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esoj00
Feb 28, 2005, 10:54 PM
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Anchor
Hey guys, i have a question relating to setting up a belay at an anchor while belaying.
Here's the situation, you reach a ledge, set up an anchor set and put your second on belay. The question is when in this situation the rope comes over the lip of the edge and runs against it. How do i prevent this friction between the lip and the rope. I know how to do it top roping but i have no idea how it can be done on multipitch...
Thanks
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ceramiclover
Feb 28, 2005, 11:03 PM
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your second should just be following, not lowering or anything, so you would think that the friction would be negligible. if not, you would think that it would come from rope drag from the protection along the way.
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brianinslc
Feb 28, 2005, 11:04 PM
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In reply to: Here's the situation, you reach a ledge, set up an anchor set and put your second on belay. The question is when in this situation the rope comes over the lip of the edge and runs against it. How do i prevent this friction between the lip and the rope.
Set up your belay at the edge. Lean over, belay.
In some cases, when I'm in a hurry, I haven't sussed out the exact distance for me to belay from, the edge is sharp, and I don't think my parnter will fall, I'll belay with the rope running over my shoe...to save time. But, if you extend the anchor and hang off the edge, then your belay is, essentially, the edge or the lip.
A bomber anchor is always a good idear...
Brian in SLC
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esoj00
Mar 1, 2005, 1:43 AM
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I see, thanks for your advice, so assuming im to far from the edge to belay him over it just have to let it slide along the ledge, correct me if im wrong.
Thanks for your replys!
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kman
Mar 1, 2005, 2:01 AM
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...as long as the edge isn't sharp enough to cut the rope should he fall and swing a bit.
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esoj00
Mar 1, 2005, 2:10 AM
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i see
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phxtradrock
Mar 1, 2005, 2:15 AM
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Check out Climbing Magazine of March 2005, page 84. This is the Tech Tip for Trad. It shows you how to use clove hitches and the rope to stand close to the ledge while still being connected to an anchor that is not close to the edge. Then, if after redirecting the rope, the friction is still too much for you to bare, simply do not redirct the rope. If you dont redirect the rope you wont need the "upward pull piece" pictured. Although your anchor system should still have one if the anchor is composed solely of trad gear.
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irockclimbtoo
Mar 1, 2005, 3:44 AM
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ab
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esoj00
Mar 1, 2005, 3:51 AM
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i had top outs in mind....
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crackrn
Mar 5, 2005, 5:39 PM
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In reply to: Thats a huge ledge if you're rope is running over it; kind of makes me wonder if you are walking or climbing.
Obviously you've never been on Regular Route up Fairview Dome. Pitch 5 (6?) has this ledge the size of a small swimming pool.
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irockclimbtoo
Mar 5, 2005, 8:16 PM
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ab
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bloquer
Mar 6, 2005, 3:38 PM
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In reply to: Although your anchor system should still have one if the anchor is composed solely of trad gear.
Why? If you're not gointg to lead above and have not redirected the belay the anchor only needs to be built for a downward force.
In reply to: Thats a huge ledge if you're rope is running over it; kind of makes me wonder if you are walking or climbing.
At the Gunks you see huge ledges all the time- your standing on the roof you just had to pull through!
Anyway redirect above to reduce the angle or add an additional piece as you finsh the pitch to keep the rope from abrading too much or extend the system to the edge and from there you can belay off the anchor or your waist. I prefer to extend the anchor ,belay off of it and stand at the edge so I can also watch my second come up.
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overzealous
Mar 6, 2005, 4:39 PM
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On a few occasions I've beleyed off the anchor with a reverso, tied in long with a clove hitch, stood by the edge, then redirected through a biner on my beley loop. The angle was such that I could pull the "brake" side of the rope from my stance to keep the beley tight, and the reverso would lock automatically if the second feel.
I have caught second falls this way, and it was no big deal. But I'd welcome and feedback about it if this is a really bad idea, for whatever reason.
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bloquer
Mar 6, 2005, 10:26 PM
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In reply to: On a few occasions I've beleyed off the anchor with a reverso, tied in long with a clove hitch, stood by the edge, then redirected through a biner on my beley loop. The angle was such that I could pull the "brake" side of the rope from my stance to keep the beley tight, and the reverso would lock automatically if the second feel.
I don't know what you mean by redirected when talking about belaying directly off the anchor. Extended yes but I don't think you normally redirect off your waist in this situation. You can stand back and belay off your waist and redirect off the anchor while tied in long. Anyway the only thing I think can be a problem with belaying directly off a solid anchor in the case you described is the reverso can be difficult in some situations. Some people swear by them for just this application, but you should be aware its not possible to feed rope out (lower)while the device is loaded. Usually this is not a problem but in the case of an accident or an overhang that leaves the second in midair some quick rigging is required. I can't exactly describe this as I don't use the device normally but I am sure plenty of others here can. -
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overzealous
Mar 6, 2005, 10:51 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: On a few occasions I've beleyed off the anchor with a reverso, tied in long with a clove hitch, stood by the edge, then redirected through a biner on my beley loop. The angle was such that I could pull the "brake" side of the rope from my stance to keep the beley tight, and the reverso would lock automatically if the second feel. I don't know what you mean by redirected when talking about belaying directly off the anchor. Extended yes but I don't think you normally redirect off your waist in this situation. You can stand back and belay off your waist and redirect off the anchor while tied in long. Anyway the only thing I think can be a problem with belaying directly off a solid anchor in the case you described is the reverso can be difficult in some situations. Some people swear by them for just this application, but you should be aware its not possible to feed rope out (lower)while the device is loaded. Usually this is not a problem but in the case of an accident or an overhang that leaves the second in midair some quick rigging is required. I can't exactly describe this as I don't use the device normally but I am sure plenty of others here can. -
No worries, I'm well aware of how to use my reverso, and I have done the rigging to unlock it and lower a second while it was weighted before. It's really not that bad. You do make a good point though, if I had to lower the second with the beley redirected through my harness like that, reaching the anchor to do so could be difficult. While this wasn't likely to be a problem on the climb where I used it, it is certainly something to be aware of.
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crackrn
Mar 7, 2005, 1:12 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: Thats a huge ledge if you're rope is running over it; kind of makes me wonder if you are walking or climbing. Obviously you've never been on Regular Route up Fairview Dome. Pitch 5 (6?) has this ledge the size of a small swimming pool. obviously not. how small of a swimming pool? a little kiddy one?
About 10x5...probably wrong..I suck at estimates. It took about 5 normal strides for the length and I could lie down with only my feet over the edge (I'm 5'4"). Didn't mean to sound bitchy. Sorry! :)
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