|
dsafanda
Dec 16, 2003, 6:41 PM
Post #76 of 85
(9525 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 6, 2002
Posts: 1025
|
Much appreciated info. Thanks so much J.Yates!
This kind personal involvement on the part of the manufacturer himself is what makes Yates(and Fish too) a great gear company. IMHO
I think most of us here would love to know more about worst case scenario tests if you do more of them this winter. It would be great to be able to compare drop test results between your adj daisy, adj daisy with screamer and conventional daisy.
|
|
|
|
|
brianinslc
Dec 16, 2003, 8:46 PM
Post #77 of 85
(9525 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 13, 2002
Posts: 1500
|
In reply to: I could not get a daisy to NOT FAIL when I did a FF2 3/4 length drop test with my 220 lb dummy without a screamer attached.
Geez, that could be me everytime I bounce test a placement...!
I've taken two pretty hard adj. daisy falls. In neither situation, did I rip the gear or the daisy...and...at 100 kilos, I think I might be puttin' some load in the system. Nylon instead of spectra, and maybe a looser cinch knot must add some dynamics into the system, at least enough to reduce some of the peak loading...thank goodness...
John, thanks for the post. Have really been enjoying my Shield harness, the sofa lounger for sure, and my back's never felt better on a wall. Shorty screamers rule.
Hopefully you'll be around SLC for OR in Jan...see ya then...
Brian in SLC
|
|
|
|
|
timpanogos
Jan 3, 2004, 8:41 PM
Post #78 of 85
(9525 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 17, 2002
Posts: 935
|
I'm confused on the short fix technique used here. Why would the second be tieing (handing) the sharp end to the leads aider (all while he is standing on a hook)? Was this just because the lead was so close to the station and it saved rope handling for the lead?
Doesn't the lead usually pull up the loose end of his self belay and tie off on this end, then feed the free rope back to the belayer? One advantage, I suppose, of a grigri self belay, is the ease of passing back the free rope while remaining tied in as well as on the original grigri self belay.
Why the hurry to tie-in on the hook? Why the lead rope end switch?
What am I missing here?
Chad
|
|
|
|
|
flamer
Jan 3, 2004, 8:57 PM
Post #79 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 22, 2002
Posts: 2955
|
In reply to: I'm confused on the short fix technique used here. Why would the second be tieing (handing) the sharp end to the leads aider (all while he is standing on a hook)? Was this just because the lead was so close to the station and it saved rope handling for the lead? Doesn't the lead usually pull up the loose end of his self belay and tie off on this end, then feed the free rope back to the belayer? One advantage, I suppose, of a grigri self belay, is the ease of passing back the free rope while remaining tied in as well as on the original grigri self belay. Why the hurry to tie-in on the hook? Why the lead rope end switch? What am I missing here? Chad
They were both free soloing to this point- nobody was tied in. I can't clear up anything else...sorry I talked to my buddy just the other day---From the sounds of it they were just charged up and going fast- bujt that's my take on it.
josh
|
|
|
|
|
timpanogos
Jan 3, 2004, 9:21 PM
Post #80 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 17, 2002
Posts: 935
|
Flamer/all,
Thanks for this thread! I love my adjustables and use them extensively (and still will). For me, time to move to a new pair (no more, ah there good for one more). Love them at the stations, but always stay tied in (I always do anyway). New realization of there fail ratings
Sounds like a couple of other leasons might be hidden here:
1. Get on a C1 placement before going from solo block lead to belayed - no rush.
2. Take a breath at those belay stations, make sure all is well, give the second time to settle in and organize a bit before relying on a partnered belay.
3. As mentioned here several times - adjustable daisies are part of the movement system not fall protection. It was nuts to daisy aid onto a hook with no roped belay at all!
I'm glad your friends were not hurt.
Chad
|
|
|
|
|
whenindoubtrunitout
Mar 12, 2004, 12:19 PM
Post #81 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 15, 2002
Posts: 31
|
I'm not familiar with the Yates Daisy, but I used a Pika Daisy on El Cap a few years back and had what sounds like a similar problem. The Pika adjustable daisy utilizes a spring-loaded cam buckle on two flat webbing daisies. The problem I encountered was rare but catastrophic whenever it happened... and it happened 2-3 times in the course of a Grade V. The cam buckle lever would occassionally rest agaist a small rock protrusion, and upon being weighted would open up and allow the webbing to suddenly slide through at a high rate of speed with my weight on it. It would obviously come to a sudden stop when 1) my (then higher) foot would come to a stop in the tangled mess at chest height or 2) the other webbing's knot jammed against the buckleshock-loading the entire system which occassionally sent me for a ride. Not fun!
A really bummer because I like adjustable daisies so much. The good news for Metolius adjustable daisy users is that they don't use that kind of fancy locking mechanism. A case of simple (and slightly more archaic looking) is more reliable.
|
|
|
|
|
whenindoubtrunitout
Mar 12, 2004, 12:25 PM
Post #82 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 15, 2002
Posts: 31
|
I'm not entirely sure I understood what was going on in your stated scenario, either. But I thought I would impart a bad experience I had with an ADC in the event that it might help.
|
|
|
|
|
atg200
Mar 12, 2004, 4:19 PM
Post #83 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 27, 2001
Posts: 4317
|
that happened to me with the pika daisys on the hindu near moab, and it scared the hell out of me. the yates design is much better for the trigger than the pika. since then, i've just been very very careful about orienting the daisy trigger away from the rock with no twists and i've had no trouble.
awful feeling though, isn't it?
|
|
|
|
|
joebuzz
Mar 21, 2004, 9:44 AM
Post #84 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 5, 2002
Posts: 107
|
Just my .02 cents... I use a sort of home made adjustable daisy. Actually, it's just a Ropeman ascending device, positioned up side down on a length of 9 mil. cord tied to my harness. Each of my aiders have a standard BD spectra daisy. I've used this setup for a handful of years already and still love it. I've bounced like hell on the thing and even taken a couple of falls onto it and no probs so far. Anyway, if it were to fail, the spectra daisies without the bother of a fifi act as back up. The Ropeman also turns back into an ascender if I ever need it to, so it's multi-purpose too.
I love it!... Buzz
|
|
|
|
|
piton
Mar 23, 2004, 1:36 PM
Post #85 of 85
(9528 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 11, 2002
Posts: 1034
|
i really don't understand how the daisy falls happens? i would think if there was a chance of falling on the daisy you would add a shorty to the daisy to decrease the force. a fall like that can even break your back.
|
|
|
|
|
|
