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theclimber
Oct 27, 2003, 4:58 PM
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Just a curious question:
Why are all of the photos on the main page taken somewhere besides the U.S. ??? I see maybe one photo every few weeks that has been taken at a U.S. crag.....
Just curious..
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thrasher
Oct 27, 2003, 5:08 PM
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That's because there are a couple of photographers from other countries that take really good photos(albeit they all look the same and they are of the same dude) and they kind of have a cult following and their photos always get voted high. I think there are some fantastic photographers here that get no run whatsoever because they are not "popular" or part of the "in" crowd on this site.
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rrrADAM
Oct 27, 2003, 5:12 PM
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The pics on the FP are chosen from amongst the first few pages of highest rated pics. There have been plenty of pics from the US on the FP, but some of our better photogs are from places other than the US, so thier pics are rated higher.
BTW... Moving this to the Suggestions & Questions Forum. :wink:
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rrrADAM
Oct 27, 2003, 5:13 PM
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rrradam moved this thread from General to Suggestions & Questions.
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overlord
Oct 28, 2003, 10:46 AM
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well, i believe i saw yesterday AT LEAST 4 fFP photos from the US. like from that southerner guy and two about deser climbing.
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rwaltermyer
Oct 28, 2003, 12:58 PM
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yeah...i don't really see a compelling case here.
besides...We, Americans, try to dominate everything....please not the FP photos too.
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overlord
Oct 28, 2003, 1:00 PM
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and besides, if you want more US photos on the FP, take some good shots and put them up. well be gratefull.
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theclimber
Oct 28, 2003, 2:38 PM
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People, I was just asking a damn question. I knew that this would turn into some HUGE debate. I was just asking. Although, I dont visit this site 24 hours a day, when I do pop on a couple times during the day it just seemed like every picture that came up was from somewhere I have never even heard of in eastern europe. I didnt bring up this point to say that the pictures were bad. I like the pictures but just wondered why there werent as many from the U.S. crags thats all.
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camhead
Oct 28, 2003, 2:55 PM
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due to recent quota/affirmative action/diversity laws, rc.com is now required to provide a proportion of front page photos according to a complex formula that takes complex factors such as geographical area, population density, and total developed crags into account. the number of photos on the front page reflect this formula, designed to give us as much global diversity as possible. (there are no pictures from china because it is still a communist nation)
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theclimber
Oct 28, 2003, 3:12 PM
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Thank You
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tim
Oct 28, 2003, 3:13 PM
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welllll, one possible reason is that some of the very best US photographers are primarily concentrated on commercial sales (stock/ads/etc.) and don't necessarily want to expose their work on this site. Whereas guys like Jorg or Neil, who can throw down with the best of 'em, use the site as a marketing tool and the users vote his photos highly, so you see a lot of them.
There is an effort afoot to try and close this gap, to both boost our resident photographic heroes' stock in the market, and to make the site more attractive to established or semi-established photographers. Eg. the most well-known French, German, American, and Australian photographers with the most market penetration may still shy away from posting their shots on rc.com. But if it's tangibly rewarding for the top-rated photographers on the site to post up -- if we can successfully merchandise, advertise, and promote them, to the point where rc.com photographers start eating into the revenues of the most recognizable names -- then we'll be onto something, and the playing field will likely even out a little. Joe Auer may not have the name recognition of Corey Rich or Greg Epperson, but maybe he should -- Harrison Shull, for example, has told me for years that climbing/adventure-sports photography is a brutal market to break into. If you look at the best climbing photographers, you see some of the best climbers around -- Epperson pulls 5.13, Jimmy Chin has climbed El Cap in a day several times, Jorg and Neil both pull 5.13 -- and this really thins the field!
Right now the distribution favors the best-known photographers from lesser-known contries, and the lesser-known photographers from the best-known countries. If we (the developers and photographers and users of the site) are successful in shaking up the playing field a bit, that may change. Ideas are welcome -- we've already got several that we're pursuing due to some holes in the market, but maybe there's something more immediate that we're missing. If so, I'd like to hear about it.
There's new people breaking in all the time -- Hillary has been consistently producing some great work lately, for example. It would be nice if a no-holds-barred, even playing field were available on rc.com (which I think is already the case), and it would be even better if all the eligible players had an incentive to show up for the game. The latter part is the current focus of our efforts (the photographers, developers, and owners being "us" in this context). If you're interested, join the Photo Critique Circle, and post up with your pictures and your suggestions.
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tim
Oct 28, 2003, 3:15 PM
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tim moved this thread from Suggestions & Questions to Climbing Photography.
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eric
Oct 28, 2003, 3:23 PM
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In reply to: due to recent quota/affirmative action/diversity laws, rc.com is now required to provide a proportion of front page photos according ...
In may not be entirely obvious to everyone that this 'answer' is bogus.
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camhead
Oct 28, 2003, 4:29 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: due to recent quota/affirmative action/diversity laws, rc.com is now required to provide a proportion of front page photos according ... In may not be entirely obvious to everyone that this 'answer' is bogus.
hey, did you know that the word "gullible" is not in the dictionary?
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taraus_de_bull
Oct 28, 2003, 4:54 PM
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personally, i don't mind that the photo's aren't taken BY American's. The pics are cool and i enjoy seeing good ones. However, i wish more good photographers (american or not) would take more shots IN the US. You always read about cool experiencs or places, but i've never seen many pictures of half of them. Sure, hueco, bishop, yosemite, and a few others get a lot of exposure in Mags and stuff, but what about all the other places. Maybe i should just quit school and go on a road trip, then i could see them first hand and not have to drool over pictures, or actually, drool of thinking about looking at pictures since there isn't many.
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theclimber
Oct 28, 2003, 5:00 PM
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Obviously Camhead was not being serious but I thanked him at least for being direct. And thanks to Tim. Thats all I wanted to know. I didnt throw the question out so that it could be "debated" at boring length.
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climbsomething
Oct 28, 2003, 7:08 PM
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In reply to: However, i wish more good photographers (american or not) would take more shots IN the US.
This summer I was in Yosemite for a week. I shot 22+ rolls. Or, about 550 exposures...
My last trip to Joshua Tree... 12 rolls. Nearly 300 exposures.
Places that aren't necessarily E-ticket rides? OK. Homestead, AZ- once, I spent 1 roll of film on ONE ROUTE. Queen Creek, AZ- 3 rolls in a single day, give or take. New Jack City, CA- I lost count. Paradise Forks, AZ- on average, 4 rolls of film per weekend. City of Rocks, ID- 10 rolls in 5 days. etc etc etc ad naseum...
If that's what *I* am doing, then just imagine how many shots the heavies are potentially racking up. Trust me, the U.S. images are out there.
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rwaltermyer
Oct 28, 2003, 11:42 PM
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In reply to: due to recent quota/affirmative action/diversity laws, rc.com is now required to provide a proportion of front page photos according to a complex formula that takes complex factors such as geographical area, population density, and total developed crags into account. the number of photos on the front page reflect this formula, designed to give us as much global diversity as possible. (there are no pictures from china because it is still a communist nation)
thats what this world has come to. Don't get me started of Affirmative Action.
randy
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