|
alex913
Jun 17, 2005, 6:34 PM
Post #1 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 30, 2005
Posts: 10
|
Fellow Climbers:
Please forgive my naiveness but I am somewhat new to sport climbing. I'm racking up on commercially available draws and almost all (if not all) seem to have a straight-gate biner on the bolt end of the draw.
I'm thinking of putting together my own set of draws and wonder if there is any reason NOT to use bent gate biners on the bolt end of the draw, irrespective of what I use on the rope end.
I would like to use wire-gates on the rope end, but why are all pre-assembled draws out there with a straight gate on the bold end?
Thanks,
Alex
|
|
|
|
|
nowinowski
Jun 17, 2005, 6:58 PM
Post #2 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 5, 2003
Posts: 134
|
don't question the ways of the rock.
|
|
|
|
|
climboard
Jun 17, 2005, 7:17 PM
Post #3 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 10, 2001
Posts: 503
|
In reply to: I would like to use wire-gates on the rope end, but why are all pre-assembled draws out there with a straight gate on the bold end? Thanks, Alex
Straight gate biners are the least likely to catch on the hanger and unclip from the bolt accidentally.
|
|
|
|
|
mgoodro
Jun 17, 2005, 7:18 PM
Post #4 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 26, 2004
Posts: 119
|
Safety. The bent gate has a higher probability of opening due to vibration. Straight gates can also vibrate open, but are less likely to. Wiregates do not have this tendency.
All my draws are wiregate on the bolt/pro end and bent gate on the rope end.
|
|
|
|
|
micronut
Jun 17, 2005, 7:57 PM
Post #5 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 11, 2002
Posts: 1760
|
another reason to have different biners on your draws is this: the bolt end biner on the draw can and does get burred with little pieces of metal resulting from metal to metal contact with the bolt hanger, and these can damage a rope sheath.
|
|
|
|
|
outsideguyzak
Jun 17, 2005, 8:16 PM
Post #6 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 24, 2005
Posts: 169
|
do straight gate on the bolt and bent for the rope. DO NOT use bent on bolt. It is less safe, more likely to come open, and more tolling on your rope.
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Jun 17, 2005, 8:19 PM
Post #7 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
Signal to noise ratio: 1:4.
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
olderic
Jun 17, 2005, 8:54 PM
Post #8 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 17, 2003
Posts: 1539
|
In reply to: Signal to noise ratio: 1:4. -Jay
1:5 now
|
|
|
|
|
bler
Jun 18, 2005, 2:21 PM
Post #9 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 22, 2004
Posts: 302
|
duuuude, just untie, and draw the rope through the hanger, no need to even BUY biners or worry about flutter or gates or any of that nonsense
:twisted:
|
|
|
|
|
toejam
Jun 18, 2005, 3:24 PM
Post #10 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 24, 2002
Posts: 358
|
http://www.rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=69620&postdays=0&postorder=asc&topic_view=&start=15
|
|
|
|
|
cyanamid
Jun 18, 2005, 3:57 PM
Post #11 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 8, 2004
Posts: 161
|
In reply to: Safety. The bent gate has a higher probability of opening due to vibration. Straight gates can also vibrate open, but are less likely to. Wiregates do not have this tendency.
Somehow this just doesn't seem right...... :P
|
|
|
|
|
steezy
Jun 21, 2005, 5:34 AM
Post #12 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 30, 2005
Posts: 92
|
no bent-gate biner should ever touch a bolt. It's sacrilegious.
|
|
|
|
|
petsfed
Jun 21, 2005, 6:38 AM
Post #13 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 25, 2002
Posts: 8599
|
What makes a bent gate so easy to clip also makes it very easy to unclip. Especially when you're clipped to a bolt hanger.
|
|
|
|
|
theonlynebraskaclimber
Jun 23, 2005, 1:13 PM
Post #14 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 17, 2005
Posts: 62
|
Use the straight to the wall so u don't fall and die, then use the bent to the rope cuz it is easy to clip, if it is more easy to clip you wont back clip as much.
|
|
|
|
|
bill413
Jun 23, 2005, 1:32 PM
Post #15 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 5674
|
In reply to: duuuude, just untie, and draw the rope through the hanger, no need to even BUY biners or worry about flutter or gates or any of that nonsense :twisted:
Sooooo much cheaper! Also, I think this might give more friction in case of a fall, making the belayer's job easier.
|
|
|
|
|
crimpandgo
Jun 24, 2005, 7:05 PM
Post #16 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 15, 2004
Posts: 1005
|
In reply to: Safety. The bent gate has a higher probability of opening due to vibration. Straight gates can also vibrate open, but are less likely to. Wiregates do not have this tendency. All my draws are wiregate on the bolt/pro end and bent gate on the rope end.
Can you back this up with factual data?
Also,
"Straight gate biners are the least likely to catch on the hanger and unclip from the bolt accidentally"
Can you back this on up with factual data?
My vote is bent gates aren't used is because they are more expensive and their intended purpose (making rope clip in easier) doesn't provide any advantage on hanger side.
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Jun 24, 2005, 10:56 PM
Post #17 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: In reply to: Safety. The bent gate has a higher probability of opening due to vibration. Straight gates can also vibrate open, but are less likely to. Wiregates do not have this tendency. All my draws are wiregate on the bolt/pro end and bent gate on the rope end. Can you back this up with factual data? Also, " Straight gate biners are the least likely to catch on the hanger and unclip from the bolt accidentally" Can you back this on up with factual data? My vote is bent gates aren't used is because they are more expensive and their intended purpose (making rope clip in easier) doesn't provide any advantage on hanger side.
Idiot. Why don't you use a little restraint and stop guessing at the correct answers to safety questions.
Christ, two correct, unambiguous answers in the whole thread. What a fucking worthless website.
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
caughtinside
Jun 24, 2005, 11:11 PM
Post #18 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 8, 2003
Posts: 30603
|
In reply to: Idiot. Why don't you use a little restraint and stop guessing at the correct answers to safety questions. Christ, two correct, unambiguous answers in the whole thread. What a f---ing worthless website. -Jay
U shudnt post mean stuf w/o backing it up. We R all here to lern.
|
|
|
|
|
crimpandgo
Jun 24, 2005, 11:12 PM
Post #19 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 15, 2004
Posts: 1005
|
In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: Safety. The bent gate has a higher probability of opening due to vibration. Straight gates can also vibrate open, but are less likely to. Wiregates do not have this tendency. All my draws are wiregate on the bolt/pro end and bent gate on the rope end. Can you back this up with factual data? Also, " Straight gate biners are the least likely to catch on the hanger and unclip from the bolt accidentally" Can you back this on up with factual data? My vote is bent gates aren't used is because they are more expensive and their intended purpose (making rope clip in easier) doesn't provide any advantage on hanger side. Idiot. Why don't you use a little restraint and stop guessing at the correct answers to safety questions. Christ, two correct, unambiguous answers in the whole thread. What a f---ing worthless website. -Jay
Hey jack*ss,, oops, i mean JT
nice to see you adding to the worthlessness. Thanks again. I certainly could have done without it, but its good for a laugh.
If its such a worthless website why the hell do you troll through the posts adding useless critical crap?
If you were a real man, you post up your answer. Or are you afraid you might be wrong :oops: come on sucka. Post up... or STFU
Oh, P.S. If I do have to read your benign critical crap posts, then I think I will keep posting my "thoughts" just to piss you off. Its kinda fun :)
|
|
|
|
|
caughtinside
Jun 24, 2005, 11:18 PM
Post #20 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 8, 2003
Posts: 30603
|
Well, perhaps you should consider backing up your belay loop with a third loop, 2 might not be enough for you. I call this tard-dundancy. :P
I'd provide a link, but I'm too lazy. 8^)
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Jun 24, 2005, 11:28 PM
Post #21 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: Oh, P.S. If I do have to read your benign critical crap posts, then I think I will keep posting my "thoughts" just to piss you off. Its kinda fun :)
Your use of quotation marks above is the first thing you've ever written that I agree with.
-Jay
P.S. You need to look up the word "benign."
|
|
|
|
|
crimpandgo
Jun 24, 2005, 11:31 PM
Post #22 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 15, 2004
Posts: 1005
|
In reply to: Well, perhaps you should consider backing up your belay loop with a third loop, 2 might not be enough for you. I call this tard-dundancy. :P I'd provide a link, but I'm too lazy. 8^)
Wow,, That was witty. You sleeping with Jay too :oops: You do seem to follow him around alot.. How sweet.
Reduce your laziness and provide the link. Extra redundancy never hurt anyone. Lack of it will. I don't really give a rats-ass whether you agree with the practice of not.
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Jun 24, 2005, 11:35 PM
Post #23 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
In reply to: You sleeping with Jay too
No, he's not; and neither are you, by the way.
And what the fuck is extra redundancy? Is that like being pregnanter?
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
caughtinside
Jun 24, 2005, 11:45 PM
Post #24 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 8, 2003
Posts: 30603
|
In reply to: Can you back this on up with factual data? My vote is bent gates aren't used is because they are more expensive and their intended purpose (making rope clip in easier) doesn't provide any advantage on hanger side.
So, right after you ask someone else for factual data, you "vote" on some totally baseless, as well as incorrect, opinion?
Hey look, I can make up wrong answers and look stupid! Better tie on another belay loop for redundancy!
Clown.
|
|
|
|
|
flipnfall
Jun 25, 2005, 12:54 AM
Post #25 of 35
(6247 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 18, 2004
Posts: 717
|
The reason you don't have bent gates on the bolt end is because bent gates were designed to ease one-handed clipping. There is no advantage to having the bent gate on a bolt hanger.
I'm also of the strong opinion that a bent gate on a hanger does not increase risks. Ironically, a bent gate on the rope end is more dangerous because they are more likely to unclip if you back clip them. I remember when they first started to come out with "dog-legged" biners (i.e., bent-gate) and the back-clipping/unclipping problem was one of the reasons some climbers resisted using them at first. But with education of proper clipping, the fear of using them was reduced.
WHAT BINER IS BEST
A keyed-gate without a notch is probably the one main biner to offer an advantage for the bolt end. Without a notch, the biner is easier to clip and unclip without the notch getting caught on the edge of the hanger. If you're looking for a biner that's "best for the bolt," use the keyed-gate biner.
GT
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
1
