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suprasoup
Jan 11, 2011, 7:48 AM
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majid_sabet wrote: billl7 wrote: majid_sabet wrote: Gmburns2000 wrote: not sure why the leader was carrying it in his pack, but as for the second not taking it, unless the second was going to put it in his pack, I've always been under the impression that the leader takes it in case it becomes snarled somewhere. In other words, the second has a better chance of fixing a CF with it. I dunno, otherwise?, maybe the leader was a stronger climber and it made sense for him to take the second rope? sucks that the dude fell. here's hoping he's OK. more importantly, why did the lead rope go through the second's belay device? Three pitches up and he wasn't tied in? Sounds odd, even if they were untying to switch belays. well, this was a disaster from the beginning and i am trying to figure out why leader was carrying the rope. sure he was stronger and more experience but still, numbers do not add right. . You said rope so I would guess not but ... Was the second rope a "single" rope or perhaps a skinny tag line. Plenty of times I've led with the skinny tag line on my back when my second has our water, jackets, and a little extra food. it was 50 m 10.2 mm
There you go. Nobody in there right mind would trail something that huge especially while traversing.
10.2mm tagline? What were they leading on? An 11mm gym rope?
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bearbreeder
Jan 11, 2011, 8:09 AM
Post #27 of 63
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majid_sabet wrote: show me one post out of 7000+ threads to my name that I called people stupid and they were going to die. come on, start searching
well i wouldnt normally cross post ... but since u insist on this thread mista majid
in the beginner forum no less  ... yaawwwnnnn
majid_sabet wrote: waveknave wrote: Hello all. I am getting into the practice of using 7mm cordelette to set up my anchors for top rope and multipitch belays. Virtually all of the stations I come across are bolted. My question is about using setup that I would find convenient. Using a 3.5m cordelette, I lock biners onto two hangers and overhand knot with one locking biner to create the maser point. On the hanger end, I want to keep these two biners clove hitched to the rig so it's easier to carry and faster to set up. See any problems with this? you are going to DIE
http://www.rockclimbing.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_flat;post=2370153;page=1;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;mh=25;
as to the "accident" .... if the rope was still tied in both ... the second can get down if they know how and came prepared
(This post was edited by bearbreeder on Jan 11, 2011, 8:12 AM)
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tomcat_ct
Jan 11, 2011, 11:29 AM
Post #28 of 63
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What about the nitroglycerin?
I think you watched vertical limit too many times...
as for the second rope in the leader's pack, I do it sometimes because I might not be able to finish the pitch.And if it's longer than 1/2 rope length I can rap back down.I don't like to trail it(it can easily get tangled where I climb) and it's useless in the second's pack in this case.Sometimes I use two 10.2 lines because that's what we each have and I don't need to buy a tag line(I'd rather spend the money on another rope I can use).
Half ropes are the best solution in this case, but it's a pain since I can't use them for sport or single pitch stuff...
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Guran
Jan 11, 2011, 2:58 PM
Post #29 of 63
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majid_sabet wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? a leader with a trail line in a pack is odd, but i've seen weirder things. not that unusual. leader took a n00b for a ride and set everything up including fixing all anchors so on the last pitch (3rd) he had to do 7-8 m traverse to the left and then continue upward. At that point, he takes fall and n00b hits the wall ( possibility of some sort of redirect) and she loose it, rope runs thru her hands and burns them pretty bad. When she gain consciousness she was still holding the rope but then she drops it and leader falls another 2m till rope drops to the ground. Again these were short pitches (18m,20m,20m) and first rope was a 60m and second rope was 50 m.
Ok, so you just answered your own question, I guess.
The purpose of the second rope was probably to get back down with a single rappell.
The belayer was much less experiened, so the leader wanted to make her task as simple as possible, hence no pack or trailing rope for the second.
It was then up to the leader to bring up the second rope in the most convenient manner, which may or may not be in a pack.
Leader fell, inexperienced belayer screwed up. Not uncommon.
The worst mistake here is obviously (doh!) the second not being tied in. Due to crazy luck both survived. Glad to hear that.
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fresh
Jan 11, 2011, 3:40 PM
Post #30 of 63
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Guran wrote: The belayer was much less experiened, so the leader wanted to make her task as simple as possible, hence no pack or trailing rope for the second. [snip] The worst mistake here is obviously (doh!) the second not being tied in. Due to crazy luck both survived. Glad to hear that.
majid, this is such a non-question that I think you wrote this with the intent of getting people to ask about the second not being tied in. but that may be giving you too much credit.
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majid_sabet
Jan 12, 2011, 6:17 PM
Post #31 of 63
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Some pretty good questions and suggestions came out of this thread so I finally was able to contact the party to find out the reasons on why the belayer wasn't tied to the end of the rope (or why the end wasn't anchored) and also why leader was carrying the second rope on him while leading the pitch.
He basically took this inexperienced girl on a multi-pitch expedition and he was babysitting her . She even had hard time tying fig 8 so on every anchor, she untie the fig 8 and retie before following the leader. leader also noticed that she was too weak to carry anything so he decided to carry the second rope on him before he fell.
Thanks all
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vegastradguy
Jan 12, 2011, 6:28 PM
Post #32 of 63
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majid_sabet wrote: She even had hard time tying fig 8 so on every anchor, she untie the fig 8 and retie before following the leader.
ah yes, just what someone who isnt sure how to tie in should do- untie from the rope and then re-tie in without supervision. 100' up. nice.
(This post was edited by vegastradguy on Jan 12, 2011, 7:50 PM)
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majid_sabet
Jan 12, 2011, 6:50 PM
Post #33 of 63
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vegastradguy wrote: [quote "majid_sabet" She even had hard time tying fig 8 so on every anchor, she untie the fig 8 and retie before following the leader.
ah yes, just what someone who isnt sure how to tie in should do- untie from the rope and then re-tie in without supervision. 100' up. nice.
well
Wish me luck cause I am submitting this report for a prize on Feb 3
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sp115
Jan 12, 2011, 7:58 PM
Post #34 of 63
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vegastradguy wrote: majid_sabet wrote: She even had hard time tying fig 8 so on every anchor, she untie the fig 8 and retie before following the leader. ah yes, just what someone who isnt sure how to tie in should do- untie from the rope and then re-tie in without supervision. 100' up. nice.
You beat me to it, and I was just about to type the exact response, except it makes no sense at all:
The belayer unties and just before taking off says, "I know you're not good at this so practice while I'm gone and out of sight."
The leader falls, the belayer gets knocked-out, but still maintains control of the rope.
The belayer wakes up and THEN drops the rope.
The leader falls 100' to the ground and is "OK".
Edit to add: and Majid wants to know why the leader had the second rope?
WTF?
(This post was edited by sp115 on Jan 12, 2011, 8:00 PM)
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jakedatc
Jan 13, 2011, 2:04 PM
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Once again, Majid proves that he is a worthless troll with no climbing experience what so ever. If he actually was in SAR and actually climbed this is a pretty easy scenario to figure out.
oh and you're not protected by your little A/I rules now.. FUCKING GUMBY ASS NOOB
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jakedatc
Jan 13, 2011, 2:18 PM
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traversing with a tag line sucks.. especially since it would have been almost dragging on the ground since it was so short.. who does 20m pitches on a route you could link together? What leader would ever leave a multipitch belay when their 2nd wasn't tied in? If the belayer was actually unconscious i have no idea how they would hold the belay if it was weighted.. i don't see that happening.
sounds like a bunch of gumbies. blind leading the blind. or the figment of majidiots imagination
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jakedatc
Jan 13, 2011, 2:47 PM
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j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury.
cuz it wasn't 3 pitches.. it was 1 pitch less than 60m broken into 3 with a traverse at the top. but broken into 3 by a group of clueless gumbies.
what i don't get is how someone could let 50 some odd meters of rope slide through the belay yet somehow hold them off the ground until they "woke up" their hands would be shredded and if they were out they wouldn't be hanging on.
hence why i think this is another imaginary scenario by a delusional fucktard
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blueeyedclimber
Jan 13, 2011, 4:43 PM
Post #39 of 63
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majid_sabet wrote: He basically took this inexperienced girl on a multi-pitch expedition and he was babysitting her . She even had hard time tying fig 8 so on every anchor, she untie the fig 8 and retie before following the leader. leader also noticed that she was too weak to carry anything so he decided to carry the second rope on him before he fell. Thanks all
I call BS. There is NO WAY that a leader would have her do that. That is perhaps the stupidest thing I have ever heard on here (and that is saying something).
Josh
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blueeyedclimber
Jan 13, 2011, 4:50 PM
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jakedatc wrote: who does 20m pitches on a route you could link together?
In reply to: What leader would ever leave a multipitch belay when their 2nd wasn't tied in?
Not much of a leader, that's who. Someone who also lacks basic common sense.
In reply to: If the belayer was actually unconscious i have no idea how they would hold the belay if it was weighted.. i don't see that happening.
I have heard of someone who died still with a death grip on the break strand. I actually DO believe this COULD happen. Not that it actually did, but it is possible.
In reply to: sounds like a bunch of gumbies. blind leading the blind. or the figment of majidiots imagination
Watch the personal attacks. You don't want to upset the rc gods
Josh
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jakedatc
Jan 13, 2011, 4:56 PM
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blueeyedclimber wrote: jakedatc wrote: who does 20m pitches on a route you could link together? Doing short pitches is common when leading someone inexperienced. One, so you can see and communicate with them. Two, less rope stretch in case they fall, especially if there's a low crux. In reply to: What leader would ever leave a multipitch belay when their 2nd wasn't tied in? Not much of a leader, that's who. Someone who also lacks basic common sense. In reply to: If the belayer was actually unconscious i have no idea how they would hold the belay if it was weighted.. i don't see that happening. In reply to: sounds like a bunch of gumbies. blind leading the blind. or the figment of majidiots imagination Josh
as someone who's had like 5' of rope burn from a slipping rope i can say that after trying to regain a rope going that fast there is no way they could be holding on.. their hand would be trashed.
this isn't A/I he's in the deep end now
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blueeyedclimber
Jan 13, 2011, 5:44 PM
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jakedatc wrote: blueeyedclimber wrote: jakedatc wrote: who does 20m pitches on a route you could link together? Doing short pitches is common when leading someone inexperienced. One, so you can see and communicate with them. Two, less rope stretch in case they fall, especially if there's a low crux. In reply to: What leader would ever leave a multipitch belay when their 2nd wasn't tied in? Not much of a leader, that's who. Someone who also lacks basic common sense. In reply to: If the belayer was actually unconscious i have no idea how they would hold the belay if it was weighted.. i don't see that happening. In reply to: sounds like a bunch of gumbies. blind leading the blind. or the figment of majidiots imagination Josh as someone who's had like 5' of rope burn from a slipping rope i can say that after trying to regain a rope going that fast there is no way they could be holding on.. their hand would be trashed. this isn't A/I he's in the deep end now
Oh, I agree that this report has numerous holes, I'm just trying play devil's advocate. Maybe she was wearing gloves. Who knows?
Josh
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majid_sabet
Jan 13, 2011, 6:16 PM
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j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury.
He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries.
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majid_sabet
Jan 13, 2011, 6:26 PM
Post #44 of 63
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blueeyedclimber wrote: majid_sabet wrote: He basically took this inexperienced girl on a multi-pitch expedition and he was babysitting her . She even had hard time tying fig 8 so on every anchor, she untie the fig 8 and retie before following the leader. leader also noticed that she was too weak to carry anything so he decided to carry the second rope on him before he fell. Thanks all I call BS. There is NO WAY that a leader would have her do that. That is perhaps the stupidest thing I have ever heard on here (and that is saying something). Josh
Josh
I am writing a book about I&A and this is not a weird case. I got one case where father and son borrowed an old rope ( at least 20+ years old) from some guy who said his rope was fine and rapped in to a 400 m cave. 180 m deep, rope breaks , father falls 35 m and dies.
Hearing an accident is one thing but sitting down with the son and trying to get him to talk and explain everything 10 years later, now that is a tough job.
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sp115
Jan 13, 2011, 6:46 PM
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majid_sabet wrote: j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury. He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries.
Are you implying there were extensive injuries? Because what you said was: "Anyways, both ended up ok."
You clearly know enough English to know the difference between those two statements.
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jakedatc
Jan 13, 2011, 6:49 PM
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sp115 wrote: majid_sabet wrote: j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury. He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries. Are you implying there were extensive injuries? Because what you said was: "Anyways, both ended up ok." You clearly know enough English to know the difference between those two statements.
he also claims to have more experience than he actually does and proves it every time he asks these stupid questions that should be easy to figure out.
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majid_sabet
Jan 13, 2011, 7:41 PM
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jakedatc wrote: sp115 wrote: majid_sabet wrote: j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury. He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries. Are you implying there were extensive injuries? Because what you said was: "Anyways, both ended up ok." You clearly know enough English to know the difference between those two statements. he also claims to have more experience than he actually does and proves it every time he asks these stupid questions that should be easy to figure out.
jake
do you have a GF ?
you blow gasket left and right dude.
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spikeddem
Jan 13, 2011, 7:44 PM
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majid_sabet wrote: jakedatc wrote: sp115 wrote: majid_sabet wrote: j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury. He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries. Are you implying there were extensive injuries? Because what you said was: "Anyways, both ended up ok." You clearly know enough English to know the difference between those two statements. he also claims to have more experience than he actually does and proves it every time he asks these stupid questions that should be easy to figure out. jake do you have a GF ? you blow gasket left and right dude.
Mr. Sabet, are you asking him about a GF because you're finally over Angry?
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jakedatc
Jan 13, 2011, 8:11 PM
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majid_sabet wrote: jakedatc wrote: sp115 wrote: majid_sabet wrote: j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury. He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries. Are you implying there were extensive injuries? Because what you said was: "Anyways, both ended up ok." You clearly know enough English to know the difference between those two statements. he also claims to have more experience than he actually does and proves it every time he asks these stupid questions that should be easy to figure out. jake do you have a GF ? you blow gasket left and right dude.
Yep, and she climbs more, harder and smarter than you.
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majid_sabet
Jan 13, 2011, 11:17 PM
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jakedatc wrote: majid_sabet wrote: jakedatc wrote: sp115 wrote: majid_sabet wrote: j_ung wrote: vegastradguy wrote: im confused. how could this possibly happen? what the hell was the second doing not tied into the rope? You and me both. And I'm further confused about how the leader decked from three pitches, but escaped injury. He survived but I did not mention the extend of his injuries. Are you implying there were extensive injuries? Because what you said was: "Anyways, both ended up ok." You clearly know enough English to know the difference between those two statements. he also claims to have more experience than he actually does and proves it every time he asks these stupid questions that should be easy to figure out. jake do you have a GF ? you blow gasket left and right dude. Yep, and she climbs more, harder and smarter than you.
jake
the way you write about girls just tells me that you loose your virginity not too long ago. an experienced climber never says stuff like this about women
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