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krusher4
Feb 23, 2006, 5:55 PM
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7 for 15 not even 50/50. Weather....and getting sketch out....
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brutusofwyde
Feb 23, 2006, 6:19 PM
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In reply to: I so hope that I've been suckered into a troll, I man people really aren't hauling & bivying on The East Butress of El Cap or SnakeDike. It's got to be a joke, right? right?
No troll. I've bivied on Snake Dike. Best way to be at the front of the line.
I've also hauled and bivied (and then retreated) on E. Butt El Cap. Learned more about climbing walls on that one trip than any one trip since. Wouldn't recommend it these days, but E. Buttress was a lot less crowded in 1978. And a lot of walls were a lot harder.
The East Buttress of El Cap took three days for the first ascent.
Why has it got to be a joke?
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climbhigher
Feb 23, 2006, 6:49 PM
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Hey, We where going to go do nutcracker in 3 days. But, woke up the next day with a big hangover. Guess that woud be a joke.
What all the Big Wall Veterans say is, If you push through the first 2 days, Your sucsess rate and enjoyment of the climb goes way up.
I am 10 for 14. These are on all easy to moderate walls. Have not climbed a "Hard" El Cap route yet.
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tradclmbr
Feb 23, 2006, 6:53 PM
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wow.........I really did (unknowingly) resurrect this post originating in 2003 (must have clicked on a related posts link). Still - somewhat comforting to know that bailing (still) isnt an anomoly!
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grippedclimer
Feb 23, 2006, 6:57 PM
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I love this Thread. If there was one thing I am good at it is bailing on walls!
1) West Face Leaning Tower - Summit
2) Suth Face/Southern Man of Washington Column - Summit
3) Moonlight Buttress - bailed on pitch 2 from rain.
4) Moonlight Buttress - Summit in 30 hour push in winter.
5) Prow on Washington Column - bailed from rain on p2.
6) Prow on Washington Column - partner got gripped jugging 1st pitch. Crapms in forearms - it was funny!
7) Lurking Fear El Cap - Summit
8) Muir Wall - not really Muir wall, jugging up fixed lines w/ haul bags to the heart w an ahole partner. I decided to bail, not fun!
9) Muir Wall - Bailed on Pitch 3. Partner and I got psyched out.
10) 10 days After Washington Column - Summit
11) Prodigal Son - bailed 2 pitches up from rain.
12) Lunar Ecstacy - bailed after my long 4 hour lead on C3 pitch 5. Ran out of time.
13) Zodiac on El Cap - nearly crapped my pants after taking a 30 footer near the end of the first ptich. Said screw it and went free climbing.
14) Spaceshot - summit.
After years of counseling I am fine! I am over wall climbing! hehe
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dingus
Feb 23, 2006, 7:05 PM
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I've learned book volumes from my master Brutus but perhaps the most lasting lesson(s) is this:
A. There is no shame in bailing. Period. and
B. When that dude latches on to the leg of a route, he don't let go. 1, 2, 3, whatever... if the route is worthy of his attention, he will be back to bring it home.
Tenacity coupled with a laid back, 'hey man, we're gonna have some fun, eat some good food and drink some beer while we're up here' is far preferrably to my way of thinking (and living) to the old Royal Robbins black and white 'searching, ever searching' angst and shit.
The last climb I did with Brutus I had to rig a belay directly beneath this god awful Sword of Domocles chockstone, with a hideous 9 inch overhanging crack running up its side. We weren't sure if the damn thing was even attached to the wall and a serious fall woulda rung my bell in maybe even a fatal way (long story).
The dude laughs the grave diggers' laugh... arranges 3 big bros and 2 Valley giants off the back of his harness and LAUNCHED UP THAT FUCKER.
Me? I was perfectly happy to jug it. The point is, in the midst of a very serioud wilderness wall outting, one we had previously bailed from for time... the man was back to settle a score. The alternative pitch was 150 feet of gruesome gardening... the man from Wyde opted for his home turf.
Cheers Brutus.
DMT
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guanoboy
Feb 23, 2006, 7:35 PM
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I guess i'm 9 for 20.
reasons for bailing
time constraints:
Partner had to catch a flight 1x
Winter soloing is really slow 3x
Not rested before start, moved too slowly 1x
injury
Partner broke foot 1x
Partners got altitude sickness 2x
Cut rope 1x
weather
Deep powder snow made access too difficult 1x
idiocy
off route (wrong mountain! - discovered at sunrise) 1x
I have succeeded on routes in winter and i've succeeded soloing (even soloing in winter) but these conditions have dramatically reduced success.
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skinner
Feb 23, 2006, 8:41 PM
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In reply to: Otherwise known as "snail eye" or "small sack" syndrome. Scared. For whatever real or imagined reasons. Scared.
In reply to: off route (wrong mountain! - discovered at sunrise) 1x |
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epic_ed
Feb 23, 2006, 10:56 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: Bailed? Did someone say "bailed"? Oh yeah! I'm the freakin king of bail. Read some of my TRs to get an idea of why, but it genereally comes down to inexperience. I'm two for...six. Bailed off the Prow twice; Zodiac once; Prodigal Sun once; Moonlight Buttress once. Ed, Never met you or talked to you, only read your posts on ST, and I haven't done a wall yet. But for some strange reason I think, after I try a solo, that you're the one I'd rather get on a wall with than almost anyone else. Sure, there are the experienced dream partners like Werner, Ammon, Ivo ( and Texplorer), but somehow I get the sense it would be all the more satisfying to top out with you than anybody else. Who knows? But you keep at it as you are actually a source of considerable example and inspiration for me...
Thanks, Joe! I think it would be fun. Aren't you heading to Zion some time soon for that solo attempt?
A few more bails and one solo summit (Spaceshot) have been added since that first post. I figure I'll keeping going back to do Zodiac until I get it right. Another rematch with Moonlight may be in the works for April (David? any luck yet).
And if Kevin would make some plans to get his ass down here from the Great White North, I might be able to hook up with him for a wall, too!
Ed
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epic_ed
Feb 23, 2006, 11:03 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: Otherwise known as "snail eye" or "small sack" syndrome. Scared. For whatever real or imagined reasons. Scared. Ok, can someone elaborate for- Mr. Naive (me).. "snail eye"?
Womens equivalent to "small ball" syndrome. I think Wallress coined that one.
Ed
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skinner
Feb 23, 2006, 11:23 PM
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In reply to: And if Kevin would make some plans to get his ass down here from the Great White North, I might be able to hook up with him for a wall, too! Ed
I'm workin on sometime around the end of April buddy!
In reply to: Womens equivalent to "small ball" syndrome. I think Wallress coined that one. Ed
Thanks for clearing that up
I don't think I've ever seen a snails eye to make the coloration
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golsen
Feb 24, 2006, 12:40 AM
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Bailed on Touchstone in Zion, about 1982, way too slow.
Returned a year later and sent.
Success on the Titan 1983 (I know its not a wall but it is a big pile of sand).
Success on Space Shot, Zions.
Bailed on Lowe Route N. Face of Angels Landing, again too slow,
Returned a year later and sent.
Bailed on Half Dome attempt in a day due to weather.
Bailed on Mt. Hooker in the Winds, technical difficulties and rain 7 out of 9 days.
Success on 3 of 3 Free Climbing walls in the Black.
Success on the Yellow Wall, the Diamond (another free climb in a day, but still a big wall IMO).
Bailed on Nose in a Day. Rapping from the Great Roof is quite a ways.
Returned to NIAD, 17 hours.
Sent Salathe in 23 hours.
That is 5 failures and 10 successes and two of them I have not been back to.
Failures were mainly because of speed. But on Mt Hooker, we had no topo, thought we were on a new route and it was hard, scary, wet, lonely and cold. 7 hook moves in a row off of the belay with a poor looking knifeblade crack to go to and wondering if we were really going the right way. I admit, I chickened out and my partner didn’t want it either. That was about 7 pitches up. After rapping off it totally dumped so it was fortuitous.
I agree with some here that you can learn a lot from those failures. One thing I learned after rapping off from the great roof of El Cap, that it was safe to get off that thing. When contemplating a day ascent of the big stone, it helps to know that you can bail easily. There are times to bail and times to keep on.
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iamthewallress
Feb 24, 2006, 2:39 AM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: Otherwise known as "snail eye" or "small sack" syndrome. Scared. For whatever real or imagined reasons. Scared. Ok, can someone elaborate for- Mr. Naive (me).. "snail eye"? Womens equivalent to "small ball" syndrome. I think Wallress coined that one.
It's something that I've heard others say...I can't take credit.
It's when you have a big boner for a route, and then you actually get to the base and it wilts like a snails eye does when you touch it.
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skinner
Feb 24, 2006, 2:58 AM
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Ah okay then.. there's been many a time that I've "wilted" just from looking at the approach :)
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holdplease2
Feb 24, 2006, 6:56 AM
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Snail Eye:
You know, how when a snail has its "eyes" all extended out, and then you touch it and it sucks into its head, like nothing?
Well, you're stepping onto a bad hook, your dick is the snail eye, and it just got touched.
Thats gettin' snail eye.
-Kate.
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lambone
Feb 24, 2006, 6:57 AM
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Funny pmyche, actually I think I remember the bails more than the summits, they were certainly more emotional.
2 bails on WFLT...partner issues, it is allways their fault right?
1 bail on Tangerine Trip (p4), partner flake but he pulled through on 2nd attempt.
2 Bails on North America Wall (p2), partner flake and '04 October death storm.
5 EC summits, 3 LT summits, and 3 WC summits.
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texplorer
Feb 25, 2006, 1:21 AM
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Big walls are all about:
- planning
- getting a good partner
- waiting for the right weather
- being able to suck it up when your partner's huevos (snaileye) shrink
- and of course a little luck.
I know people that brag about their "epics." Some seem to revel in mishaps. While these make for entertaining stories I find that many times they are the result of poor planning and pure stupidity. While I am no genius or climbing juggernaut, I try to learn from others mistakes especially when confronting a new challenge. In additionto that, streamlining your own operation from previous experiences is important too. Probably what gets me up most things is a balls-to-the-wall attitude. I especially liked reading about Bridwell on the FA of the P.O. wall telling his disenchanted partners if they weren't with him then they could walk the plank. While I have never told a partner to walk the plank I try to embody the Bird's sentiments when climbing a daunting wall. You'll be surprised and proud of what you can accomplish with good planning, advice, and a good attitude.
Going down is only the option of last resort. I think we all to often leave ourselves an "out." Sometimes nature and bad luck will conspire against you but luck seems to have less to do with things the more I climb.
Anyway, just a few thoughts-
Tex
14 Walls savored to the summit
1 Bail endured to Sickle Ledge
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healyje
Feb 25, 2006, 2:24 AM
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Karsten - you da man!
pmyche - LOL! Good one...
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hosh
Feb 25, 2006, 3:55 AM
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The only time I tried a "wall" (though it really wasn't a "wall"), my partner and I sat down and talked long and hard about going up or turning back, on a really nice ledge (if only we had bivy gear!)... In the end, we decided to turn back due to weather moving in (cold and fast), lack of water (we literally ran out) and too much crap we didn't need relay and not enough crap we did need. We were moving way too slow (only 5 pitches in 9 hours!) due to nasty route finding, hard sections of climbing, and the fact that everytime we turned around to admire the view, it was absolutely breath-taking. We spent a lot of time at belay stations just drop-jawed and wide-eyed. The lamest thing was that another party (two of our friends, one of whom just happened to be a professional guide) just a rope-length to our left sumitted in the same time that it took us to get a little less than half way then bail. yeah, we're lame and weak. But we sure had a good time! The rest of our trip was spent in a tent on an ice feild in the rain. Lame. But, at the end of it all, I was the Champion of the Chess board, and that's almost as good as sumiting (yeah right)!
hosh.
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skinner
Feb 25, 2006, 5:11 AM
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In reply to: Snail Eye: You know, how when a snail has its "eyes" all extended out, and then you touch it and it sucks into its head, like nothing? Well, you're stepping onto a bad hook, your dick is the snail eye, and it just got touched. Thats gettin' snail eye. -Kate.
Ok.. I DEFINITELY get it, been on that bad hook.. been touched!
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addiroids
Feb 25, 2006, 5:14 AM
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My record is like 18 successes (counting Spaceshot as a "wall") and 4 fails, and 1 fixed rope for us.
First wall ever was SFWC. We were slow, I had to get back for a wedding...Gumbies.
#2 was WFLT. We had Spaz fix the last pitch for us b/c it was dark, and it was only my second wall. He wanted to pass us (IAD) so we just worked together with him and he returned the favor. Lesson here folks...If someone wants to pass, you help them do it if they want. Don't be dicks and not let someone pass!!!!
#3 Prodigal. Fixed to 3, and bailed from 8 the next day due to swinging leads and being gumbies again. Partner didn't wanna climb in the dark.
#4 Moonlight. Fixed to RB, and bailed at 9am due to rain.
#5 Prow. Buddy hyperextended his knee bad on a fall on P2 after the roof belay. I had to make 3 trips back to the car b/c he couldn't carry weight. That was my night of food poisoning in C4 where I honestly threw up 40 times that night.
FINALLY I MET MY CURRENT PARTNER!!!!!
We did the Prow in 6 hours after fixing to 2 the day before...topped out at 2:30pm!!! Holy shit...I like this stuff!!!
We have done Zod (2days), TT(2.5 days), NA(6 days), Prow(F&F), SQ(18hrs), TDA(F&F), WDD(15hrs), RRHD (day), LibCap(F&F), Keeler (10 hrs), Conness (12 hrs), Space Shot (6 hrs), Moonlight (7.5 hours), Lunar X (2days), Swoop Gimp (F&F), Cosmic Trauma (2days), and many others (only count V's and VI's except for SpaceShot b/c everyone else counts it).
I have wanted to bail on every route except for Moonlight. I have wanted to quit climbing on half of the routes and have said it to myself in my head. The thing about doing a wall with a partner is that both of you are very busy and don't have a lot of time to go play, so if you bail, not only are you screwing yourself, but you are fucking over your partner who spent $100 minimum to get to the Valley (or Rockreation for real rock walls) for gas and food, and now you are being a pussy. If weather is imminent and death will result, bail.
However if you are just going to be uncomfortable, or god forbid...suffer...keep on it. Just think about how those Bavarians are way harder than you are. Drag the fucking wedgie out of your pussy and keep climbing. Yes it will hurt, and yes, it will take longer than you want, but you decided to do it, so do it.
I like how someone said that if you make it over 1/2 way to the top, you are psyched and the bailing thoughts leave. Have faith in the system, have some sack, and commit.
Also, DON'T BITE OFF MORE THAN YOU CAN CHEW!!! I should be leading A4 walls now, but we are conservative in our objectives. Get some successes and do stuff attainable at first. Planning on Mesc or PO this April though, so that should be fun. Learn how to lead in blocks and short-fix. It will cut 1/3 of your time off!!! It ain't hard to figure out.
Good luck bro!!!!
TRADitionally yours,
Cali Dirtbag
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far_east_climber
Feb 25, 2006, 9:37 PM
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How can I most honestly state my history?
Bailed WFLT P7- 2 slow parties ahead. Held up for 8 hours by someone on a pitch.
Bailed Prow IAD P6 - 2 long falls by partner, somewhat scratched up, motivation lost.
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far_east_climber
Feb 25, 2006, 9:38 PM
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How can I most honestly state my history?
Bailed WFLT P7- 2 slow parties ahead. Held up for 8 hours by someone on a pitch.
Bailed Prow IAD P6 - 2 long falls by partner, somewhat scratched up, motivation lost.
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flamer
Feb 25, 2006, 11:51 PM
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How funny! I just got back from Zion and find this thread raised from the dead!!
Well let's see I guess we're all adding to our previous list's, so....
Since the last episode.....Crap! Does it have to be in order???
Summited Spaceshot....Actually showed up to try a 2nd ascent on the back side of The Great White Throne...got stuck in the mud trying to get too it....no go! So, same day decided on SS. Left the car at noon (in March) topped out just at dark...like 6hrs? Can't remember the exact time! Not that it matters, cause damn it was fun! Cool new partner..this was our first climb together.
Bailed off the Halli wall in the Black canyon, 5 pitch's up started raining/snowing about bed time....no fly on the ledge, bivy sack leaked, "sleeping" in water fall. The next morning? DOWN!! then back up the gulley, blah. Learned alot on this attempt though, my partner and I made good descion's(well other than not bringing a fly!). He wrote a TR about it on this site....
Summited Skull Queen F&F....had alot of fun with a new partner. Funny though, Now she doesn't RETURN MY CALLS?????? (yes I'm giving you shit!)
Summited OG Route on the Rainbow wall, Red rocks. 6.5 hrs. This route is incredible. Had a blast with another new partner, josh let's climb this spring? LOL, another new partner? Maybe there's a pattern?
Summited Reg. route on Halfdome. Interesting story...drove 2 straight days to get to the valley, set up camp, got to sleep about 1am. Woke up at 5am. Biked over to the trail head. Hiked the death slabs, climbed the route in 12hrs. Got lost getting back to the base(there was alot of snow up there early June2005!) Got lost in the death slabs...bivied!! My first unplanned bivy. First light we high tailed it to the Cafe. Great experience!
This time with an old friend/partner! Pattern broken!
Summit Lunar X, 13hrs no fixed ropes. This was done on wednesday(feb. 22nd 2006) what a sweet route. Super fun day with a great friend/partner.
Holy marathon post!
So I'm 12 for 18.
josh
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