative hypothesis is a statement that I can find evidence to support. The idea is I will compare one to the other. This survey has been an experiement in configuring a null hypothesis. The alternative hypothesis will be determined after collecting sufficent evidence to support it.

So go ahead, pick it apart..... I know that is what you will do but I took that right out of my textbook so that you cannot critisize me, it is from the text.

So now that you know my life story, maybe you could help me write my book........ Its called "Get a Life".....