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drkodos
Apr 29, 2003, 10:20 PM
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In reply to: my B.C. is as good as I could want.
and that's the point. What you want. And after all that BS you spewed about respecting other people's wishes, you drop guard and admit, it's all about what the Dog owner's want.
I don't expect Dog-bringers to be able to see their own self-indulgent patterns.
Just bringing the animal out into the climbing environment is an infringement upon other people. Period.
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drkodos
Apr 29, 2003, 10:27 PM
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I think it interesting too that many dog lovers seem to have rather unstable relationships with other humans. Most admit it freely, often commenting on how "true" their friendship is and how "less judgemental" their "loyal" pet is.
This seems exacerbated at the cliffs when people bring their dogs because the whole message of bringing the dog is that it is more important than the rest of the humans on site!
I'd like to see a dog rationalizer really explain in some form of untwisted logic how a dog brings something to the experience.....to someone other than the owner themselves.
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cruntley
Apr 29, 2003, 10:28 PM
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I have a black lab who is great at the crags. I'd say get a female and train it well. Females are less likely to piss on stuff than males. Train them as a puppy not to bark and whine, expose them to other dogs and people and you should be fine.
If you can't get your dog to behave at a crag, then leave them at home. The first time I tried to take mine she tried to climb up after me. Once she figured out that I came back down, she just chills out by the gear all day.
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dirko
Apr 29, 2003, 10:34 PM
Post #29 of 132
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I would never bring my dog to the crag. It just does not jive with low-impact climbing. Love your dog, but leave him at home.
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repete
Apr 29, 2003, 10:40 PM
Post #30 of 132
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the best crag dog is the one that doesnt chew threw your rope.
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renobdarb
Apr 29, 2003, 10:42 PM
Post #31 of 132
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In reply to: Here is what I'm seeing,,,,, Dogs crap every where, they eat peoples food, they run around happy, they get in peoples way, they make other people angry, and they chase away wildlife. Well funny as it is, People do the same Sh*t.
I personally have never seen a dude walk up to my rope bag, whip it out, and piss all over my gear. A dog did that, once. Its hippy-owner didn't see what his dog did because he was either too stoned or just didn't care. All he said was, "Awww, dude... i'm sorry..." and walked off... One of my biggest pet peeves is misbehaved dogs, especially at the crag. do everyone a favor: if you must bring your dog, keep it leashed up and pick up it's crap.
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climbsomething
Apr 29, 2003, 10:56 PM
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A mellow mutt pup is probably best. But whatever you do, NO SIBERIAN HUSKIES at the crags.
I am a reformed husky owner. I still love my husky, who is a dear to play with at home or in the dog park, but she's a terrible crag dog. I've learned this the hard way, and there may be some people around here who know me and Tilly who can vouch for that! :oops:
Huskies are awesome, but they are NOT exactly "chill." They have a roaming, exploratory, stubborn instinct. They like to get in the trash and tear off to points unknown. Mine hates being tied up, because she is so high energy and curious that she is dying to scope out the whole area (like, a 10 mile perimeter!) Many also have a prey drive (mine has exhibited one with small birds and lizards), so even though they are friendly with people and other dogs, they could ruin somebody's day by executing a hapless nearby squirrel or rabbit. She has also given people the wrong impression by happily running over to them and trying to wrassle- she's incredibly silly and nice, but she looks somewhat wolfish, which scares some people.
Tilly is a sweet dog, silly and bubbly and protective of my cat, and she does a great job alerting me to people approaching the house. But she is just not cut out for the crags. I could go into training overload and basically completely de-program her so she can suit my climbing needs, but nah. She's an enjoyable dog enough on her own, as long as she's in a setting that won't get her into trouble, such as the crags. I just leave her at home when I go out climbing, and play with her at home. She pleases easily with a 6-block walk in our neighborhood- no epics!
That said, I am not anti-crag dog if your dog is cool. A nice quiet obedient pal who doesn't mine being pet by strangers, who won't get into noisy dog fights or snap at other people, and who will just sit there calmly while you do your thing. A lot of people have great hiking/climbing dogs that they have a great relationship with, and I enjoy those kinda pooches at the crags. But don't go into denial if your dog turns out to be a spaz. This is why you aren't likely to meet my Tilly-dawg at the crags anytime soon ;)
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sspssp
Apr 29, 2003, 11:13 PM
Post #33 of 132
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In reply to: Get a dog because you want love it. Don't leave it at the bottom of a climb with strangers. Ever. I listened to a dog moan for 3 hours at the foot of Cat in the Hat at Redrocks this March and watched two get into a barking match in the Dark Corridor. I felt so sorry for the dogs. Don't do that.
I totally agree with this. However, my neighbor's dog does the exact same thing when the owner is at work. I also feel sorry for the dog (and myself when I have to listen to it). If your dog is going to bother someone by whining all day, then please keep it with you.
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calpolyclimber
Apr 29, 2003, 11:19 PM
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Registered: Nov 26, 2002
Posts: 360
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Can't go wrong with a Golden Retriever.
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baldguy
Apr 29, 2003, 11:26 PM
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I'm the happy servant of a perfect dog. I got him 9 years ago from the Humane Society in Columbus, Oh. He's a totally chill mutt, doesn't whine when he can't see me, never gets into the garbage or pees on anything he isn't supposed to, gets along with our cat, is fine with other dogs, hangs out in camp when we take him along (doesn't wander too far), all that. I even get to bring him to work with me because he's so mellow and everybody loves him. (You can see a pic here, Yahoo ID required...)
With that said, I would never take him to the crags. I'm reasonably sure that, while he may enjoy being outside and "one of the crew", he's more comfy at home on the couch. Also, I don't know what it's like in your area, but most of the State/Nat'l Parks within a drive for me prohibit dogs on trails...may be something else to check into.
Another thing to keep in mind, that I didn't think about when I went to the Humane Society 9 years ago, is that a dog is pretty much just like having a kid. At least if you love them they way you should. I've given up trips, eliminated women from my life, left parties early and had a hard time finding an apartment all due to my pooch. And that doesn't even mention all the puk-/chew-/poop-/fart-/lick-ing that comes along with a dog. It's a big responsibility, just think about it a lot and, if you're sure, go for it and say goodbye to your heart.
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wallrat
Apr 29, 2003, 11:35 PM
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YOW, that stirred things up! I'm all for keeping things mellow at the crags...but a good dog to me is better than a bad human, and we all create an impact...the "lowest impact" is if we ALL stay home. You're there because you want to be...why would it be any different for anyone else? I don't expect anyone else to improve my climbing experience, nor do I want my pooch to fock up theirs (I've been on that end of it too).
I've had people crash my campsites, steal my gear, play loud music too late, etc. That doesn't make them all bad. Couldn't it be the same for dogs? Does anyone suggest that we keep everyone else (people) away from our crag because they might be "offensive"?
Would my tied up, quiet dog be worse than some loudmouths down the crag with Metallica on their blaster, or 35 Boy Scouts camping on the route you want to do? I just think we all have a right to be there, and if we try to minimize our impact there's room enough for all. Anyway that's just my thoughts.
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enigma
Apr 29, 2003, 11:54 PM
Post #38 of 132
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Registered: May 19, 2002
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Maybe a stuffed animal that looks like a dog!!!! :shock: :P
Well I've heard Blue Heelers, Climb very well and are loyal by a hard-man climber, if you really can't live without a dog. 8) :?
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grigriese
Apr 29, 2003, 11:58 PM
Post #39 of 132
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Good dogs are great to have around at the crag. Dogs that beg, pee on gear, never stop barking and are crotch sniffers are just plain annoying! I take my dog with me whenever I can, but understand that some people don't like dogs and some places are just inappropriate to take a dog. Try to be mindful with whatever dog you get, socialize and train 'em well. My dog is an Aussi mix, from the pound and he's wonderful. And the people that don't like dogs, there will always be something to piss them off.
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freezerfrost
Apr 30, 2003, 12:02 AM
Post #40 of 132
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oscar meyer
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styndall
Apr 30, 2003, 12:43 AM
Post #42 of 132
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That's an ugly fuggin dog.
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milodog13
Apr 30, 2003, 12:53 AM
Post #43 of 132
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Registered: Oct 12, 2002
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Labs without a doubt. They are very easy to train and with a stick to chew on, he will be just as happy to chew the stick then to follow you all over the place and get in the way..
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quietseas
Apr 30, 2003, 1:05 AM
Post #44 of 132
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Registered: Nov 2, 2002
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One that drinks beer and eats pizza. That way, it fits in well with the other climbers. :lol:
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madriver
Apr 30, 2003, 2:37 AM
Post #45 of 132
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Registered: Oct 17, 2001
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While not small I have a Bernise Mountain Dog. They typically do not:
Bark
Run Off
Bite
Bother people
They Do:
Stay near you
Very Freindly
Can Scramble fairly well
Will hang out all day (and not complain)
Can carry stuff (with a dog pack)
and are just way cool! They can get pretty big. But their personality is the best.
MR
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aimeerose
Apr 30, 2003, 3:20 AM
Post #46 of 132
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Registered: Jan 21, 2003
Posts: 574
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We have a lab/golden retriever mix. She is a PERFECT crag dog. Better behaved than some people. People usually remember her rather than us cause she's so sweet (you might have met her, she loves pinecones).
She does not:
Bark or whine
Crap or piss near the crags (if we're someplace like the Gallery she will wait til we leave to even pee!)
Eat human food
Chew on ropes
Bite people
Fight with other dogs
It's not the dog often times, but the owner. Our dog was trained since the day we brought her home. Dogs need discipline. That's why hippy's dogs are the worst. They don't believe in disciplining their dogs. That's just stupid.
We also don't bring her when we do multi-pitch routes. I just don't think it's nice to leave a dog tied up when you can't do anything if something happened to it.
I think you dog haters need to have more open minds. It's like thinking all boulders are rude because the ones at the Pit campground in Bishop play their music loud and late at night.
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onelung
Apr 30, 2003, 4:27 AM
Post #47 of 132
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Registered: Dec 8, 2002
Posts: 436
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I love dogs, and I will get one as soon as I can find one that will follow me around and pick up my crap!
Any hints?
Bill
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tori
Apr 30, 2003, 4:40 AM
Post #48 of 132
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Registered: Feb 23, 2003
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i'm a big time dog lover, but i must agree that you should be able to take care of the dog at all times, if you have an odd person out who can look after the dog that is great, but i don't think you can belay safely and look after your dog if a bigger dog or what ever comes along and starts something etc... there are just too many factors going on at most crags, half the time i can't even keep the hikers off my rope, let alone control a dog at the same time. and multipitch climbs have the obvious problem of leaving you dog alone where it is vulnerable to all of the above. of course mellow dogs are easier to handle, but you never know what can happen in the outdoor environment and you should be able to care for the pet at all times. muts and mixes are great, true mellow behavior is harder to predict by breed i think. my husky mix is a spaz and does not go to regular crags, only if i am going to a very obscure spot and we have three people doing single pitch stuff. good luck, dogs are fantastic.
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bolthappy
Apr 30, 2003, 4:48 AM
Post #49 of 132
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Registered: Apr 23, 2003
Posts: 43
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Whats a good crag dog? The dog that you leave at home to watch your crib while your climbing, instead of pack'n it with you to the crag to bug your climbing partners and make for dangerous situations. Did you come to climb or walk the dog? BUMBLYS and there dogs :roll:
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mr_phelps
Apr 30, 2003, 4:54 AM
Post #50 of 132
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Registered: Sep 11, 2002
Posts: 112
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I think it's called a Basenji, why is it a good crag dog? Because it doesn't bark. It still shits though, if you could find a dog that is quiet and doesn't crap all over, then there' your answer. Better yet, don't bring a dog to a crag, there is really no point
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