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caughtinside


Sep 27, 2006, 11:57 AM
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How often do you tweak your rack?
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I'm always experimenting with different stuff/combos/racking methods.

I've tried racking on the harness, gear sling, and multiloop gear sling.

I've tried racking 10 nuts on one biner and 6 nuts on one biner.

i've tried having all my runners tripled, and having a bunch of over the shoulder slings.

I've tried a single set of cams, a double set of cams, and two sets of cams, where they're different brands and don't exactly line up size wise, so that there are no size gaps.

I've climbed with hexes, and with tricams.

I've freeclibmed california granite with hybrid aliens, regular nuts, and offset nuts.

I got some C3s and tried those out instead of aliens last weekend. Just as a joke, I left the tags on them, and nearly fixed the 1. :oops:


Just thought I'd throw this out to generate a little discussion for The Group. My rack is seldom the same for more than a few outings, I'm always trying new things, trying to cut weight, trying new cams, etc. The goal being to be lighter and faster.

I think I've gained a few things from all this messing around. I've gotten to where I can climb on just about any rack, and make do just fine. Differrent brands of cams, no biggie. Partners who rack way differently, just fine.

how bout you?


csproul


Sep 27, 2006, 12:05 PM
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I think this is an important skill. It is good to be able to climb with other people's racks and be able to use their configuration and vice-versa. It is such a pain to have partners that must have their own rack and set-up. You end up carrying two racks to the crag, or you end up wasting a lot of time during change-overs to get the rack set up exactly how you want it. Definitely learn to use gear other than your own and rack in a way that is good for both you and your partner.


brotherbbock


Sep 27, 2006, 12:24 PM
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I think I've gone through the pretty much the exact same sequence as you caughtinside. Every time I go out trad climbing I am constantly adjusting things and experimenting with different techniques. Currently I use the metolius gear loops with my cams racked on the multi-gear loop side, and my stoppers on the single gear loop side. I have sling over my shoulder with some single biners rackes to them, and I also use trad draw racked on my harness loops. It seems to work good for me. A good motto for trad climbing when refering to racking is "to each his own". Whatever works for you is good, and if you can use other peoples racks as well then you are set. Climb on.


fulton


Sep 27, 2006, 12:25 PM
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fact: a rack of climbing gear is more susceptible to entropy than any another collection of objects in the known universe.

I definitely rack my gear on a multi-loop gear sling and my harness in a particular order WHEN I'm leading all the pitches.

But, on the occasion of swinging leads, the rack is always a combination of my favorite gear and my buddy's favorites...

But, my buddies also order their gear (on the sling) differently than I do - so the chaos multiplies, now more gear and different order.

On the other hand, by the time we get to the top, i generally know where everything is again... just in time to stash the rack in the backpack.


saxfiend


Sep 27, 2006, 1:52 PM
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I've only got about 40 leads under my belt, so I still don't have a fully standardized racking scheme. But there's some things I do pretty much the same on every lead:
six tripled runners
six slings over the shoulder, each with a biner attached
a Metolius gear sling for lighter stuff (draws, extra biners, nuts)
small to medium cams and tri-cams on the front loops of my harness
larger cams, hexes and large tri-cams on the back loops

Cordellettes sometimes end up on my harness, sometimes on the gear sling.

The arrangement of the cams on my front harness loops varies a lot, usually just divided up evenly left and right.

JL


summerprophet


Sep 27, 2006, 2:27 PM
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One thing to be aware of is your comfort level. If i am heading up Royal arches, I can climb on whatever you throw at me. I have done it many times before, and the climbing is easy enough that I can stand and find what I need to set a piece. If I am heading up Serenity / Sons then i am going to be a little more specific about where things are and how to get them. If you are approaching your limit (especially on a climb with finicky placements, and poor stances) you want to be able to know that the third thing on your rack is a #2 TCU.

That being said, I have a standard rack that is double nuts, cams from tips to a #3 Camalot, that I add to or remove from depending on memories of the route or guidebook beta.


stymingersfink


Sep 28, 2006, 4:40 PM
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I'm always experimenting with different stuff/combos/racking methods.

I've tried racking on the harness, gear sling, and multiloop gear sling.

Pray tell, did you discover that you hated the multi-loop gear sling as well, or was your experience with it generally positive?

How about racking wires on key-lock gates?

Myself? Wouldn't do it again. I have found that I prefer wire ovals for that.

YMMV.

Of course, the rack that attends to the route is constantly being tweeked to fit the route, but what gets to the base is always the same.


caughtinside


Sep 28, 2006, 4:48 PM
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Yeah, I hate the multiloop gear sling. But I can deal with it. I would have put that in my first post, but I didn't want to prejudice any responses.

To date, I've only racked wires on clunky, old school ovals. I like those.

I have a partner who racks about 10 wires on one neutrino, and I do NOT like that. I really don't like more than 6 or so wires per biner.

Another partner racked nuts on two spirits, it was ok, but i didn't climb with them enough to form a strong opinion. I think I like the oval shape best though, cause it's easy to flick to the one you want. Hangups are rare.


grampacharlie


Sep 28, 2006, 5:04 PM
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Re: How often do you tweak your rack? [In reply to]
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So call me anal retentive, but I deffinately have a system for racking, and it's always on the harness. I don't like having all that weight on my shoulder, and I don't like having gear in between me and the rock... esp. when I'm feeling weak, scared, and pumped. :oops:

The amount/ type of gear I have changes from route to route, but My system for multipitch is usually:
Small stoppers on the right, large on the left
double set of cams up to #2 or #3 depending, with one of each on each side of my harness.
Alternating bigger stuff should the need arise for it.

The reason for the alternating is so that I never have to do that awkward reach behind the back to find the cam I need because I can't get my freaking arm out of that damn chimney. :( That awkward, horrible chimney. :x


cam


Sep 28, 2006, 5:37 PM
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I don't have a rack because I'm a guy, but my wife has one and I tweek it every chance I get just to make sure they're, I mean it, is still in good order.


iamthewallress


Sep 28, 2006, 6:25 PM
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For free climbing my rack always looks exactly the same give or take whatever extras I think a route might call for. It makes me less versatile w/ partners, except that this is usually not so much of an issue as I have more versatile partners who are usually willing to climb on my rack. I've trialed and errored my way to what seems to work best for me, and by sticking w/ it, I always know where to find what I'm looking for.

The multiloop blows...but not as bad as the multi-loop w/ double D attachment. That's was in my beginner whoopsee box until I sold it.

For walls, the rack is always annoying, and I've never hit on anything that was best, except that I like to rack the second or third string sets of sizes grouped on biners and the first or first/second string on individual biners. I also like my chest harness (Yates).


Partner epoch
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Sep 28, 2006, 7:03 PM
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I would say that every climb that I do has it's own rack. Usually, though, I have a standard rack that will get me up pretty much anything that I am stupid enough to try... Hasn't failed me yet. And since I've been the one with the most gear lately I usually get to have the rack of my choosing.


Partner angry


Sep 28, 2006, 7:18 PM
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If I were to have it my way, every time, it would be a plain 1" sewn runner for a gear sling. Aliens up to orange, Wild Country up to 4, and BD (not C4) for 4 and 4.5, then a #6 friend to top it off.

For nuts I put smallish nuts (#7bd and smaller) on one biner and larger on another. Both of these biners are purple and no other biners on the rack are that color. The RP's are on a separate biner too. I usually carry about 10-12 stoppers per biner (lots of doubles), no worries.

Draws are on the harness and are 2ft tripled up runners.

The only tweak is on big roofs, the cams are unreachable behind me so for big roofs, I use my gear loops.

The nice thing with my way is that it's fast. I will never be the slower racker of the group. And I can pull cams off the sling without looking and have the right size. There's something to be said for knowing where your rack is in space.


Partner epoch
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Sep 28, 2006, 7:59 PM
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In reply to:
....
For nuts I put smallish nuts (#7bd and smaller) on one biner and larger on another. Both of these biners are purple and no other biners on the rack are that color.....

Purple???


Why purple??? I'm confused...


qtm


Sep 28, 2006, 8:06 PM
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Pray tell, did you discover that you hated the multi-loop gear sling as well, or was your experience with it generally positive?

How about racking wires on key-lock gates?

Myself? Wouldn't do it again. I have found that I prefer wire ovals for that.

YMMV.

Of course, the rack that attends to the route is constantly being tweeked to fit the route, but what gets to the base is always the same.

I like the multi-loop gear sling. I like the gear sling because it allows you to shift the gear around when you've got to scum in a dihedral, when you're trying to get over a roof, things you find at the gunks. Also, being short, I find the gear on the harness gets caught up a lot.

But I've started leaving the sling behind, because I tend to carry too much gear with the sling. I'm learning to be more efficient with less gear.

I have some new DMM Shields for racking cams, it's light, thin, and the wirelock is great. I'd rack everything on the Shields but they're a bit expensive.

As for "tweaking", I think that I do what a lot of people do, adjust for the route. Most of the time I'll rack on the harness, but if I'm going to scum a dihedral I'll use gear slings so I can move it around.


jimfix


Sep 28, 2006, 8:11 PM
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Purple???


Why purple??? I'm confused...

:lol:


Partner angry


Sep 28, 2006, 8:51 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
Purple???

Why purple??? I'm confused...

:lol:

Well, I like to climb with my eyes open. I can readily discern purple from silver, but only with my eyes open.


flamer


Sep 28, 2006, 10:47 PM
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I use a multi-loop gear sling.

For Almost everything I use a 'Standard rack'....1 and a half set nuts(racked on 2 separate biners-nuts with "holes' on one nuts W/O on the ohter)
cams from a green alien to a #4 camalot.

If I need doubles of something for a certain climb I take it.

Generally about 12 runners and draws, all racke don the harness.

You want to climb fast? Learn to do more with less.

...and don't be a pansy.

josh


billcoe_


Sep 29, 2006, 4:16 AM
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What a bunch of gear whores.

Of course, I include myself in that statement. Love climbing with other whores to experiences things like C3's before you have to commit huge $$ to them.

Love it.

Like having the same rack for hard stuff so I can grab quickly, like what angry says, but I love a fat soft gear sling. I'm a pussy and a gear whore that way.

I love light too. WC Helium's for instance. DMM nuts.


billcoe_


Sep 29, 2006, 4:20 AM
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What a bunch of gear whores.

Of course, I include myself in that statement. Love climbing with other whores to experiences things like C3's before you have to commit huge $$ to them.

Love it.

Like having the same rack for hard stuff so I can grab quickly, like what angry says, but I love a fat soft gear sling. I'm a pussy and a gear whore that way.

I love light too. WC Helium's for instance. DMM nuts.


iamthewallress


Sep 29, 2006, 10:41 AM
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I'm a sissy.

The quote bot replaces your crude misogenist word with one that's simply misogenist. Nice.


kachoong


Sep 29, 2006, 11:05 AM
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....personally I hate gear slings.... it gets in the way and detracts from the freedom of movement and enjoyment that I get out of climbing. I've never had much money and so my "rack" reflects this in many ways. A "Bit-sa" rack is what I have. Never had a full set of anything so I haven't had the luxury of trying out all the combinations possible.

I also like to rack my wires thin. I like to have around six to eight per biner, and usually (on single pitch days) have a set of big and a set of small wires. Multi-pitch days I'll have a set of each on each side. I used to rack them into small medium and large, but couldn't keep up with the division. It's easier to see if they're big or small. Now I keep doubles or triples of certain sized wires, depending on the climb and crack size.

I used to have a biner on each sling over my shoulder, but now I keep those biners racked together towards the back of the harness. Cams are racked on their own biners, but most of the time I will throw in a wire before I use a cam, so I don't normally use too many cams.

I definately agree that each climber has their own legitimate way, but also everyone can always learn a new trick or two or refine something to regulate their efficiency.


krusher4


Sep 29, 2006, 1:12 PM
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The way I rack and what I rack is decided on the needs of the climb and what works best. I have a standard selection for area's I climb in yes, but I pair is down to as little as I can stomach...then go a little more. If I am climbing less the vertical stuff I will use a gear sling, if it's overhanging I rack it on my harness, left dihedral I rack on the right and vise-versa. A little attention to this sort of stuff the better your life is and the better you climb.


cam


Sep 29, 2006, 5:02 PM
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Okay, some uptite prick flung a turd at my previous post, which I thought was in good fun, so to make it right I'll post something constructive to the thread...

So I rack gear on a multi loop sling from smallest to largest as the larger pieces tend to see less use. They typically sit more to the back and are less of a pain that way. This puts the smaller and most often used gear right in front of me. I rack my runners on my harness loops, longer ones at the rear and shorter ones at the sides. I have noticed that most folks tend to rack nuts with several pieces on one biner and cams on their own biners but while I follow suit with nuts, (the smaller half of the set on one biner and the larger half on another) I tend to rack cams two to a biner. Usually doubles of a size together or incremental sizes together like a 1.5 and a 2 or a 4.5 and a 5. The one exception is tricams. I rack them all on one biner. Not sure why. Habit I guess.

As for the gear itself, I tend to rack with the same pieces most of the time. If I'm going somewhere new, I rack it all and par it down while eyeballing a climb. So, while the gear will change depending on the destination, the gear selection for say WHitehorse and Cathedral will likely never change.

One trend of note, which I'm sure is common among us all is that as I add more gear to my rack such as larger cams, items like hexes are left behind. With the addition of C3's, my aliens are finding less rock time. Not sure if that counts as tweeking or not. Maybe in a broader sense.

I'll also try to eyeball the climb and see if I can rack the majority of gear on the side that appears to be most likely to be farthest from the rock to avoid having bulk between me and the wall.

On sport climbs, i try to rack my draws according to which hand i think I will be clipping with more often.

cam out.


stymingersfink


Sep 30, 2006, 6:41 PM
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Re: How often do you tweak your rack? [In reply to]
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Okay, some uptite prick flung a turd at my previous post, which I thought was in good fun.


previously posted:

In reply to:
I don't have a rack because I'm a guy, but my wife has one and I tweek it every chance I get just to make sure they're, I mean it, is still in good order.


I'd second that, but she hasn't given me a chance yet! :wink: When/If we finally meet to do some climbing, we're using your rack!

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