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adrenaline_smack
Dec 27, 2005, 4:02 PM
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ok, so i found a new crag at my hometown
my basic question is, when cleaning whats the purpose? to make a route safe by removing potential hazards such as blocks that could fall, or is it simply to remove the dirt and lichen to make it climable?
i would like to hear from people with experience as to what their opinions are on this subject
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salamanizer
Dec 27, 2005, 4:28 PM
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Uh, yeah! I'd say all of the above. It really depends on the area and situation. Knocking loose flakes or teetering blocks and some lichen is one thing. Toting a pressure washer hooked up to a generator followed by a large pry bar is another. On the other hand. In some areas, people may get upset if you so much as urinate on the moss. Just use your head and some common sense.
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deserteaglle
Dec 27, 2005, 8:33 PM
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Don't fuck up anything is my motto. If there is a cactus under a boulder I wanna climb, I just make damn sure I don't fall on it.
Of course you can't tell other people what to do, they'll do it anyway if they want to. Basically you can only patrol yourself, think long and hard about the consequences of your actions, and then do what you think is the right thing to for everybody.
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j_ung
Dec 27, 2005, 8:36 PM
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I think you should direct that question toward other climbers in your area.
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dirtineye
Dec 27, 2005, 8:36 PM
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Registered: Mar 29, 2003
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Be sure you kill all the rare. exotic, delicate, beautiful POISON IVY.
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iamthewallress
Dec 27, 2005, 8:43 PM
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I tend to clean only what I need to in order to make a pitch climbable. Then, after doing it, if it seems like a pitch that's really great and that others are certain to enjoy and it fits with the aesthetic of the area, I may clean it up some more. (i.e. I'm not going to clean up something that is in a remote/obscure area beyond the minimum, but if there's a splitter 5.9 off of the ground at an already popular and scrub-a-dubbed crag, I might do a little extra excavation.)
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climbersoze
Dec 30, 2005, 5:53 AM
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If you are set on cleaning the pitch, try to do it in a way that does not make it stand out so much. What I mean is don't strip everyt piece of vegetation off of it, and don't rake away all the leaves and detritus on the ground. Just make it climbable, and safe (to an extent - this is rock climbing after all).
Whoever it was that said check with the locals, I would take their advice too. See what the local ethics are.
As far as beating down the area... if the pitch is that good, then it will naturally get worn over time. (Unfortunately).
Everyone here can preach about what they think you should do, but the bottom line is you are going to do what you want in the long run. Just be smart and respect the area and the people in it.
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tattooed_climber
Dec 30, 2005, 6:52 AM
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route cleaning "ROUTE" cleaning.....you clean the minium to make the route safely climbable...
nuf said
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cracklover
Dec 30, 2005, 6:54 AM
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Sport or trad?
I've zero experience creating sport climbs.
With trad - my ethic has been if it doesn't come out with a nut tool, it stays where it's put.
And minimal impact to vegetation necessary to complete the moves. For example, if there's a moss-covered ledge, no need to nuke the whole ledge - just clear the spot where the climber will climb through. Here's the thing - if your climb becomes a mega-classic, you can guarantee that all the moss on that ledge is going to get chucked off sooner or later. And I guess that's probably fine. But if it never sees another ascent, you'll be a lot happier if you come back and see the area in fairly pristine shape.
GO
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healyje
Dec 30, 2005, 8:33 AM
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CT has a long history of trundling to make routes safe. That said, you are talking CT and you out to be conservative with anything you do because it is highly unlikely you are the first person to "discover" the rock in question. If its climbable it probably has been many time over, just not bolted. Again, in your neck of the woods cautious and conservative would be my advice...
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daggerx
Jan 6, 2006, 11:47 PM
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I think it depends on the area, but in general I just remove dirt and moss, buecause most likley if I am cleaning it, it is my route and im making it the way i want it.
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landgolier
Jan 6, 2006, 11:56 PM
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Local ethic always prevails, but generally any block that is absolutely free of the wall should be trundled/lowered. SAFELY. Anything else loose, mark it. But yeah, if it's in CT and you didn't need a machete to get to it, it probably ain't your FA. Ask around.
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sbaclimber
Jan 7, 2006, 12:09 AM
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Ethics are important, but what about outright rules?
Around here, there are lots of parks/preserves/etc where you may well get the go-ahead to put up a new sport route, including cleaning up loose rock, but god forbid you touch a native plant :shock:. In some of the areas that even includes brushing off moss and lichen to climb a previously established route/boulder problem!
Anything on private land is a different matter though. Then it is entirely up to the land owner/manager as to what you may or may not do. Personally, after having someone die here from some very large blocks breaking loose, I think if looks dodgy and it moves when you pry on it a bit (and you have permission to do so), trundle it!
Just because a block has been there for the last 50,000 years, doesn't mean it won't let go when you start climbing on it.
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dangle
Jan 8, 2006, 3:29 AM
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Hey I'm from CT. Not only western CT but Westport, CT.
Nuke 'em all and let God sort 'em out.
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jred
Jan 8, 2006, 3:38 AM
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Registered: Jul 27, 2003
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In reply to: I think you should direct that question toward other climbers in your area. |
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rad_dog
Jan 9, 2006, 1:31 AM
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Assuming there are no endangered species - I usually find myself asking the question "what is more rare here, unique geological features to climb on or dirt, vines, lichen, etc."
The rock is an awesome part of the natural environment that is being very slowly eroded by vegetation (along with other forces) in a transition to become topsoil. I think its good that we clean some of that stuff off and maybe add a few years to the life of a cliff.
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sbaclimber
Jan 9, 2006, 1:38 AM
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Registered: Jan 22, 2004
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In reply to: The rock is an awesome part of the natural environment that is being very slowly eroded by vegetation (along with other forces) in a transition to become topsoil. I think its good that we clean some of that stuff off and maybe add a few years to the life of a cliff.
I am sure the ice climbers won't mind....
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sbaclimber
Jan 9, 2006, 1:41 AM
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Registered: Jan 22, 2004
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In reply to: The rock is an awesome part of the natural environment that is being very slowly eroded by vegetation (along with other forces) in a transition to become topsoil. I think its good that we clean some of that stuff off and maybe add a few years to the life of a cliff. |
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