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blueeyedclimber
Oct 30, 2009, 3:23 PM
Post #26 of 35
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Registered: Nov 19, 2002
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dudemanbu wrote: blueeyedclimber wrote: Myxomatosis wrote: You turn up at a crag, no guide book, with a 50m rope. You accidently do choose a 60m sport route (so no trad gear). At a sport crag? A 60 m climb? NO such thing. Did you mean a 30 m climb, requiring a 60 m rope? In any case, lower to the lowest bolt you can. Climber clips in direct. Belayer goes off belay. Climber pulls rope, clips into leaver biner, belayer goes back on belay and then lowers. There are a couple other options as well, but I will let you figure them out. If you do indeed find a sport crag with 60 m climbs, let us know, so we can all bring our 120 m ropes.  Josh Jumbo love is almost 80 meters  But if you can climb that to nearly the top, i'd say your safest way off is to just ask the camera guy to rap down a little further to you and tie you in.
Dude, Jumbo Love is NOT a sport crag....it's an elite club that one person belongs to. Maybe two. Did Ethan Pringle send it?
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dudemanbu
Oct 30, 2009, 3:50 PM
Post #27 of 35
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Registered: Jun 3, 2005
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blueeyedclimber wrote: Dude, Jumbo Love is NOT a sport crag....it's an elite club that one person belongs to. Maybe two. Did Ethan Pringle send it?
Not to my knowledge, that thing is just plain insane. Between the absurdly long approach, and the actual climbing, I don't know if it will ever get a repeat.
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skinner
Oct 30, 2009, 7:59 PM
Post #28 of 35
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Registered: Nov 1, 2004
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You turn up at a crag, no guide book, with a 50m rope.
I dunno, I don't spurt climb, but just from the question/scenario I envision it going something like this.
The belayer, pulls out his BlackBerry, snaps a photo and posts it to rc.com asking wtf to do. After reading all the responses and realizing that not only do they not have anything to MacGyver the suggested solutions (and wtf is a prusik?), but they have never actually fallen more then a few inches (rope stretch really) and aren't about to start now. Just when they think their situation is all but hopeless and they are going to be late for supper for sure now.. the leader remembers the new gizmo hanging around his neck that his mom got him for his birthday. He fishes the *SPOT* personal emergency signaling device out from under his shirt and presses the panic button. Within minutes they can hear the sound of approaching sirens, helicopters, even a river rescue craft, and all heading in their direction. A huge and massively expensive rescue ensues.
The next morning, the cover of the local newspaper reveals a photo of the frightened pair wrapped in blankets, sipping hot chocolate while being comforted by a rescuer. Their parents launch several law suits against the park for allowing such a dangerous and unsupervised activity without proper signage and instructions bolted to the base of each climb, explicitly stating the exact gear, length of rope, grams of chalk required, etc., so that poor unsuspecting climbers never have to go through such a traumatic-horror filled experience as these two. The park decides it's easier to just close the entire area, ban all climbing in the park and subsequently turn it into a wilderness reserve. A new policy is adopted to directly charge those requiring rescue. To soften the expected initial reaction people will have towards the new billing policy, they announce a special discount offering where if you pre-register for this service using your visa card, you'll receive a 20% discount and a free t-shirt on your first rescue.
The End
(of climbing as we know it)
*Hint.. if you are pressed for time, just read the bold print.
(This post was edited by skinner on Oct 30, 2009, 8:59 PM)
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shimanilami
Oct 30, 2009, 8:31 PM
Post #29 of 35
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Registered: Jul 24, 2006
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1. Untie the knot behind your grigri.
2. Lower you partner until you're at the end of the rope.
3. Stand beneath your partner.
4. Let him drop.
5. Catch him. (10m is not that far.)
Foolproof, yo'.
(This post was edited by shimanilami on Oct 30, 2009, 8:32 PM)
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jeepnphreak
Oct 30, 2009, 10:02 PM
Post #30 of 35
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Myxomatosis wrote: Im not really a beginner nor have I ever had this problem but I was told a story of it happening and I was wondering what options you had. I have a few ideas but I dont think they would be considered very safe (but perhaps thats your only option) Heres the situation.. You turn up at a crag, no guide book, with a 50m rope. You accidently do choose a 60m sport route (so no trad gear). You are belaying your partner and you suddenly find yourself at end of the rope. You have tied a knot in the end (not to hard to see your nearly at the end, so quick thinking just in case), so its not going to pass through the belay device. You have only 2m's of slack since your climber took the whipper onto the bolt and climbed back up to the bolt (hanger) How would you get your partner to the ground? Here are the options of what gear you have.... 1. Prusik cord, few locking biners and your ATC (and anything else someone climbing sport might have close by on the ground) but say your partner has no PAS device or sling, just two quick draws. 2. Another 50m rope, some locking biners, partner still no PAS, just some draws. 3. Whats the minimum amount of gear you could use to get him down?
Actually he he. That happend to me about 7 years ago now.
We headed up to a local graig and found a new route that had been put up, so it was not in the guide books yet. I lead first. Tied in with my buddies 50m rope and climbed to the anchors, seemed like a long climb. couple of lockers on the anchors and yelled take and lower. 50 feet from the ground my friend yell up "were out of rope!". hold on a sec. he put on his climbing shoes and started climbing. when I got to the ground I took my ATC and belayed him to the anchor. then he yelled rope and droped the rope. About 5 minuts later my friend came joggin up the trail, grinning. "found a walk off".
later we discover that the route was called "keep it under 100". it was 99 feet tall. a 50M doubled up is only 75 feet. Yes we neede a longer rope.
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joewtc
Nov 1, 2009, 6:45 PM
Post #32 of 35
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Registered: Aug 27, 2009
Posts: 37
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Myxomatosis wrote: Im not really a beginner nor have I ever had this problem but I was told a story of it happening and I was wondering what options you had. I have a few ideas but I dont think they would be considered very safe (but perhaps thats your only option) Heres the situation.. You turn up at a crag, no guide book, with a 50m rope. You accidently do choose a 60m sport route (so no trad gear). You are belaying your partner and you suddenly find yourself at end of the rope. You have tied a knot in the end (not to hard to see your nearly at the end, so quick thinking just in case), so its not going to pass through the belay device. You have only 2m's of slack since your climber took the whipper onto the bolt and climbed back up to the bolt (hanger) How would you get your partner to the ground? Here are the options of what gear you have.... 1. Prusik cord, few locking biners and your ATC (and anything else someone climbing sport might have close by on the ground) but say your partner has no PAS device or sling, just two quick draws. 2. Another 50m rope, some locking biners, partner still no PAS, just some draws. 3. Whats the minimum amount of gear you could use to get him down?
I'd imagine in this scenario the people are climibng the first pitch of a multi-pitch (which's not uncommon to be over 50m).
The easier (hassle-less) solution is to seek help from climbers (who has a free available rope) nearby.
1. Stop climbing. Ask leader to clove hitch rope into the free available quickdraw and hang there (this releases tension on the rope in the belay system). You are still on belay.
2. Tie a double-fisherman knot to connect the extra rope to the end of your rope (the knot should pass through most quickdraws except the smallest models). The other climber puts the rope (behind the knot) on belay.
3. You can take off your belay (since the leader is now belayed by the helping climber)
4. Take up the slack in the belay system.
5. Leader take off the clove hitch and then get lowered down. During lowering, don't take away the draws, since they provice redunduncy in case the bolt being lowered off fails.
6. If the climb is over 50m and under 60m, borrow 2 60m ropes to climb back up to retrieve the draws.
If the knot is too big to pass through the draws, here are other solutions.
Scenario 1 (as you mentioned)
Gear List:
Leader: 2 Quickdraws
Belayer: Prusik cord, few locking biners and your ATC
1. Stop climbing.
2. Leader: clove hitch rope to 1 draw to hang there.
3. Leader: uses 2 draws (opposing), take a figure 8 with a bite from the rope between the clove hitch and your belayer and clip into these 2 draws. Now you ahve a zip line.
4. Grab a bite from the rope between the figure 8 and the belayer, tie a munter hitch and clip it to a draw to your harness. (now, the munter hitch and the clove hitch are both securing you)
5. Tie off the clove hitch, clip that biner into the munter hitch so your munter hitch has 2 opposing draws.
6. Now, leader just rappel down the route. When leader comes to a draw, just unclip, pass the knot and clip the draw back (don't remove any draws in the climb to provice redunduncy). Also, hold the rope above and below the munter hitch, just in case, the bolt being lowered off fails.
This method is even better if the leader has a prussik cord and extra biner to attach to the rope above the munter hitch to further secure the holding of the munter hitch.
7. Borrow 2 60m ropes to climb and retrieve draws.
Scenario 2 (as you mentioned)
same as the first solution.
3. I think it's good idea to always have 2 or a few extra locking carabiners, ATC and a prussik cord.
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joewtc
Nov 1, 2009, 6:47 PM
Post #33 of 35
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Registered: Aug 27, 2009
Posts: 37
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By the way, I find it very useful to acquire some basic rope rescus skills e.g. escape belay, passing the knot, hauling, rope solo, etc. through books, practice or courses. Maybe you already know them, just FYI.
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tradrenn
Nov 1, 2009, 7:26 PM
Post #34 of 35
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Registered: Jan 16, 2005
Posts: 2990
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A sling and TRT.
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qtm
Nov 3, 2009, 1:51 AM
Post #35 of 35
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Registered: Apr 8, 2004
Posts: 548
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Leader doesn't have a sling, just two draws.
Might be able to do a TRT with a dogbone, but might be tough pulling the rope through.
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