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currupt4130
Feb 9, 2009, 8:30 PM
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So I got this little guy from some friends that found him on the side of the road. He's been with me for about three or four weeks and he's already been out climbing with me three times. He's an Australian Shepherd. We figure he's about 13 weeks.
These are hotlinked from Facebook. If they don't work I'll try and host them elsewhere.
We went climbing in the New River Gorge on Saturday. It was beautiful.
My personal favorite (I have to put him in my pack to carry him in and out of the ladders at the wall)
(This post was edited by currupt4130 on Feb 9, 2009, 9:27 PM)
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wonderwoman
Feb 9, 2009, 8:35 PM
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He's adorable! I can't believe you found him on the side of the road! He's lucky to have found you!
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reno
Feb 9, 2009, 8:35 PM
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Cute pup. Start training him now, and you'll be thankful later.
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currupt4130
Feb 9, 2009, 8:45 PM
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I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have?
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krusher4
Feb 9, 2009, 8:47 PM
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currupt4130 wrote: I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have?
It needs to leave other people and their things alone (ie not eat my food in my pack LOL) needs to listen to your commands and get along with other dogs....that's all I can think of.
It seems like crag dogs are either great or horriable
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currupt4130
Feb 9, 2009, 8:48 PM
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He's pretty good so far. I really don't want to be that guy at the crag though. So I'm working on it.
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boymeetsrock
Feb 9, 2009, 8:50 PM
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Well I would start by teaching him how to belay. From there you can move on to setting anchors, and then rope gunning. Good luck.
Oh and your crag dog is what is wrong with rock climbing.
He is cute though. I bet he would make a nice chalk bag if the crag dog thing doesn't work out.
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Stormeh
Feb 9, 2009, 8:50 PM
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currupt4130 wrote: I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have?
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reno
Feb 9, 2009, 8:50 PM
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currupt4130 wrote: I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have?
1. Absolute, total, complete recall. You speak his name, he comes, no matter what. Coming to you should be more rewarding than chasing rabbits and squirrels.
2. Down/Stay. He is told to be still in a given spot, and he stays there until told to leave. Getting up to stretch and turn around to lay back down is OK, but "Stay" should last as long as you tell him.
3. "Out" means "get away from whatever the dog is next to." The dog should get away from other people, other people's belongings, ropes, etc.
4. Sit. Also an absolute. Walking on the trail, see people coming the other way, the dog should sit quietly on your left side, ignore the other people, and let them pass. He doesn't get to walk up to strangers, sniff, get petted, etc.
5. Heel... no pulling on the leash. Loose, calm, relaxed walk beside (or a step behind) you.
(This post was edited by reno on Feb 9, 2009, 8:53 PM)
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jrathfon
Feb 9, 2009, 8:52 PM
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currupt4130 wrote: I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have?
my dog had a burning desire to eat poo. not such a big deal, except crags are littered with human stuff. (people don't know how to dig cat-holes) so try to train him off the smelly stuff.
super cute!
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angry
Feb 9, 2009, 9:00 PM
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I've always wanted to start a puppy rental business for single guys. I mean look at that thing, I practically want to do you.
Relish in your puppy induced tail, once it's a dog you'll need to have a personality again.
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adatesman
Feb 9, 2009, 9:01 PM
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sungam
Feb 9, 2009, 9:36 PM
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good lord I miss my dog. Too bad he's likely to kick it before I get back. Mayb e I'll get myself a cute pup like that.
That dog is ridiculously cute. I love dogs that use their ears for expression.
No leash? He follows you about?
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reno
Feb 9, 2009, 9:39 PM
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adatesman wrote: reno wrote: 1. Absolute, total, complete recall. You speak his name, he comes, no matter what. Coming to you should be more rewarding than chasing rabbits and squirrels. 2. Down/Stay. He is told to be still in a given spot, and he stays there until told to leave. Getting up to stretch and turn around to lay back down is OK, but "Stay" should last as long as you tell him. 3. "Out" means "get away from whatever the dog is next to." The dog should get away from other people, other people's belongings, ropes, etc. 4. Sit. Also an absolute. Walking on the trail, see people coming the other way, the dog should sit quietly on your left side, ignore the other people, and let them pass. He doesn't get to walk up to strangers, sniff, get petted, etc. 5. Heel... no pulling on the leash. Loose, calm, relaxed walk beside (or a step behind) you. Joking aside, if I could get Annie to do #1-#5 she's come along to the crag a lot more often. Not everyone enjoys an exuberant 120 pound Great Dane puppy romping all over the place, so she gets left home more often than not.
I can be hired, for the right mixture of beer, sofa space, and a guided tour of the local crags.
My crag dog:
(This post was edited by reno on Feb 9, 2009, 9:40 PM)
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altelis
Feb 9, 2009, 9:54 PM
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reno wrote: currupt4130 wrote: I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have? 1. Absolute, total, complete recall. You speak his name, he comes, no matter what. Coming to you should be more rewarding than chasing rabbits and squirrels. 2. Down/Stay. He is told to be still in a given spot, and he stays there until told to leave. Getting up to stretch and turn around to lay back down is OK, but "Stay" should last as long as you tell him. 3. "Out" means "get away from whatever the dog is next to." The dog should get away from other people, other people's belongings, ropes, etc. 4. Sit. Also an absolute. Walking on the trail, see people coming the other way, the dog should sit quietly on your left side, ignore the other people, and let them pass. He doesn't get to walk up to strangers, sniff, get petted, etc. 5. Heel... no pulling on the leash. Loose, calm, relaxed walk beside (or a step behind) you.
i completely agree- my pup wasn't allowed to come with me until she could do all this.
i will say there are HUGE benefits to having a well trained dog. i bring her mtn biking and, after that when she got even better at listening back-country skiing (i had to be CERTAIN she wouldn't wander onto adjacent dangerous slopes).
i will say that the above list are the necessary and sufficient skills to bring your dog to the crag. i pushed my dog to be exploratory as well as scramble. i always would get on top of things (boulders, walls, play ground jungle gym type things) and call her like mad. she got REALLY good at scrambling to the point she almost never needs to be picked up. for instance she makes the hike into the gallery at red rocks without a second thought. that comes in handy on many occasions, esp at crags that have a lot of scrambling involved.
my dog is a border collie/bearded collie mix and so is about the same size as a aussie shephard (well, i take that back, she's a little smaller and not quite as, well, husky as aussies tend to be...) that said one of the best investments i got was a pack for her that is NOT a single unit but rather a harness system with a removable bag system. it was on backcountry for DIRT cheap, each bag has its own bladder system so that they can carry their own water and it helps to even out the weight from side to side. well, when i go on hikes that i know will require steeper scrambling/ladders i pop the harness on her in the beginning of the day. for instance when we did the loop hike at the fischer towers there is one ladder. its wasn't terrible to hold her in one hand by the harness and use the other for the ladder. not bad at all.
the advantage to the harness is that if you have to hand the dog off to somebody below/above you they only need to make purchase on ONE point, namely the handle. ever tried to hand off a bundle of dog to somebody? doesn't work very well. we figured this out trying to get above the boulder in the black corridor at red rocks. PITA. if you just put the pup in now and just randomly hold him/her up by the harness they'll get used to it and not kick their legs or anything. this has proven to be EXTREMELY useful in more precarious scrambles.....
here's the pack, the ruff wear palisades II pack: http://www.backcountryoutlet.com/...F0003&mv_pc=r126 its on sale at backcountry outlet right now. the II is an older model, and not quite as sexy looking as the new one. that said the new ones are 99 and the palisades II are being blown out on pretty much all "outlet" sites. i would seriously consider it, if you do any long hikes, scrambling, etc you'll appreciate the investment.
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ShibbyShane
Feb 9, 2009, 10:07 PM
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reno wrote: currupt4130 wrote: I'm working on it. Speaking of, what kind of skills does a good crag dog need to have? 1. Absolute, total, complete recall. You speak his name, he comes, no matter what. Coming to you should be more rewarding than chasing rabbits and squirrels. 2. Down/Stay. He is told to be still in a given spot, and he stays there until told to leave. Getting up to stretch and turn around to lay back down is OK, but "Stay" should last as long as you tell him. 3. "Out" means "get away from whatever the dog is next to." The dog should get away from other people, other people's belongings, ropes, etc. 4. Sit. Also an absolute. Walking on the trail, see people coming the other way, the dog should sit quietly on your left side, ignore the other people, and let them pass. He doesn't get to walk up to strangers, sniff, get petted, etc. 5. Heel... no pulling on the leash. Loose, calm, relaxed walk beside (or a step behind) you.
Ditto all of what Reno said. If you start training really young it's much easier to get the point across, especially if you make it fun (ie not getting frustrated at the dog). Keep the training "sessions" around 10-15 minutes and possibly shorted if he/she is getting the point and doing everything correctly.
And PLEASE, don't be one of those people that uses treats to train their dogs.
Treats are a last resort in my opinion and if you train them with treats you have to wean them off the treats, and they will always be more food-oriented than a dog that is trained w/o food. Think Cesar Milan vs. that chick from "It's Me or the Dog."
You can also use "Leave it" to compliment "out." Leave it being used beforehand and out being used if he's already in there. Slowly work on the stay command by building up how long he has to stay, etc.
Heel is also important because, for one, your dog should always be following you, not leading; and for two, if he has a good heal, you won't need to use a leash, which can be a pain if you're trying to scramble around on rocks and such as is found at a crag.
Oh, "up" and "down" would probably be helpful too, considering he'll have to be climbing over rocks and trees, etc etc. 
Yeah I guess I rambled on there a little bit, but training a dog is a serious matter and misbehaved dogs are probably one of my biggest pet peaves.
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dingus
Feb 9, 2009, 10:14 PM
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Your crag dog needs to alert on pretty women. It should then peacefully sidle up to them, so they can oooh and ahhhh its pretty eyes and soft cuddly fur.
Then you swoop in for the kill, nawmean?
Ergo Man's Best Friend.
And Reno??? Hexes, tricams AND ovals all in one pic, merde! Hehe
Cheers
DMT
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reno
Feb 9, 2009, 10:19 PM
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ShibbyShane wrote: And PLEASE, don't be one of those people that uses treats to train their dogs. Treats are a last resort in my opinion and if you train them with treats you have to wean them off the treats, and they will always be more food-oriented than a dog that is trained w/o food. Think Cesar Milan vs. that chick from "It's Me or the Dog."
I sorta agree, sorta disagree. Using a treat can be a great help in training a dog, if used properly. You have to start to space the treats apart somewhat, and give them at irregular intervals to keep the training exciting. It's like a slot machine vs. a soda machine. The fun in the slots comes from the unexpected nature of the reward. If, however, you put a dollar in a soda machine and didn't get a soda two times in a row, you'd quit.
Treats also make "clicker training" much easier.
I don't treat every single time the dog does something right, but I will throw her a piece of boiled chicken or a snip of venison jerky once in a while, to keep it exciting and fun.
I agree with the rest of what you wrote, by the way. Especially the part about 10-15 minute sessions. "Short and often" when it comes to training sessions works best.
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reno
Feb 9, 2009, 10:21 PM
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dingus wrote: Your crag dog needs to alert on pretty women. It should then peacefully sidle up to them, so they can oooh and ahhhh its pretty eyes and soft cuddly fur.
Heh... I'm working on getting Casey to wink at girls.
In reply to: And Reno??? Hexes, tricams AND ovals all in one pic, merde! Hehe
Thanks, bro. Picture credit goes to our very own climbsomething. She snapped the pic at Mt. Lemmon a couple years back. It's one of my favorite pics.
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dynosore
Feb 9, 2009, 10:23 PM
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Aussies are a great dog. My wife had one she got as a kid and showed. It was the tricolor and ended up being a champion. She lived with us the first few years we were married. We put her down at 18! years old. You might have a friend for a long time.....
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altelis
Feb 9, 2009, 10:29 PM
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dynosore
Feb 9, 2009, 10:30 PM
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Get a clicker to train, and if you've not trained a dog before get in a reputable puppy kindergarten. Aussies are easily trainable, and smart.
The Kuvasz we had were an incredibly stubborn and protective breed, yet we worked hard, were consistent, and people that know the breed couldn't believe how well mannered and socialized they were. The only problem we ever had was when someone let their G. Shepherd run up, off leash, to our female and got in her face. She made short work of him! I miss my dogs, rest in peace you 2 
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ShibbyShane
Feb 9, 2009, 10:42 PM
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reno wrote: ShibbyShane wrote: And PLEASE, don't be one of those people that uses treats to train their dogs. Treats are a last resort in my opinion and if you train them with treats you have to wean them off the treats, and they will always be more food-oriented than a dog that is trained w/o food. Think Cesar Milan vs. that chick from "It's Me or the Dog." I sorta agree, sorta disagree. Using a treat can be a great help in training a dog, if used properly. You have to start to space the treats apart somewhat, and give them at irregular intervals to keep the training exciting. It's like a slot machine vs. a soda machine. The fun in the slots comes from the unexpected nature of the reward. If, however, you put a dollar in a soda machine and didn't get a soda two times in a row, you'd quit. Treats also make "clicker training" much easier. I don't treat every single time the dog does something right, but I will throw her a piece of boiled chicken or a snip of venison jerky once in a while, to keep it exciting and fun. I agree with the rest of what you wrote, by the way. Especially the part about 10-15 minute sessions. "Short and often" when it comes to training sessions works best.
Yeah, short and often is a good motto to use for dog training.
I do realize that food is a great motivator and I give dogs treats sometimes if I'm eating/cooking/what have you, but I'm definitely against using it as the first resort. And clicker training? Really? Then what happens if you don't have the clicker?
You're better off training the dog to key off of your voice or whistle (whistle is good because it's louder and can be heard from a greater distance). I guess I just don't like using anything you don't have with you at all times for training, whether it be food, a clicker, or whatever.
Your dog should do things because he wants to make you happy, not because you have food with you. It's the whole "pack system" where you're the alpha and he's the secondary or tertiary.
Blah blah blah, ramble ramble.
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