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keith_b00ne
May 9, 2005, 12:22 PM
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I have a Edelwise (sp?) 10.5 dry rope that is approximately only a year old. It has sustained several small lead falls, but no big whippers. I would put it in the 'occasional use' catagory. The sheath is fuzzy, from outdoor use, but not substaintial.
Here is the big part. The cross section of the rope is no longer round, but the shape of a foot ball. Not in one place, but the entire length of the rope. Should I be worried? Is the the effects of a gri-gri squishing on the rope? What should I look for?
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andback3
May 9, 2005, 12:46 PM
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that doesn't sound good, I'd play it safe. in general the rule is when in doubt, throw it out. On the other hand, I've never seen a rope break...
I dont' think i'd use it, but depends on how bad it is.
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janjaf
May 9, 2005, 12:57 PM
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Contact edelweiss and ask them - or ask that Black Diamond Guy, who does a lot of accident analysis on climbing gear. My best guess is that this is just grigri wear, and nothing too worry about, but since i don't use a grigri too often myself, it IS a guess.
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andrewph
May 9, 2005, 12:57 PM
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I have seen and used ropes like that before and i didn't think much of it.
I assume as you did that it is from the rope going repeatedly through a belay device which has slightly squished it.
I cannot see any why that would lessen the strength, as the fibers running the length of the rope should still be fully intact, though slightly compressed.
However it could also be caused by something diferent. Or I might just not be seeing something crucial.
We'll see what those more experianced people say. But I think it should be fine!!
Andy
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nsintros
May 9, 2005, 1:00 PM
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i've seen newish ropes flatten out like that from long full rope raps. its tough to say though not knowing how many falls and how big is a little fall. anyways as a general rule if there is any doubt to its safety retire it.
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azrockclimber
May 9, 2005, 1:01 PM
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Hmm...if it is along the entire rope then it should be okay. If youhave thin spots and thick spots retire it.
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gunked
May 9, 2005, 6:54 PM
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One thing to keep in mind is that what "shorter" falls are often the hardest on your rope. I believe, the 10-15 foot range causes the rope to strain the most. This is not a blanket statement!
This happens because there's not enough rope out to stretch over a significant length of rope. There's also less rope out to absorb the shock.
Basically, in a longer fall, the stress point (at the carabiner) is spread out over a length of rope. This, combined with the stretch spread out over more of the rope significantly decreases the stress in one specific spot(the carabiner).
I really hope that made sense! :roll:
As far as the flattening out of your rope, there could be numerous reasons. If I were you, I'd go over every inch of the rope(something I do at the beginning of every season, if not more, for each rope. Also, after a fall as I don't fall very often.)
Visually inspect and feel for flat spot or mushy spots. Sometimes, core fibers bunch up and create a flat spot. I'll manually work these out until it feels proper. If I can't...I now have another rope to hang a hammock with! :wink:
These are my methods. Do with them what you will.
My 2 cents
-Jason :D
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scottquig
May 9, 2005, 7:22 PM
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In reply to: One thing to keep in mind is that what "shorter" falls are often the hardest on your rope. I believe, the 10-15 foot range causes the rope to strain the most. This is not a blanket statement!
BTW, your rope is probably fine. Imagine that a rope gets just a slightly oval cross section. Now, every time you use it, it's going to tend to run through the belay device and the biners the same way (especially when loaded), flattening it even more. This happens a lot at gyms and on ropes used mostly for TR.
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robo555
May 11, 2005, 6:25 AM
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Doesn't the two replies above me just comes down to the fall factor?
Distance of fall divided by rope between belayer and climber?
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korntera
May 11, 2005, 7:23 AM
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I have an edelweiss 10.5M and it has gotten a little fuzzy but it is still round shaped. I have had mine for a year and it has taken a few falls but no big whippers. I only use ATC's but mine is nice and round(a little kinked still).
-Travis
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samuel
May 11, 2005, 7:47 AM
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In reply to: ... Here is the big part. The cross section of the rope is no longer round, but the shape of a foot ball. Not in one place, but the entire length of the rope. Should I be worried? Is the the effects of a gri-gri squishing on the rope? What should I look for?
And I thought a football was supposed to be round?
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stypins1
May 15, 2005, 5:06 AM
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I am starting to see the same effect with a rope I have. I have been using this rope for about 2 years and it has never sustained a fall. Well other than a toprope. I use a cinch and have seen a flatting or footballing effect. I washed it using a rope wash from the local climbing store and it seems to have helped. If I were you I would be more worried about recording the falls than a flatting of the rope. I personally record any lead falls and subtract them from the UIAA rating. When they get close they turn into toprope only or gear haul bag rope.
**"Remember when sex was safe and climbing was dangerous."**
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brokenarmboy19
May 15, 2005, 5:37 AM
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My rope broke and it was 6months old and in better shape than yours USE IT AS A BOAT ANCHOR LINE really trust me on this or i hear they make a good door mat
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112
May 15, 2005, 5:55 AM
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In reply to: My rope broke and it was 6months old
Please do tell.
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samuel
May 15, 2005, 7:30 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: My rope broke and it was 6months old :shock: Please do tell.
The first recorded breakage of modern type climbing rope? (excepting breakage due to sharp edges etc)
And by someone who has been climbing for about a year? Interesting.
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j_ung
May 15, 2005, 4:07 PM
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In reply to: My rope broke and it was 6months old and in better shape than yours USE IT AS A BOAT ANCHOR LINE really trust me on this or i hear they make a good door mat
Sorry, BAB19, but I have to call you on this. Ropes do not break before being acted upon by an outside force. To break it simply by loading it, you would have to generate force sufficient to break your body in two before the rope ever gives way. Did you run it over a sharp edge or some such?
In reply to: If I were you I would be more worried about recording the falls than a flatting of the rope. I personally record any lead falls and subtract them from the UIAA rating. When they get close they turn into toprope only or gear haul bag rope.
That is, of course, your choice to make, but you should know that unless every fall you take approaches factor two, you're wasting rope. UIAA test falls consist of an 80 kg weight falling 5m on 2.8m of rope. The vast majority of everyday lead falls don't come anywhere close to hitting that kind of load. You should be more worried about toproping, specifically if the rope lies over a rough patch as somebody falls over and over and over on the same crux. Ropes hate that kind of abuse and it's a far more likely occurrence than repeated factor-two falls.
As for the subject at hand -- flattened rope -- I suspect it's nothing to worry about and that it has more to do with the construction of the sheath in conjunction with the use of the Gri-gri than any deficiency in the core. However, I don't want to spout info that I don't know to be true. I'll consult an actual expert or two Monday morning and get back to you with a definitive answer.
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j_ung
May 16, 2005, 6:29 PM
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In reply to: As for the subject at hand -- flattened rope -- I suspect it's nothing to worry about and that it has more to do with the construction of the sheath in conjunction with the use of the Gri-gri than any deficiency in the core. However, I don't want to spout info that I don't know to be true. I'll consult an actual expert or two Monday morning and get back to you with a definitive answer.
keith_b00ne, I emailed back and forth with a couple of rope makers. The official word is that your flat rope is not unsafe in and of itself. Most likely, it will have little or no impact on your climbing whatsoever.
Ropes become prone to flat sections like you're experiencing during manufacture. One cause could be improper tension of sheath yarns during braiding. Some rope models also just have relatively soft cores. I suppose that in either case, use of a Gri-gri or Cinch might exacerbate the issue. But unless your rope is actually difficult to handle, it's not a safety concern.
I hope you didn't throw out your rope. :wink:
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