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docontherock
Nov 14, 2005, 1:21 AM
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My 2 cents..... climbing at J-Tree will wear out your $60 Prana's in a weekend. Carharrts however..... Anyway, it's a little known fact that the entire worlds economy, including all climbing apperall companies, is controlled by a group of five families known only as.... the pentaverum.... :shock: :shock:
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jules
Nov 14, 2005, 3:23 AM
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With regards to thrift store climbing pants:
That's great for guys, where pants are cut in a rather functional manner, but it's a whole different story for the girls (particularly at 5'4" and 90#).
My proportions prevent nearly any pair of men's or boys' pants from coming close to fitting me, and pants made for women are almost always several of the following:
-so tight your legs can spread about 10 degrees
-cut so the waist is at your tits
-huge in the butt and/or hips
-far too tight at the ankles to roll up
-dress pants (usually one or more of the above)
-athletic pants.
this is really not intended to support prana in any way. I think the prices are fugging ridiculous and disproportionate to the quality. the stuff I own was prodealed at 50% or employee-purchased at 35% off clearance. however; it DOES fit. i have to give them that.
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jamming_man
Nov 14, 2005, 5:20 AM
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In reply to: Itīs the same "problem" with every extreme sport/lifestyle brand. Take Billabong and Reef for example; both originally surfer oriented production lines. Then non-surfing people started buying their stuff a lot. ...
You forgot Hollister. although....it started out aiming at non surfers...anyway...bleh.
Prana is overpriced . <==big period
There are other pants available that feel just as nice, last twice as long and are 4 times cheaper. Ross has $hit loads of stuff. I know...i know... not the most popular place for hip clothes but you can find a nice comfy pair to thrash for under fifteen bucks. ... beat that prAna. I'll give you this though... prAna does look sweet...I don't wear it cuz i can't afford it, but for those of you that can, power to you.
In My opinion, Popular culture is the drive behind this $60 pants frenzy. Not only is it just like any other pair of warm pants i've seen and owned and enjoyed greatly, i feel i'd stop respecting myself a little bit as a climber if i wear them. This is because the huge prAna logo seems to announce.." Im a climber people, please look at me and walk away in awe as you realize how badass i am" I am so used to respecting my clothes, that i could not wear a pair of pants that cost me 7.5 hours of my life to go rolling around in all sorts of $hit. I'd probably worry about every fu@king spot. :?
Id also like to say this, : The fact that Hollister and billabong are now mainstream clothing CO. no self respecting surfer will wear them.I think prAna might be heading the same way. I live in CA dude and , like totally , every surfer thrashes on those guys dude. It's hella rad.
All in all, I agree with all the people that say bussiness is business and if you think you need $60 pants to be be comfortable, go for it. The only thing i pretty much added to this thread is there is non technical outfiters clothing out there that will cost much less and do the trick just fine . <==big period
oh...sry . The thread is about Liz aquiring th CO. not the fact that its absolutely unnecessary. I guess i just dont care. ...Good for her!
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t-dog
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Nov 14, 2005, 5:35 AM
Post #54 of 112
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: What are some US manufacturers that still make their own stuff and haven't "sold-out"? Who are some other small time gear makers are out there keeping it local? I feel bad giving money away to the overseas big boys every time I go to REI. Chris Think VERVE :wink: or Blurr (granted, they're from Canadia and all, but still...) So Verve is from Canada? You better tell that to Boulder Co. I don't think they know yet! :oops: |
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lajhanata
Nov 14, 2005, 4:35 PM
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There's a lot of talk about yuppies who don't climb being posers. For me it seems the opposite. Lots of other people wearing the same clothes I do will make me seem like less of a poser. I think the people that are afraid of their trademark brands going mainstream because it has an effect on their identity are the real posers here. I'd just as soon people didn't know I climbed. I don't think people are paying that close of attention anyway.
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rockkid55
Nov 14, 2005, 4:46 PM
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I hope they come out with a line of funny print-tees.
Hmm....
"Climbers Like It On The Rocks"
"Climb On You Crazy Diamond"
"I Heart Climber Boys"
"I Heart Climber Girls"
"Kiss Me, I'm A Climber!"
sweeeet.
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cfnubbler
Nov 14, 2005, 5:04 PM
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In reply to: What are some US manufacturers that still make their own stuff and haven't "sold-out"?
Wild Things. Pure function for people that actually climb, made in NH. Not really the same market as cragging / yoga clothes, but for winter and alpine climbing clothing, they are FAN-FREAKIN' TASTIC. Superb climbing packs too.
-Nubbler
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rock_ninja
Nov 14, 2005, 5:07 PM
Post #58 of 112
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And lastly, who cares? Prana has one purpose: To make a profit. Good for them. I'm in college and wear Prana everyday. I've even got some climbers wearing them when not climbing. And I wear them because a) they are comfortable b) they look sweet c) when I go to buy I new pair I don't have to try em on, just grab a medium from the rack and I'm set and d) my parents pay for them.
OK, Except for the "my parents pay for it" part, good call. Listen you've got to wear something on your ass. I have done the thrift store thing for years and years, but suddenly, i was thrust into adulthood and a job that i love, which requires me to wear decent clothing. So why not support a company who is dedicated to all the things that represent my ethics- such as Patagonia and prAna? Would you rather shop at the Gap or Banana Republic? Prana and Patagonia clothes have better design and fit, and are pretty comparable in price, with a much better business model and community ethic.
Also, you never have to pay full price for stuff, and if you do, you're a tool.
Finally, you don't have to fully play into the corporate culture when you buy brands like these. When I climb, I stop by the local outfitters- big favs of mine are Rock and Snow (I think that's the name of it) in New Paltz at The Gunks and Waterstone at The New River Gorge. They're almost always having a sale on something. This weekend, I stopped into Waterstone at the New River Gorge-- fantiastic local shop, having a sale. These are often the stores that are affiliated with the local access funds and have all the good beta on climbing, and it's worth our supporting them to see that stuff stay around.
Listen, like it or not, we're all materialistic. So just be conscious about how you consume, and you can avoid the whole white guilt thing that so many of you chastising the bobo/prAna wearing crowds seem to have. Get over it, wear some awesome clothes and most importantly go and climb!
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hosh
Nov 15, 2005, 12:39 AM
Post #59 of 112
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In reply to: In reply to: I can just as easily climb in Carhartt's ... YEAH BUDDY! Lets hear if for the Cah-haahts!!! Damn near everyone I know in Maine that climbs, climbs in Carhartts... I'm even wearing a pair now! Jim
yup. lots of AK climbers in carhartts. that's what I climb in almost all the time.
hosh.
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hosh
Nov 15, 2005, 1:03 AM
Post #60 of 112
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In reply to: Dont you think the attitude of I dont want non-climbers or poseurs wearing prAna a bit elitist? -wolfemom
I can see it now...
some where, on another thread on www.industrialworkers.com, some one is ranting about how
"Climbers are starting to wear Carhartts!! don't they know that Carhartts are 'work' pants, not climbing pants?!?!"
and in another fourm, on www.vintagestyle.com,
"I just heard a climber saying that he gets his climbing pants from the thrift store! The nerve! don't they know that thrift store shopping is only for the super hip vintage crowd? Man, how lame..."
And on www.yuppies.com, there's this thread about,
"Man, Liz Clairborne finally bought prAna. Those Climbers and yogis were starting to think that prAna was making clothes for them! It's about time that our clothing company is owned by our people..."
and here we are in our little Narcissistic RC.com world, thinking that prAna is "our" company...
hosh.
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crimpstrength
Nov 15, 2005, 1:18 AM
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The article said prana was in debt, something like 1.9 million dollars. If someone didn't take it, what are the chances of it surviving anyway?
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rvega
Nov 15, 2005, 1:23 AM
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In reply to: oh well, they were overpriced and trendy already. not nearly as pissed as Columbia buying Mtn Hardware... Jim
No wonder my new tent's not as good as the first one I got some 10 years ago. Crap.
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roy_hinkley_jr
Nov 15, 2005, 1:45 AM
Post #64 of 112
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In reply to: The article said prana was in debt, something like 1.9 million dollars. If someone didn't take it, what are the chances of it surviving anyway?
Umm, they sold for $34 million and turned down higher offers because Liz was a better fit, so to speak. Prana was doing fine and will continue to do even better.
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toml
Nov 16, 2005, 1:58 PM
Post #65 of 112
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In reply to: The article said prana was in debt, something like 1.9 million dollars. If someone didn't take it, what are the chances of it surviving anyway?
Liz C paid $32.5m for 60% of the initial valuation, implying the value of the company was somewhere around $50+ million. That's like saying that those people were lucky to sell that $500,000 house because it was 'in debt' for $19,000. You know, like a $19,000 mortgage.
What is the interest rate on debt now? $1.9m at, say, 10% interest, which is a lot, would be $190,000 a year.
I clicked further on the article to find Liz C's financials and they have a 6.68% profit margin. Assuming that's a typical profit margin on clothes, and that prAna is similar and has nearly $30m in sales like the article says, that would mean prAna makes $2m in profit after taxes every year. ($6 on a $90 pair of pants.) So they could easily afford to pay the interest, even if their profitability is way lower than Liz Claiborne's.
How many climbers out there make $50m doing something related to climbing? Shouldn't we be celebrating the fact that SOMEBODY did it - it's possible? Otherwise, considering how little most of us make trying to make money in climbing, it would be a lost cause.
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kyote321
Nov 16, 2005, 2:19 PM
Post #66 of 112
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'How many climbers out there make $50m doing something related to climbing? Shouldn't we be celebrating the fact that SOMEBODY did it - it's possible?'
prana isn't climbing, or even oga, it is about putting a strategically placed tag in the small o four butt so people will look at it and know that our butt is worth at least $60, at least today.
wanna invest in climbing companies? buy stock in 'tastey bite.'
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climbjunk
Nov 16, 2005, 2:53 PM
Post #67 of 112
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Posts: 56
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If you want some down to earth clothing still owned by real climber(s): BUY VERVE!!
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rock_ninja
Nov 16, 2005, 3:54 PM
Post #68 of 112
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In reply to: 'How many climbers out there make $50m doing something related to climbing? Shouldn't we be celebrating the fact that SOMEBODY did it - it's possible?' prana isn't climbing, or even oga, it is about putting a strategically placed tag in the small o four butt so people will look at it and know that our butt is worth at least $60, at least today. wanna invest in climbing companies? buy stock in 'tastey bite.'
Do you mean those Indian food pouches? This is the most brilliant idea ever. I swear, they've raised my climbing three grades.
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landgolier
Nov 16, 2005, 4:05 PM
Post #69 of 112
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In reply to: 'How many climbers out there make $50m doing something related to climbing? Shouldn't we be celebrating the fact that SOMEBODY did it - it's possible?' prana isn't climbing, or even oga, it is about putting a strategically placed tag in the small o four butt so people will look at it and know that our butt is worth at least $60, at least today. wanna invest in climbing companies? buy stock in 'tastey bite.'
DING! We have a winner.
I love the people who are like, "I can't find anything else that's comfortable that provides enough freedom of movement blah blah blah." If only someone made loose fitting cotton pants with tighter ankles to keep you from stepping on them when edging, and made them in a variety of weights and colors, and sold them for like $8 at every walmart, dollar store, target, sports authority, and old navy in the universe. I bet they could call them....SWEAT PANTS!
Oh, and if you think the ecological practices of a consumer products company matter for anything other than marketing and soothing the yuppie egos of the consumer, you're a dumbass.
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kyote321
Nov 16, 2005, 4:14 PM
Post #70 of 112
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'Do you mean those Indian food pouches? This is the most brilliant idea ever. I swear, they've raised my climbing three grades. '
word. wanna feel good about waht you buy while climbing and pay 1.38 (trader ho's price), then buy tastey bite, straight from 'poor people' in india. keeps ya regular on a road trip too. feel bad about throwign the metal puch away, but oh well.
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taraclimb
Nov 16, 2005, 5:08 PM
Post #71 of 112
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First, Prana IS trendy. When people start getting tattoos of the Prana logo, it's officially a trend (and yes.. I've seen it).
But the clothes are comfortable and they look decent. (Which is more than I can say for some climbing brands)
If Clairborne doesn't change the comfort and durability of the clothes, it may be a good thing. Prana clothes may become more affordable for climbers.
Until then, I can't bring myself to pay $80 for a pair of pants I'm going to rip on the rock.. so it's back to the sales rack for me..
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angry
Nov 16, 2005, 5:18 PM
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Grammicci
Prana
North Face
A5
Metolius
Black Diamond
All are brands I've never seen the value in owning. My Kavu's ($20) are sporting patches after a really fucking hard year for them. I finally blew out my Carharts ($18 on sale) this month after several years, but it took "The Sender" to do it. Both are far thicker than anything Prana makes, and a wee bit cheaper.
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localshredder
Nov 16, 2005, 5:58 PM
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The Owner of Prana, also owns No Fear And Spy Optic. He doesn't care about climbing he cares about money.
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rock_ninja
Nov 16, 2005, 6:22 PM
Post #74 of 112
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In reply to: 'Do you mean those Indian food pouches? This is the most brilliant idea ever. I swear, they've raised my climbing three grades. ' word. wanna feel good about waht you buy while climbing and pay 1.38 (trader ho's price), then buy tastey bite, straight from 'poor people' in india. keeps ya regular on a road trip too. feel bad about throwign the metal puch away, but oh well.
I actually like to eat tasty bite while wearing praNa- the sweatshop street version of prAna.
Seriously, I wear prAna; I never pay full price for it, and I love it. I mix and match em with my trendy thrift store clothes- yep, that's right. All you kids who ostensibly eschew the trendiness of prAna are really just another form of trend follower. Just get over it, put on some clothes, eat some tasty bite and climb!
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rock_ninja
Nov 16, 2005, 6:27 PM
Post #75 of 112
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In reply to: Grammicci Prana North Face A5 Metolius Black Diamond All are brands I've never seen the value in owning. My Kavu's ($20) are sporting patches after a really f---ing hard year for them. I finally blew out my Carharts ($18 on sale) this month after several years, but it took "The Sender" to do it. Both are far thicker than anything Prana makes, and a wee bit cheaper.
So do you climb without cams? Metolius and BD make some of the best trad gear out there, and you never hear trad climbers walking around saying "Oh, that guy with the #4 Camalot is just such a poser".
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