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joe
Feb 3, 2007, 4:14 PM
Post #26 of 128
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it's time to put a jihad on these motherfucks.
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kevinheiss
Feb 3, 2007, 10:11 PM
Post #27 of 128
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THAT IS WHY YOU SHOULD LEAVE YOUR GEAR OVERNIGHT.
It sucks that your gear was taken but honestly you're asking for trouble by leave stuff outside. That also goes for people leaving quickdraws on a project route.
Also it would be really hard to charge them for theft since it was on public property. you would have to prove it is your gear which would be extremely hard to do
Kevin
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drfelatio
Feb 4, 2007, 5:20 AM
Post #28 of 128
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kevinheiss wrote: THAT IS WHY YOU SHOULD LEAVE YOUR GEAR OVERNIGHT.
I believe you meant "SHOULD NOT"
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alexmac
Feb 4, 2007, 7:54 AM
Post #29 of 128
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bbirtle wrote: limeydave wrote: If you take something that isn't yours, without the intent to return it, you are a thieving scumbag. If 'trash' or leaving stuff on lines offends you, call the powers who be to deal with it - that way people get their stuff back and a lecture on 'littering'. Some people just aren't taught right and wrong - I blame the parents. I agree completely and am astounded anybody would side with the thieves. An odd piece of gear high on a route with no marks and no reasonable way to return it is the only case that strikes me as ethical to take something that isn't yours. All the rest is just plain theft.
Not taking sides , but that sounds like logic of one murder is okay, 100 is not .
If we extend the logic to anything , its wrong to have booty at all period, as someone will always cross a line. The Tent and cleaning it cause its garbage is a good example :)
The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
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mattyp
Feb 4, 2007, 11:43 AM
Post #30 of 128
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So who here believes in the "Leave No Trace" philosophy? Don't leave anything. It is simple.
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billcoe_
Feb 4, 2007, 3:54 PM
Post #32 of 128
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alexmac wrote: The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
I see. So you are saying that when you go to the crags expecting to do a bunch of routes one day, they are all 3 pitch routes. It is cold in the am so you are dressed warmly and head to the first route which is a finger crack that doesn't take gear larger than 1". You leave your coat, lunch, water and the double rack of big Camalots you need for the next route, in your backback at the base of that climb.
Some of you are saying that it is OK for anyone who sees that to steal it, and some of you are saying just expect someone to steal it, you should have left it in the car and hope it doesn't get stolen there.
It is wrong for anybody who dosen't own it to take it and thieves should be beat senseless if they are caught.
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endercore
Feb 4, 2007, 4:04 PM
Post #33 of 128
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i really don't understand how anyone can justify this type of behavior.
booty that was obviously lost, such as a quick-link attached to a bolt, is free game.
A completely rigged highline was obviously not lost, was clearly left with the intention with returning, and therefore removing it is obviously stealing.
to the op. I'm really sorry someone stole your line man. That sucks, I hope Karma bites the people that took in right in the ass and that you eventually get your gear back.
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roy_hinkley_jr
Feb 4, 2007, 4:10 PM
Post #34 of 128
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The only thing senseless is Billcoe's reply. What a moronic post. You really see no difference between stashing some gear where it's out of sight for a few hours and leaving highly visible ugliness out over night? Even quickdraws are much less obtrusive than a highline prominently strung across a gap. Do whatever you want on your own land. But you leave garbage like that on public property and it is the responsibility of all climbers to clean up your litter. Irresponsible people like Billcoe, and of course Dean What-A-Dick-Potter, are part of the reason climbers are losing access.
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nextclimb
Feb 4, 2007, 4:14 PM
Post #35 of 128
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The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
Intrigued and not judging, I'd say the world is a good place but, just for perspective, give us examples of what you have stolen because someone tempted you. Also, would like to know you philosophy on the following:
1. Let's say you put the twenty in an unlocked drawer
2. How about a $1,000 in a locked file cabinet that a screwdriver could open?
3. A million in a trust fund?
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alexmac
Feb 4, 2007, 4:29 PM
Post #36 of 128
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Registered: May 23, 2005
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nextclimb wrote: The world is not a good place, if you leave something out, your to blame. If I leave 20 bucks on my desk at work and a cleaner takes it, its my fault for tempting someone who makes min wage or less.
Intrigued and not judging, I'd say the world is a good place but, just for perspective, give us examples of what you have stolen because someone tempted you. Also, would like to know you philosophy on the following:
1. Let's say you put the twenty in an unlocked drawer
2. How about a $1,000 in a locked file cabinet that a screwdriver could open?
3. A million in a trust fund?
Well, Drawer and cleaner should not go, I would classify that as direct thief, were as money out in the open (wallet, walkman, etc)is the owners fault.
I have expereinced this in a former office where a new person to Canada did a great job, even left the 200 bucks in drawers but got tempted by accidental cash left on a desk.
I wonder if it was cleanign an eye sore or stealing gear; I guess without the actual "thief" speaking up we will never know.
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styleboy
Feb 4, 2007, 9:12 PM
Post #38 of 128
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It doesn't matter if you're tempted or not. Taking 20$ bucks off a desk is stealing. And I love how you stereotype 'minimum wage' workers. Not that it would be right, but I hope someone steals a bunch of your shit.
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areyoumydude
Feb 4, 2007, 9:17 PM
Post #39 of 128
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This has happened to me before so I am not suprised. This gear was not abandoned. There is no climbing access issuses there because no one climbs there. It was in a place that is not a destination area. The view there is quite nice but it's not like there is a lack of nice views around here. I'm not sure what the motivation for doing this was. I just want the gear returned and if anybody that has any info to contact me.
Peace, Larry
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alexmac
Feb 4, 2007, 10:36 PM
Post #40 of 128
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styleboy wrote: It doesn't matter if you're tempted or not. Taking 20$ bucks off a desk is stealing. And I love how you stereotype 'minimum wage' workers. Not that it would be right, but I hope someone steals a bunch of your shit.
Oh well, if they do they get caught, simple. Guess your one of them minium wage workers.
If a person leaves stuff out be it cams, car keys, 20 bucks on a desk, cds on the car seat, wallet / purse / pack, well your just asking for it , if left unattended. Its a classic of the city, don't leave shit out and people won't take your shit.
My point being you leave it out, someone is going to take it. I myself leave people's stuff where it is unless its a blight on the landscape. In the blight case I remove whatever it is, pile it neatly to the side for the offender to pick up and move on.
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AngusBeefheart
Feb 4, 2007, 10:53 PM
Post #41 of 128
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jeez people,
you know what is trash and what is not trash. If you take something that is not yours that's stealing. If you take something that is actually garbage and then properly dispose of it, then you're cleaning up trash. If you have any doubts, then assume it's not trash.
don't be tool
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nedsurf
Feb 4, 2007, 11:38 PM
Post #42 of 128
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Posts: 387
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socalclimber wrote: If it's on federal land, you might want to check with the land managers blm/nps/nfs rangers. Out here in Josh if you leave a high line up for more than 24 hours it very well can get confiscated.
How long did you leave that stuff out there? Just north of Moab is Arches NP and a bunch of BLM land. Was it there?
There is a case called SIERRA CLUB v. MORTON, 405 U.S. 727 (1972) which established the scenery of a public area as something legally defendable. It was also over a recreational installation. Hikers and other public land users might not find you leaving your equipment out a good addition to the aesthetics of the area, especially if it was in Arches. I hope it is the Ranger who took it down and you recover your equipment with only a fine to pay rather than buying it all again. Check out the case; it is a significant landmark in environmental advocacy.
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billcoe_
Feb 5, 2007, 3:41 AM
Post #43 of 128
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mattyp wrote: I don't think anyone is saying that it is ok.
Well heres one lowlife who thinks otherwise Matt:
roy_hinkley_jr wrote: Kudos to whoever it was that cleaned up the abandoned trash! Hopefully it was disposed of properly. Larry, unless that was private land (doubtful), you got what you deserved...don't litter!
I hope it rains on him hard and he can see the otherside of the fence. What a $%***X
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lemon_boy
Feb 5, 2007, 3:55 AM
Post #44 of 128
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so you're saying that it happened to you before, and you didn't learn your lesson the first time. now you're crying like a pu$$y about it happening again? try not to take this the wrong way, but you are a complete retard.
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styleboy
Feb 5, 2007, 3:56 AM
Post #45 of 128
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alexmac wrote: Oh well, if they do they get caught, simple. Guess your one of them minium wage workers. If a person leaves stuff out be it cams, car keys, 20 bucks on a desk, cds on the car seat, wallet / purse / pack, well your just asking for it , if left unattended. Its a classic of the city, don't leave shit out and people won't take your shit. My point being you leave it out, someone is going to take it. I myself leave people's stuff where it is unless its a blight on the landscape. In the blight case I remove whatever it is, pile it neatly to the side for the offender to pick up and move on.
Minimum wage worker, hardly. but If that was the case, I'd rather be a minimum wage worker than some ignorant jack ass. Like I said, I hope someone takes your 'trash' because you leave it at the base of a climb.
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tyify
Feb 5, 2007, 4:11 AM
Post #46 of 128
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Registered: Apr 22, 2003
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Larry which line was it set up on? Birthday gap? Dog hole? I have personally slacked with Larry (areyoumydude) and I will say that he is a very enviromently and socially concious. I would ask if the park rangers had taken them down...
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alexmac
Feb 5, 2007, 4:43 AM
Post #47 of 128
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Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 550
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styleboy wrote: alexmac wrote: Oh well, if they do they get caught, simple. Guess your one of them minium wage workers. If a person leaves stuff out be it cams, car keys, 20 bucks on a desk, cds on the car seat, wallet / purse / pack, well your just asking for it , if left unattended. Its a classic of the city, don't leave shit out and people won't take your shit. My point being you leave it out, someone is going to take it. I myself leave people's stuff where it is unless its a blight on the landscape. In the blight case I remove whatever it is, pile it neatly to the side for the offender to pick up and move on. Minimum wage worker, hardly. but If that was the case, I'd rather be a minimum wage worker than some ignorant jack ass. Like I said, I hope someone takes your 'trash' because you leave it at the base of a climb.
Its okay, I would not climb with someone like yourself who thinks they can do what they want; would not trust you to stay on belay or tie and overhand never mind something to complex like a figure eight.
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crankingclimber
Feb 5, 2007, 4:45 AM
Post #48 of 128
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Posts: 237
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Taking that highline was stealing, as is taking draws. To all the poor helpless people who think this kind of action is justified because of the visual impact, get on your high horse and call the rangers, or the people who left the gear, and let everybody know your name - taking it anonymously is bullshit. That person is a thief. Better yet, quit crying about one highline and have some respect for your fellow climbers/liners - sure, your climbing area might not look quite as nice, and your day might be that much more ruined by it, but if you had any compassion or balls, you could just share. I'll gladly look at the odd highline so that my peers can have as much fun as I do - is it really hurting your eyes that bad? Are you really that selfish?
And as for the thief, instead of he/she having to look at one highline, it's OK to completely fuck up someone's day, cause them financial damage, and hurt them for days to come because of their missing gear/money??? Talk about selfish.
If it's really hurting access, or hurting the environment, then call the rangers, or take it down and leave it, or at least leave a note after taking it down. Link, the climbing ranger in the Valley, has been known to drop people's slacklines which were not set up with proper padding on trees etc. That's cool - he could've impounded it, and I'm sure does when warranted, but obviously it's not black and white cases of trash being left behind - even the rangers recognize that, surely fellow climbers can???
I don't know the specifics of the situation, and if it's really a cataclysmic mistake with dire consequences for land management and climbers reputation etc. then I retract the above. If not, then that person is a lowly thief.
Will |
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areyoumydude
Feb 5, 2007, 5:04 AM
Post #50 of 128
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tyify wrote: Larry which line was it set up on? Birthday gap? Dog hole? I have personally slacked with Larry (areyoumydude) and I will say that he is a very enviromently and socially concious. I would ask if the park rangers had taken them down...
No, we put them up in a place that is not very popular, so that we could have a place to highline close to town but not be an eyesore to tourist. It was definitely sabotage. They left random pieces of gear all over the place threw some of it in the canyon and pulled most of the bolts leaving some behind half pulled out. It seems to me someone had a beef with us or the highlines and if that is the case they should have contacted us and we could of worked something out. Instead they vandalized and stole our gear. Total cowards if you ask me just like the anonymous posters talking shit.
I have talked to the rangers and they have no problem with our highlines.
I've posted pics of what some of the gear looks like on slackline.com in the highline forum.
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