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bigjonnyc
Jul 25, 2005, 12:08 PM
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So my girl and I went to the Red this weekend for a couple days of climbing. Once we got down there we stopped at the Zoo/Roadside lot to head up for a couple climbs at the Zoo. Once we got up to the crag, we were organizing our gear and such, and I decided to put on some bug spray (Deep Woods Off, non aerosol spray bottle). I applied a liberal amount to all exposed skin, and then, after thirty seconds or so, began the task of dealing with all said skin burning like crazy for about 5 or 10 minutes, as if I'd fallen asleep naked in the Sahara at high noon. I was wondering if anyone else has had such a reaction, and if there was a suitable substitute for this product.
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rock_geek
Jul 25, 2005, 12:51 PM
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I once put OFF Deep Woods in my backpack contained in a plastic bag. It then somehow leaked and eat through the plastic bag. Luckily I got it out of my backpack in time. I threw it out the next chance I got. The only time I use that strong of Deet is when I am actually in very very deep woods where the mosquitoes are bigger than humming birds. I haven't yet found a good substitute.
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winglady
Jul 25, 2005, 2:10 PM
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You might want to try Cutter Advanced insect repellent. It uses a different repellent, Picaridin, which apparently has been used in Europe for a while, but just recently was approved for use in the US. The nice thing is that it doesn't stink like DEET. We found it to be almost as effective as DEET -- but not quite as effective.
Of course, it's possible you'll have a reaction to this stuff as well, but maybe you can give it a try on just a small area of skin first to see if it bothers you.
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bigjonnyc
Jul 25, 2005, 2:19 PM
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Thanks winglady, I'll definitely look into that next time we're going out. The strange thing about it is I've used this product on many other occasions. The only reason I can think of is that I was dripping in sweat when I applied it. Maybe because my pores were more wide open!?!? Who knows. :?
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carrotclimber
Jul 25, 2005, 3:03 PM
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I have more problems with bug spray stinging when I apply it after I have been sweating. Maybe when you skin is sweaty and your pores are open due to the sweating, it allows more of the DEET to get into your body? Just a theory... but I have encountered that as well. I would try toweling off first, if you have been sweating. That seems to help me.
Another thing, that I can't guarentee will work, is garlic. Have you ever heard of garlic being planted around other plants to keep the bugs and animals away from it? The same theory goes for humans ingesting it. I got the practice from my dad and brother, who were both in the boy scouts. They would take garlic pills when they went camping. I think that eating garlic, and then sweating that out, seems to keep the bugs away without harsher chemicals, like DEET. Of course you smell like garlic... but is that any worse than being in the great outdoors and smelling only the bug spray that you put on?
Here is something that I found online:
"People who eat garlic tend to get fewer bites from insects like ticks, according to research. It also likely applies to mosquitoes as well.
One problem with garlic, of course, is the smell, but generally a few cloves a day are tolerated by most people. If you develop a socially offensive odor then all you need to do is slightly decrease the amount of garlic you’re consuming until there is no odor present. Garlic is an herb, however, so if you do not like it or it makes you feel sick, this is your body's way of telling you that you should avoid it."
http://www.mercola.com/fcgi/pf/2004/feb/28/garlic_health.htm
This article says, "some studies suggest that taking thiamine (vitamin B1) 25mg to 50 mg three times per day is effective in reducing mosquito bites." That is news to me... but interesting. It still says that DEET is the most effective repellent on the market.
http://www.drgreene.org/blank.cfm?print=yes&id=21&action=detail&ref=38
Good luck.
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chemicalclimber
Jul 25, 2005, 3:10 PM
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Usually those sorts of bug sprays are sold as a solution in ethanol or something similar, so it could be the alcohol that made your skin burn as opposed to the DEET itself (same feeling as rubbing alcohol on a fresh wound). You might look around for other brands that are a solution in something aside from alcohol and see how that goes. Good luck to you. :)
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alvchen
Jul 25, 2005, 3:49 PM
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What's amazing is I recently found an insect repellent patch online. I have yet to try it, but it looks astounding. A transdermal patch that repels bugs for 36 hours!!
http://www.outinstyle.com/...litaryGear/OMEZONE-1
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scrapedape
Jul 25, 2005, 3:51 PM
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In reply to: I once put OFF Deep Woods in my backpack contained in a plastic bag. It then somehow leaked and eat through the plastic bag. Luckily I got it out of my backpack in time. I threw it out the next chance I got. The only time I use that strong of Deet is when I am actually in very very deep woods where the mosquitoes are bigger than humming birds. I haven't yet found a good substitute.
I had a bottle of DEET leak in my pack - it dissolved a plastic bag and the handle of my Swiss army knife, but didn't do any damage to my pack. I've also had DEET disfigure the plastic arms of my sunglasses. I will sometimes apply DEET to nylon pants if I'm in really buggy country, with no ill effects on the fabric. My conclusion based on this anecdotal evidence is that while certain plastics are very sensitive to DEET, nylon isn't one of them. Still, I wouldn't soak my rope in it.
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bigjonnyc
Jul 25, 2005, 4:13 PM
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That patch is definitely interesting, but it seems to be a rip off. All it's stating to do it give your body excess thiamin, so that you can sweat it out and repell mosquitos. If that does in fact work, then why not go to a local drug store and buy B-1 tablets? It's around $5 for 180 pills, and they're about 67 times the daily need per pill. That's 180 days worth for $5, or 6 cents a day, vs. a dollar a day minimum for the patches.
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fear
Jul 25, 2005, 5:30 PM
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You don't need much DEET to be effective... Apply it to clothes first and then very sparingly on skin. Use a 30% mix....
Some people just get sensitive to it anyway. Try a small test area next time...
-Fear
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oldrnotboldr
Jul 25, 2005, 5:54 PM
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I do a great deal of trekking, kayaking, and climbing in northern Ontario where the skeeters take a pint of blood on each attack. Many studies done by Canada support that a little DEET goes a long way. I have used the new stuff picaridin and it works, I don't think as well as DEET but pretty close. The idea with DEET and many other solutions is to make a person stinky to skeeters. It does not necessarily kill them. I have gone 2 weeks without a good bathing and that combined with DEET worked quite well. Unfortunately it also works even better at repelling other people :x Not the best idea when out with a female friend!
There is a substance, permethrin (sp?) that kills them but is only to be used on clothing and such--not bare skin. It is a bit pricey and is supposed to last about 2 weeks. I have used that as well and mine did last about 2 weeks.
The cheapest, easiest to use, remains to be DEET or picaridin and increasing B12. My daughter is really tasty to the buggers so she uses a minimum of increased B12 and picaridin.
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gunked
Jul 25, 2005, 6:06 PM
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Not a fan of DEET!
I've had great success with AVON SKIN-SO-SOFT bug repellent.
Good Luck!
-Jason :D
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oldrnotboldr
Jul 25, 2005, 7:27 PM
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Yeah, I've had good luck with Skin So Soft also. It just doesn't last long on me (30 mins or so). My skin absorbs it quick then it doesn't work. So every half hour or so I have keep applying it.
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microbarn
Jul 25, 2005, 7:41 PM
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I have had good experiences applying the 100% DEET to the collar on my shirt and bottom of my pants. There is no skin contact and the DEET is strong enough to scare the bugs more than the 2 feet I need to protect my exposed skin.
side note, my dad sprayed the 100% stuff on his face accidentally and had facial twitches the rest of the day.
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winglady
Jul 25, 2005, 9:35 PM
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In reply to: Not a fan of DEET! I've had great success with AVON SKIN-SO-SOFT bug repellent.
I also dislike DEET, but it does work. As I said, this newer product (new to the U.S.) is pretty good too, and doesn't reek.
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jumaringjeff
Jul 25, 2005, 9:52 PM
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yeah I've read about allergic reactions to DEET before. the medical journals called it cancer.
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scottb63
Jul 25, 2005, 10:17 PM
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Has anyone tried those new bug repellant clothes? I think they are made by Royal Robbins or Ex-officio. Just wondering how they work.
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jt512
Jul 25, 2005, 10:25 PM
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In reply to: yeah I've read about allergic reactions to DEET before. the medical journals called it cancer.
Bullshit.
As to actual allergic reactions, they are rare: about 1 in 1000 persons, and typcially only result in a mild rash, according to the Centers for Disease Control. It is possible that you might be allergic to another ingredient in the brand of insect repellent you used.
In spite of the anecdotal reports of users having "good success" with alternative repellents, controlled studies have shown that DEET vastly outperforms all other repellents tested, so you might want to try another brand of DEET-contraining insect repellent. Try it on a small patch of skin first, to see if you react.
-Jay
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fear
Jul 25, 2005, 11:10 PM
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In reply to: yeah I've read about allergic reactions to DEET before. the medical journals called it cancer.
lol
It'll melt ropes, Spectra slings, cause blindness, impotence, lupus, CFS, too.... It's actually a secret government weapon...
-Fear
"Just another tool of the man"
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jt512
Jul 25, 2005, 11:35 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: yeah I've read about allergic reactions to DEET before. the medical journals called it cancer. lol It'll melt ropes, Spectra slings, cause blindness, impotence, lupus, CFS, too.... It's actually a secret government weapon... -Fear "Just another tool of the man"
It's worse than that. Most DEET preparations also contain the solvent DHMO. See the DHMO website: http://www.dhmo.org/
-Jay
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fear
Jul 26, 2005, 12:57 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: yeah I've read about allergic reactions to DEET before. the medical journals called it cancer. lol It'll melt ropes, Spectra slings, cause blindness, impotence, lupus, CFS, too.... It's actually a secret government weapon... -Fear "Just another tool of the man" It's worse than that. Most DEET preparations also contain the solvent DHMO. See the DHMO website: http://www.dhmo.org/ -Jay
Jay,
This is a PUBLIC forum. Please do some research before spreading fear and panic. Deet might be a silent killer but to compare it to the ravages of DHMO is absurd....
-Fear
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nptskin
Jul 26, 2005, 1:33 AM
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www.dmho.org wow some one has way to much spare time on their hands. but then again maybe we should ban water lol
Rob
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crgwhe
Jul 26, 2005, 5:42 AM
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In reply to: Not a fan of DEET! I've had great success with AVON SKIN-SO-SOFT bug repellent. Good Luck! -Jason :D
I have heard on a number of occasions that the Avon Skin-So-Soft works pretty well but haven't had an opportunity to try it until recently. While at a customers house, I had the pleasure of decontaminating and cleaning her in ground spa which had become a breeding ground for mosquito and no telling what else. I had ran out of my always reliable Deep Woods Off a few days ago.
About 4 hours into the job, and after loosing so much blood to mosquito’s I thought I would go into shock, the customer offered me some of the Avon stuff. Seemed to work fairly well. As an added bonus, my skin felt silky smooth with the fresh scent of baby powder.
Personally, I’d rather smell of DEET than walk around with the scent of a woman. I wonder if Avon makes any for men?
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woland84
Jul 29, 2005, 6:52 PM
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[quote="carrotclimber"]I have more problems with bug spray stinging when I apply it after I have been sweating. Maybe when you skin is sweaty and your pores are open due to the sweating, it allows more of the DEET to get into your body? Just a theory... but I have encountered that as well. I would try toweling off first, if you have been sweating. That seems to help me.
I've had the same burning sensation when I apply DEET after sweating, but I dont have any problem with it when i havent been sweating. You are probably right about the open letting the DEET in.
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gunked
Jul 29, 2005, 7:30 PM
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jt512,
I had no idea what DHMO is. I checked out the link and read some interesting statements.
Is there a list of specific list of products and companies that use DHMO that you know of? I couldn't find one.
I also checked out one of the opposing websites speaking highly of DHMO (DHMO your all-natural friend http://www.armory.com/~crisper/DHMO/) . Interestingly enough, that website was brought to you by the Scorched Earth Party http://www.armory.com/...er/Scorch/index.html . I copied this directly from their site:
[brown] The basics
Here at the Scorched Earth Party, we are dedicated to a few simple principles:
* that the concept of "life is sacred" is the best joke we've heard this year.
* that nothing satisfies like clubbing some moron to death with a lead pipe.
* that you can never get laid enough.
* that the world will continue to deteriorate until 90% of its population is eliminated.
True happiness will never be yours unless you rise up with us. Join the 10% with the lead pipes. Help save the world through random, messy violence, and then wallow in carnal pleasure among the ruins. [/brown]
Don't they seem like a nice, wholesome group? :shock:
If there's any more info you'd recommend checking out, I'm interested.
On a side note, I couldn't find any info on DHMO used in bug spray or DEET production.
-Jason :D
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