argh yeah, but i made this just before you gave me that usefull tip :oP

Still last thread is 03. can we talk about it again after 5 years? Or do I gota wait 7?

OK moving this discussion (hopefully) to a proper thread for a (hopefully) proper response.

I have used the bowline knot quite alot in various ways for rigging on boats. I have not seen it used in climbing. I have seen the bowline on a bite (bight?).

My question is does this knot have something about it that makes other knots better in climbing? Or a crucial weakness I am not aware of?

Specificaly I was thinking about the figure 8 and how when tied improperly it can still appear to be ok and hold weight but will slip. A bowline will not appear right and will not hold any weigth at all unless tied correctly. This seems like an advantage to me but I am new and will likely question things like this even after many years of experiance. I am not about to go try it in place of my f8. But my experiance tells me It is a great knot that both holds, is easy to break down even when highly tensioned and wet, and is very safe as it wont close if tied wrong.

Just wondering.

Bowline quiz time:

True/False

A properly tied Bowline has the "tail" on the outside of the loop.

Now explain your answer.

Tests have shown it doesn't matter with climbing ropes

Thanks for the real response you guys. I am a n00b so I will try to learn from all the oh so kind suggestions I read through a few of the older threads and there is some scarey miss information in those!

Someone suggests a bowline will pull into a slipknot with enough force. I have tied bowlines that the pacific ocean could not do this too. There is not much stronger then that!

It is suggested that a bowline will come undone if clipped into and pulled on from somwhere other then directly opposing the knot (i.e. it doesnt make a solid loop it just connects the rope if the pull is from one direction). This is a worry. I believe this could be true. But no actual proof was given just second or third hand opinions (that I could find at least).

I think the bowline is probably harder to visualy inspect, but it doesnt need to be as if you tie it wrong and pull on it it will strip right off. Try it, revers the loop and pull. No knot just pulls right off. A figure 8 with one error in follow will hold... for a while... That is the thing I am thinking about when I wonder about a bowline over a figure 8.

I dont ever just visualy inspect a knot (unless its distant and I am forced too). I feal for the twist in the rope and pull on it. A knot tied over a kink in the rope can look great and come loose. Just the way I learned to go about rope safety.

I am going to stick with the f8 for tie in.

The date is sorted by topic I think. A random sampling showed some 2006s and 2007s in there.

Anyway, to summarize: climbers don't use a 'single' bowline all that much, though I myself have seen some old thymrs use it as a primary tie-in, especially the mountaineer variety.

Various forms of the double bowline have been used extensively in rock climbing.

I use a modified double bowline as my tie-in if I'm going to be doggin and hanging and taking short whips, primarily for the ease of the untie. I use it for top roping almost exclusively.

But I go with a figure 8 most of the time, for ease of use, partner familiarlity and that nagging little voice in my head.

Cheers and welcome aboard
DMT

for sportclimbing I use this one

and here the complete thing: http://www.dietmar-hahm.de/...len/anseilen_6.shtml
sorry text is in german but I think the pics clearly show it.
That one is in my opinion one of the safest knots, because its fully redundant.
But I don't know the right name for it in english
do you call that a double bowline??

It's not redundant if you tie it as pictured.

Now can you tell me why I am saying what I said...