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rockprodigy
Sep 12, 2005, 4:00 AM
Post #51 of 62
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Registered: Sep 10, 2002
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In reply to: In reply to: I you want to make money at this, you have to target the average climber, and that means "tech tips", "gear guides" "ask masterbater" and, yes, even stupid, ditzy interviews of scott cory, joe kinder and tori allen. No, they don't. I don't know a single friend that has a subscription to the standard magazines. Not one. I know plenty of people who have a subscription to the Alpinist.
That's my point! We aren't the target of the mainstream rags...we're climbers! They target frat boys and midlife crisis weekend warriors. That's where the money is! There aren't enough of the "hard core" climbers to support a magazine on the basis of good content...especially when many of those climbers would rather sit in their local shop and read the articles than shell out for a copy.
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docontherock
Sep 12, 2005, 4:04 AM
Post #52 of 62
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Registered: Mar 6, 2004
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: I you want to make money at this, you have to target the average climber, and that means "tech tips", "gear guides" "ask masterbater" and, yes, even stupid, ditzy interviews of scott cory, joe kinder and tori allen. No, they don't. I don't know a single friend that has a subscription to the standard magazines. Not one. I know plenty of people who have a subscription to the Alpinist. That's my point! We aren't the target of the mainstream rags...we're climbers! They target frat boys and midlife crisis weekend warriors. That's where the money is! There aren't enough of the "hard core" climbers to support a magazine on the basis of good content...especially when many of those climbers would rather sit in their local shop and read the articles than shell out for a copy.
I hope you're wrong.... Printed in China or not it's the best mag out there.
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happiegrrrl
Sep 12, 2005, 4:41 AM
Post #53 of 62
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Registered: Mar 25, 2004
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I devour reading material, and am fortunate to have disposable income(or am lacking in fiduciary responsibility....whatever)....that allows me to purchase damned near all the climbing magazines. Every few months I take the pile down to the rock gym I have a membership at, and they now have a nice little "library" for those who are so inclined to take advantage.
Alpinist is an exceptional magazine. Without any doubt, the best of all that is out there. But the fact is, the market is small, and the magazine quality is high. It is a well made magazine, and it's demise will be our loss.
It's so easy to complain and criticize. How many of us, who bitch about story content, have ever gone through the effort of actually creating a written piece and submitting the work to a publisher? We bitch about photography, but ......don't we notice just a weee difference in the quality of these photos in comparison to ours? I try to have a little bit of appreciation for the incredible amounts of work involved in bringing creative works to the public domain. Maybe it's because I've made my own little efforts, and I know just how fucking hard it really is to show up, do the work, put it out there, face rejection, be available for the criticism, and then go back to the thing the next day and start anew. I know that most would disagree, but I don't think my $10, or whatever it costs, buys me a ticket to be so cavalier.
On the other topic, I was also intrigued by the Fontainbleu article; but then the history of climbing, to me, is a very important part of the deal. I like the sense of camaraderie I find in climbing nearly as much as the actual climbing, and have been fortunate to meet some of those who have upped the ante in the thing. The incredible thing about climbing is - if you really are in it, even just the littlest bit, you WILL run across these people as you go about the business of climbing. I think it's kind of nice to have just a small iota of understanding for exactly what these people I'm talking to have done, instead of thinking "who's this(insert quirky characteristic)."
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montaniero
Sep 12, 2005, 11:07 AM
Post #54 of 62
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Registered: Jul 1, 2004
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In reply to: Sad that new climbers have such little appreciation for history. Those who scoff at the Bleau article just show their ignorance.
Unfortunately, absolutely true. Some of the best french alpinists of all time started as Bleusards. The link between the Boulders of Fountainbleu and the Aiguilles of Mont Blanc Massif is unquestionable.
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nowinowski
Sep 12, 2005, 12:45 PM
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Posts: 134
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my favorite thing about the alpinist is not having to pay to take shiiit from Matt Samet and his crew of flunkie elitists.
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cracklover
Sep 12, 2005, 1:35 PM
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Registered: Nov 14, 2002
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In reply to: In reply to: .....By the way, do you know what a tenet is? How about a malopropism? Just teasing - carry on! GO It's "mal apropism." WTF? This site is going directly to hell. Haha. Curt
My beef is not with typos and occasional spelling lapses (but thank you for pointing mine out - I won't quickly forget that one.)
1 - Either a thing is worth the price for you, based on your personal finances, or it is not. Personally, I could afford a subscription to Rock & Ice, Climbing, and Alpine magazine, all at once. But I feel much the same about magazines as I do about sporting events - they're nice to look at once in a while, and I don't think badly of people who like them a lot - but they're not something I want or need. If you really like them, you will spend the money gladly, however much you need to scrimp to do so.
2 - Words you get confused with other words are best left out of your writing, or used with care. CB22 - you're in good company with John Long - who's a fabulous writer, and makes some un-intended funnies sometimes (shame on his editors!)
3 - If you have a choice of ground on which to make an argument, choose the ground upon which you have the upper hand.
GO
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ambler
Sep 12, 2005, 1:45 PM
Post #58 of 62
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Registered: Jul 27, 2002
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In reply to: It's so easy to complain and criticize. How many of us, who b---- about story content, have ever gone through the effort of actually creating a written piece and submitting the work to a publisher? We b---- about photography, but ......don't we notice just a weee difference in the quality of these photos in comparison to ours?
In reply to: Printed in China or not it's the best mag out there. |
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stabla
Sep 18, 2005, 7:09 AM
Post #59 of 62
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Registered: Apr 29, 2005
Posts: 139
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To the rest of you bitching about Alpinist: Every now and then, someone comes up with a quality idea, and has the balls to put it in action. Outside magazine started much the same with literature instead of shit articles, but they gave in to the pressure to be everything to everyone. As I undertand, they (Alpinist) have been BLEEEDING cash, and are trying to keep their heads above water. If that includes printing overseas, so be it. Most of the people bitching won't buy a subscription, much less PAY MORE, god forbid, to keep the printing in the US (nor will most ever come close to the type of route the girl bailed on).
If you appreciate even half of what they are trying to do: quality photos, quality articles (even if you disagree with the dope, Rodden, Fontainebleu or the photo of the girl on 11) and not stooping to the least common denominator, support the mag. Will every issue be perfect? No, but if you prefer to be a poser and buy Climbing or Outside to prove how cool you are, then you can expect quality mags to not stick around.
I hope they last long enough for me to get every issue I subscribed to. I'd even pay twice for the same subscription to get their kind of quality.
..i agree with this statement made earlier, this magazine brings back the prestige of climbing, as opposed to fucking urban climber@!@ Terrible magazine.
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simplistic
Sep 18, 2005, 8:38 AM
Post #60 of 62
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I have read a number of the previous posts and feel inclined to add my two cents too this argument. First and foremost you only kringe once when you purchase quality. Alpinist is quality, and if that were enough then we would not be having this discussion. Alpinist is the Surfers Journal of the climbing world, unfortunatley for those at Alpinist the number of surfers far out numbers that of climbers. The fact that they outsource to China for production is not a suprise, even if they could not produce enough magazines to meet the demand of their customers, they would still go there simply because they can. It is the western way, produce for less sell for more. I believe the result is called profit, and if I remember correctly, it is neccesary today to survive whether you are making mags or flipping burgers. Bottom Line. Compound the basic economics with the meager market, that so many others have brought up, and of course they are going to China. Everyone is going to china, in every industry, energy, technology, forest products. Why should production of a magazine be any different. I agree with the post that made the comment that those that can truly appreciate the quality that Alpinist provides is a miniscule percentage of the market, simply because the number of climbers that can really relate to the stories told in their magaqzine is minute. The majority of climbers are not heading to far corners of the world to put up first ascents or living out of trash bins to feed themselves. They are hard working individuals trying to feed themselves, their families, and if their lucky, save enough pennies to head to the crag or the hills for a few weeks a year. If that is indeed the life of the climber(it is my guess, because it is like me and those I meet while in the hills) then when it comes down to it, I would rather purchase a new cam, a tank of gas, a extra case of beer, or a dinner for my female friend than buy a magazine. This is not a hack on the mag because it is great, it is just my point of view that those at Alpinist, if they are hurtin for cash, must have known the challenge they were getting themselves into. Simply because to produce a mag of that quality requires at least enough competence to see the big picture, which they do I am sure. This being the case they knew what they were getting into, and that said: good luck to Alpinist. Keep on, keeping on.
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crossfit2
Sep 18, 2005, 1:42 PM
Post #61 of 62
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Registered: Jun 12, 2004
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This isnt anything that hasnt been said before but I find the writing and photography in Alpinist superb. I am not that into bouldering (too weak!) but found myself drawn to the article on Font due to the fact that the author(s) wove in so many tertiary threads (alpinism,ww2,clubs,etc..) which seems to be the norm in their articles. If they need to save money by printing offshore, so be it. I dont think that the poor print quality noted has any bearing on where the printing was done. Any number of factors could have attributed to this but more than likely you received a copy that was produced near the beginning of a run when registration was getting dialed in.
Due to the financial state of Alpinist I see no issue with them not passing cost savings garnered by off shore printing to the consumer. From what I understand they need all the help that they can get.
If you DO have a specific issue with poor print quality drop them a line. I am sure they will rectify it. It is not the norm to send out ramp up batches of product while the process is getting set up. QC should have caught it but perhaps that is one of the downsides of not being hands on in the printing process.
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johngenx
Sep 18, 2005, 11:41 PM
Post #62 of 62
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Registered: Sep 18, 2005
Posts: 45
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MEC and ACC members can save a few bucks on their subscriptions.
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