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rrrADAM
Dec 8, 2006, 8:25 AM
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This forum was viewable by guests just a couple days ago, as I was browsing it when not logged in, but now it is hidden to guests, and only visible to those logged in. This means that someone has set this forum to that status on purpose through the Admin Panel, so I am curious as to the reason for this.
The S&F Forum is viewable to guests at dz.com, and it was here just a coupe days ago, and I don't see anything in here worthy of 'hiding', so what is the reasoning for proactively hiding this forum from guests ???
(This post was edited by rrradam on Dec 8, 2006, 8:26 AM)
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thomasribiere
Dec 8, 2006, 9:37 AM
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Lurker!
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thomasribiere
Dec 8, 2006, 10:17 AM
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Yeah? Maybe because only the persons who take part in the site ie the registered users should be able to voice their opinion. Not completely absurd. Not absolutely necessary.
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rrrADAM
Dec 8, 2006, 12:00 PM
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thomasribiere wrote: Yeah? Maybe because only the persons who take part in the site ie the registered users should be able to voice their opinion. Not completely absurd. Not absolutely necessary.
Are you kidding ??? Do they still discourage critical thought in France these days ???
ddt wrote in his last announcement:In reply to: Since this post is in the announcements forum you won't be able to reply to it here. Please use the regular forums to share your thoughts and questions and continue to share your feedback.
And as to, "...[only] the registered users should be able to voice their opinion". Only registered users CAN voice their opinion, as you need to be logged in to post in all forums other than Bugs, smart guy. So "maybe" you are just a talking head.
Why is the same forum visible at their other site (dz.com) ???
Honestly... Why do you think they decided to hide this forum ???
Fill in the blank... A forum is made 'hidden' to _______ something.
No offense, but you really are starting to appearing like a "yes man" dude.
Do you really not find it a bit "odd" and/or 'suspect' that all of a sudden the forum is purposely made less visible ??? This forum has always been open, always. Ask youself, "why would they change it?"
(This post was edited by rrradam on Dec 8, 2006, 12:23 PM)
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thomasribiere
Dec 8, 2006, 12:16 PM
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It's hidden to hide something, probably, surely. Anyway, YOU can still access it and post in threads as long as any registered user. ANd as said caughtinside in another topic, "I don't give a shit about your little skydiving analogy". So what is the real problem? I honestly don't see it.
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rrrADAM
Dec 8, 2006, 12:22 PM
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I was still editing my post, as I never get it all in the first time, so you may have missed this:
And as to, "...[only] the registered users should be able to voice their opinion". Only registered users CAN voice their opinion, as you need to be logged in to post in all forums other than Bugs, smart guy. So "maybe" you are just a talking head.
BTW... Wipe your chin bro, you missed a spot. 
(This post was edited by rrradam on Dec 8, 2006, 12:28 PM)
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thomasribiere
Dec 8, 2006, 12:29 PM
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?
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rrrADAM
Dec 8, 2006, 12:37 PM
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thomasribiere wrote: Yeah? Maybe because only the persons who take part in the site ie the registered users should be able to voice their opinion. Not completely absurd. Not absolutely necessary.
Notice the bold print in the quote of you above...
ONLY the registered user are able to 'voice thier opinions' anyways, as we all need to be logged on to post in all forums other than Bugs & Errors. Do you know the details about the very forums that you moderate ???
(This post was edited by rrradam on Dec 8, 2006, 1:06 PM)
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thomasribiere
Dec 8, 2006, 1:49 PM
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I didn't know that. Having seen a guest posting in the "Bugs Forum", I assumed that it was possible in other forums. My mystake.
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climbsomething
Dec 8, 2006, 4:20 PM
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ddt wrote: rrradam wrote: This forum was viewable by guests just a couple days ago, as I was browsing it when not logged in, but now it is hidden to guests, and only visible to those logged in. This means that someone has set this forum to that status on purpose through the Admin Panel, so I am curious as to the reason for this. It's to prevent you from submitting another duplicate vote on the polls as guest, Adam. 
But I don't buy it.
Back in the days of yore, our polls could only be replied to once, yet S&Q was visible to outsiders. It can be done.
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fenix83
Moderator
Dec 8, 2006, 4:25 PM
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Nothing in the above linked post leads me to believe it can't be done. It simply states that until it has been fixed, guest access will be turned off...
-F
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climbsomething
Dec 8, 2006, 4:44 PM
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Then they need to turn off guest access to a whole lotta other forums, because polls are not exclusive to S&Q.
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fenix83
Moderator
Dec 8, 2006, 4:49 PM
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Fair 'nuff...
-F
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climbsomething
Dec 8, 2006, 6:22 PM
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Oh, and let's keep all official discussions on this in the (semi?) public forums. PMs provide too much opportunity for secrecy and spin.
(This post was edited by climbsomething on Dec 8, 2006, 6:23 PM)
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j_ung
Dec 8, 2006, 7:27 PM
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rrradam wrote: This forum was viewable by guests just a couple days ago, as I was browsing it when not logged in, but now it is hidden to guests, and only visible to those logged in. This means that someone has set this forum to that status on purpose through the Admin Panel, so I am curious as to the reason for this. The S&F Forum is viewable to guests at dz.com, and it was here just a coupe days ago, and I don't see anything in here worthy of 'hiding', so what is the reasoning for proactively hiding this forum from guests ???
Adam, the answer is found in another thread:
rrradam wrote: I'm not supprised at all... The site's faster, and doesn't break. Remember, the vast bulk of users (by numbers) never added pictures, routes, or any other content to really have a concern about some of the features other than site speed. But the real kicker... Even a 'guest' can vote in these polls, as in they don't need to be logged in, so I would hazard a guess that a couple/few of the dizzy.com crowd are here voting as well. So I wouldn't put too much faith in these polls. Note-I logged out, and voted again in this poll, and the vote count went from 39 to 40 when I hit "vote".
ddt wrote: Good catch Adam. Non-logged-in users are only supposed to have read access to the forum. Till we fix this I've completely turned off access to this specific forum for guests. DDT |
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climbsomething
Dec 8, 2006, 7:29 PM
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Let’s play investigative drama queen.
When logged out of RC.com, does the Suggestions and Questions forum appear on the forum list?
NO
http://i59.photobucket.com/...sdavis/untitled1.jpg
When logged out of DZ.com, does the Suggestions and Questions forum (a.k.a., Suggestions and Feedback) appear on the forum list, and can it be opened and read by a guest?
YES
http://i59.photobucket.com/...sdavis/untitled2.jpg
On DZ.com, can a logged out member vote in a poll?
Apparently, NO
http://i59.photobucket.com/...sdavis/untitled3.jpg
See this recent thread in their community forum (which was, incidentally, linked in a community forum here). Guests cannot vote. http://www.dropzone.com/...est=31091181#2558276
Let’s take a look at the threads visible to a guest in DZ.com’s S&F forum:
http://i59.photobucket.com/...sdavis/untitled4.jpg
These threads are very technical in nature and do not include any criticism of management. They’re also fairly stale- going back to Nov. 1?
Now, since you’re logged in (or else you couldn’t read this), go to our S&Q main page. Check out the thread titles and open them up. I don’t think we need any screen caps for that one, but here’s some thread titles anyway: “Why is this forum now hidden from ‘guests’ ???”; “No embedded images- a real loss?”; Jay’s polls; a thread decrying the closing of the accidents and injuries forum, and the simply-titled “ddt & sangiro,” which is 15 pages of them getting their supposed lion’s balls poked with a sharp stick. We’re questioning authority and yes, we’re flaming “them.”
But the given explanation from up high is that S&Q was closed to guests to address loopholes in the poll system. Okay.
Let’s look at the recent, supposedly buggy polls in this forum that you know got some official panties in a bunch: Climbsomething and Coldclimb should be offerred their jobs back as forum moderators (75% agree or agree strongly); How satisfied are you with how the new owners of rockclimbing.com have responded to suggestions for improvement and criticisms of the new website? (45% mostly or highly unsatisfied); Overall, how do you feel the new website compares with the old website? (54% say somewhat or much worse); and natch, Which of the following phrases best describes your current attitude toward the new owners of rockclimbing.com? (42% unfavorable or very unfavorable; 63% unfavorable, very unfavorable, or neutral)
As said, ddt posted that our S&Q forum was closed to guests to address the ballot boxing poll issue, wherein anybody could vote in a poll, including some non-registered guests. This was brought to the fore after Adam discovered that one could vote this way in Jay’s polls in S&Q. Such a loophole must be closed! Let’s close the S&Q forum, ostensibly while we seek to patch that hole.
But let’s check out some current poll behavior.
I opened Jay’s polls, signed in (of course) and I could only view results, not vote. Ostensibly, because I had previously voted in these polls and my vote was recorded under “climbsomething,” I can not add another vote. Well, good. That means people are kept honest with only one vote (per username).
Then I went to campground (nee community) and voted in wjca’s “how do you like you’re [sic] boobs” poll (http://www.rockclimbing.com/...lapsed;guest=1250152), which was created this morning. No problems there, all radio buttons and checkboxes were there, so I voted for “Petit, no more than a handfull with pencil erasers” (but of course!) The poll recorded my vote and thanked me for voting (you’re welcome!) Then I logged out and returned to the thread. I could not vote, only view results.
Then I personally created a poll in the always-viewable beginner’s forum. Checkit: http://www.rockclimbing.com/...ost=1497609;#1497609
I did not vote in it. When I logged out, likewise, I could not vote in it.
Well, looks like that little bug has in fact been taken care of, eh?
So, what’s the REAL reason why S&Q was closed?
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caughtinside
Dec 8, 2006, 7:38 PM
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Let me see if I can sum this up, based on that fine piece of investigative journalism:
Previously, anyone could vote any number of times on polls in S&Q. S&Q was then made a private forum, only registered users can view and vote one time per poll.
In all other forums, all polls are viewable by guests. Guests cannot vote in them, and registered users can only vote one time per poll.
Which then leads us to the $20 question!!! (Isn't that how much it costs to get a little star next to your name which now entitles you to... what, exactly?)
Why isn't S&Q the same as these other forums?
Oh. Wait.
nevermind. 
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climbsomething
Dec 8, 2006, 7:47 PM
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I would also add, FYI, that suggestions and questions threads do not echo (appear) on the front page listing, and it has been this way for quite some time- since before the forum was closed because of "voting issues."
Oh, and do I have an axe to grind? Damn skippy, I do.
(This post was edited by climbsomething on Dec 8, 2006, 7:48 PM)
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ddt
Dec 8, 2006, 8:10 PM
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The forum is open again to guests: see here.
DDT
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rrrADAM
Dec 8, 2006, 8:12 PM
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ddt wrote: rrradam wrote: This forum was viewable by guests just a couple days ago, as I was browsing it when not logged in, but now it is hidden to guests, and only visible to those logged in. This means that someone has set this forum to that status on purpose through the Admin Panel, so I am curious as to the reason for this. It's to prevent you from submitting another duplicate vote on the polls as guest, Adam. Seriously, it was in response to an issue you brought up. Check here. DDT
So are you stating that guests can only vote to polls in this forum, and that the bug is limited to this forum ??? Please answer this, as your 'action' and reply imply this.
If not, then it really appears that you are trying to hide a negative perception of your 'investment' from public view, plain and simple.
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ddt
Dec 8, 2006, 8:35 PM
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rrradam wrote: So are you stating that guests can only vote to polls in this forum, and that the bug is limited to this forum ??? Please answer this, as your 'action' and reply imply this.
I don't know... will need to test that. I assume it's true for all forums. We have not started working on this bug.
My decision to close the forum to guests was an attempt to preserve the integrity of the specific polls in this forum. I felt that if we failed to do that we would be dealing with the mother of all consiracy theories. Turns out that the real mother of all conspiracy theories was born the minute we closed it.
Either way, the forum is open again to guests and the bug is still there.
DDT
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rrrADAM
Dec 8, 2006, 9:50 PM
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ddt wrote: rrradam wrote: So are you stating that guests can only vote to polls in this forum, and that the bug is limited to this forum ??? Please answer this, as your 'action' and reply imply this. My decision to close the forum to guests was an attempt to preserve the integrity of the specific polls in this forum. I felt that if we failed to do that we would be dealing with the mother of all consiracy theories.
Thanx for opening this forum once again... I am curious as to "why" you decided another, and apparently less appropriate and workable solution was needed ???
(This post was edited by rrradam on Dec 8, 2006, 9:51 PM)
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