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madrock


Dec 8, 2005, 6:28 PM
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Hello, 40 pcs are being sent out to members. All gone now look forward to hearing from you guys, PM Me with any info once you have the devices in hand.
Want to get a few RC.COM Members to try the new Paradox Belay. We have a few just arrived we can send out, if your interested let me know.

http://www.madrockclimbing.com/cart.php?target=category&category_id=253

Just weighed the device (Final production)to confirm Its is lighter than any of the Tube style locking devices that have variable friction or have locking notches. 67grams. Please compare with the actual weight of other devices not what the manufacturer claims.


Sorry for the link, had a problem loading an image on the site. Somebody drop one in for me if you get a chance.

Joe
Mad Rock


Partner j_ung


Dec 8, 2005, 6:33 PM
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Curious: it's not an autoblocker, which seems to be all the rage these days. Did you guys expressly decide not to do that? If so, why? If not... nevermind.

More thoughts: your site says that you made it better, but the list of features (forged and machined asymmetric aluminum tube-style body that regulates the rope friction depending on its orientation. Anodized for corrosion resistance and styliní good looks and a rigid coated steel cable for safety and durability. Works with ropes 9.5-11mm. Feeds quickly, yet locks off tightly) doesn't seem all that revolutionary. No offense, truly. I'm just wondering what's better about it.


Partner j_ung


Dec 8, 2005, 6:39 PM
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Oh, and here you go:
http://www.madrockclimbing.com/images/paradox.jpg


madrock


Dec 8, 2005, 6:43 PM
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We were not trying to reinvent the wheel here, other devices like this are Die Cast which means they are heavier and weaker. Its your basic belay, only a little better, and allot less expensive. $12.95


Partner j_ung


Dec 8, 2005, 6:45 PM
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Well, I'm all for lighter and cheaper. Thanks.


vegastradguy


Dec 8, 2005, 6:48 PM
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is it rated for doubles/twins? if not, you should re-work it to be rated for sub 8mm lines for added versatility. if one thing about the reverso irks me more than anything is that it is not rated for sub 8mm lines.


jred


Dec 8, 2005, 6:49 PM
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In reply to:
Want to get a few RC.COM Members to try the new Paradox Belay. We have a few just arrived we can send out, if your interested let me know.

http://www.madrockclimbing.com/cart.php?target=category&category_id=253


Sorry for the link, had a problem loading an image on the site. Somebody drop one in for me if you get a chance.

Joe
Mad Rock
Sure, I will try one out, the gym I work at already sells your shoes/harnesses so maybe we could sell your belay devices as well. I work at the Great Wall in Whistler, just send it there in care of Jesse.


dutyje


Dec 8, 2005, 7:08 PM
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Looks like the ATC-XP but at a much better price. I'd be interested to see how durable it is. As Jay pointed out, it doesn't seem to autoblock. There's still plenty of market out there with people who don't need that feature, but there are also many quite satisfactory devices to fill that need already. I think this has potential, though, because it's got a great price, and if it's easier to use than other similarly priced belay devices, could quickly become the preferred tool for entry level climbers.


brad84


Dec 8, 2005, 8:29 PM
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i would love to try one out for you guys

ill pm you my address; if there is a different way you want to go about this let me know. ill gladly comply.


risos


Dec 8, 2005, 8:34 PM
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not only at a better price than the ATC XP but also the dented section seems to be more forgiving on the rope's sheath.
Hmmm id love to have one but when will it get to Mexico


Partner climboard


Dec 8, 2005, 8:51 PM
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I agree with J_ung, make it an autoblocker and
I'd be sold.


chalkfree


Dec 8, 2005, 10:16 PM
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What does stronger really mean, when has a belay device ever broken?

Looks good other than that, I'd be sold on cheaper alone. Also props on avoiding the ridgid loop, I'd never buy a device with one.


climbing_steve


Dec 8, 2005, 10:18 PM
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pm sent


dutyje


Dec 9, 2005, 5:05 AM
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ATC-XP: 89g
Paradox: 84g
Reverso: 81g

I'd stick with marketing the cost savings on what looks to be a design that would work just as well as everything out there. Ten bucks cheaper than an ATC-XP will move a lot of units.


overlord


Dec 9, 2005, 5:28 AM
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id be glad to test it for you. if you ship to europe offcourse.


Partner tattooed_climber


Dec 9, 2005, 6:55 AM
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where does one sign up?


Partner j_ung


Dec 9, 2005, 7:52 AM
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In reply to:
ATC-XP: 89g
Paradox: 84g
Reverso: 81g

I'd stick with marketing the cost savings on what looks to be a design that would work just as well as everything out there. Ten bucks cheaper than an ATC-XP will move a lot of units.

I agree. That's probably your best bet, Madrock. As somebody pointed out, belay devices don't need to be stronger and it doesn't appear to be lighter than everything out there. Ten bucks, though... that's a winner for sure.


d1ll1gaf


Dec 9, 2005, 7:55 AM
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I'll be a tester. Drop me a PM.


anykineclimb


Dec 9, 2005, 8:15 AM
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So just curious...

why Paradox?


mrnomas


Dec 9, 2005, 8:30 AM
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Sign me up to test it as well.


dvd


Dec 9, 2005, 9:25 AM
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I'll test it.

can you re-work the grooves to work with skinny ropes? down to 8mm?

~D


madrock


Dec 9, 2005, 12:10 PM
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Questions.

Why Paradox? The device is a contradiction, it grabs the rope solidly yet feeds the rope quickly.

Who gets them and where? WE are giving out a few. We will mail them to Europe, Canada, Mexico and the USA. The first few folks who post something productive and let me know they are serious about actually trying the item. Extra points if you are already a customer. PM Me your address and why you think you should get one.

Why is stronger better, devices do not break? Yes, devices do break although you do not hear about it often, they also wear out and sometimes build sharp edges because they are not durable. By using a stronger and more durable production method we can make a device stronger, lighter, more durable and a better overall value. Yes, I agree, stronger alone is not a huge benefit.

Why is Mad Rock making a belay instead of another shoe? We felt we could make a better product in this catagory for less money. We also needed them for our climbing packages which will be availabe this spring (Harness, Shoes, Chalk Bag, Chalk, Locking HMS and Belay)

Why Not skinny Ropes? They do work on Skinny Ropes, we did not post it on the original fact sheet because we were not sure until just recently when production models were tested. Better of be conservative with that type of information. I will have the site updated.

Autolocking?? Yes we will probably make one for 2007. The testing and development on these is very tricky and will take the team some time to finalize. In the end if we cannot bring something better or a better value to the market we won't do it.

Lighter? It is much lighter than other devices of this type (please don't ask me to be rude and name them) also the final production is lighter than was originally projected and posted on the site. No, it is not as light as my Munter Hitch 0 lbs. but nothing is.


sidepull


Dec 9, 2005, 1:00 PM
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In the end if we cannot bring something better or a better value to the market we won't do it.

I like that philosophy - I think a lot of people have "dinged" Madrock either for poor quality or for "generously" using other designs. I think the first critique is generally made on assumption and without experience. I don't know anything about the second. These potential dings aside, Madrock has definitely had a positive impact on the community. Shoes are cheaper, they are more innovative, and pads are getting bigging and cheaper as well. If you don't believe me, compare other shoe companies prices and designs. Most have responded with multiple sub $100 models and a lot of these designs have heels and toes that look very similar to Madrock designs. I like the innovation.


crazywacky


Dec 9, 2005, 1:30 PM
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PM sent.. I look forward to hearing from you.

Scott


natrajk


Dec 9, 2005, 1:57 PM
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Looks like a great device! My ATC-XP is seeing some signs of wear now, so it would be great to test something that will last a bit longer.

If you need some norwegian testers, count me in!!!

And I love how it looks!! :D

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