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cantbuymefriends
Jun 25, 2007, 1:20 PM
Post #26 of 41
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j_ung wrote: Huh. Can't say I have any trouble with it. Do you use a thick rope, perhaps? |
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el_layclimber
Jul 7, 2007, 7:32 PM
Post #28 of 41
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Registered: Jan 9, 2006
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paulraphael wrote: Why would anyone pay $1 for that? You can rig a perfectly good autoblock for nearly free with a length of iron pipe, a hockey puck, an old broom handle, and some used brake cable from a bike. majid_sabet wrote: Go to Home Depot and ask them to cut you one large and one small chain link To Paul: We have all already uncovered your real identity,MacGuyver  but you are obviously rusty on your lines, I believe it's "Iron pipe, a hockey puck, an old broom handle and some used brake cable....it just might work." To Majid: In all seriousness, how does one rig chain links as an autolock? Purely for the sake of intellectual interest, I would like to know.
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Valarc
Jul 7, 2007, 8:11 PM
Post #29 of 41
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The matrix is still available for sale on a few websites - however, it's advertised as being specifically made for thinner ropes, so keep that in mind when picking and choosing.
I've been on a sort of quest for the perfect autoblocking belay device - not so much because I need it, but because I'm intrigued by the physics of these little things, and how seemingly minor design tweaks can totally alter the handling of a device. Here are a few I've tried:
BD ATC Guide: A good solid device, and the extra loop allows you to lower a second, which is good, but it can take some convoluted rigging to actually USE this loop. However, if you ever climb on fat ropes, I would stay away. The guide was almost useless on big fat gym ropes, and pretty sticky on a 10.3 beal rope.
Simond Toucan: This thing is just plain weird. However, the flipping lever is pretty nifty for lowering a second with no extra rigging. Much like the BD Guide, I found it to be sticky on fat gym ropes. In this case, the ropes were getting wedged in the friction grooves, so changing your belay technique could very well eliminate the stickyness. To me it wasn't worth the effort to change my technique. I still like it better than the BD Guide. If you can find it in the US, it's gonna be expensive. I got mine on clearance for ten bucks from REI. If you go into an REI store, they can check the stock at other stores in the country and possibly mail it directly to you.
Cassin Piu/GTC: I just bought this one. There is no place to rig to help lower a second, but you can work around that. I haven't tested it very much so I can't give much of an impression on rope handling, but playing around with it at home it seems a lot smoother to feed than the BD or Simond offerings. That probably means it'll also have less friction than those devices, but I'll have to wait and see how it works when I've tried it out some more. Not available anywhere I've found in the US. I got mine from barrabes.com, because they have pretty good shipping rates to the US, and I wanted to try out a few other wacky euro gadgets while I was at it. All signs point towards this being my favorite device of the bunch.
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wings
Jul 7, 2007, 10:29 PM
Post #30 of 41
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Registered: Jun 2, 2004
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paulraphael wrote: Has anyone used the Mammut Matrix? looks like a cool device but I've never seen a review.
I own a Mammut Matrix and do not like to use it because it tends to lock up while feeding when lead belaying.
In general, I think the Trango B-52 (old version) is the best autoblocking belay device available, and I've used and own many of them. The only drawback, in my opinion, is the need to use 3 carabiners when in autoblock mode on double / twin ropes (one for the rope, two for hanging the device off of your anchor).
- Seyil
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skinner
Jul 8, 2007, 6:56 PM
Post #31 of 41
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Registered: Nov 1, 2004
Posts: 1747
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reg wrote: where'd you get that term - "magic plate" ?? this is troll-esk..
I'm guessing that he might have picked up the term "Magic" from the Trango Magic APD which is sort of a combination of a figure 8 and slotted type belay device.
or..
mr_rogers wrote: reg wrote: where'd you get that term - "magic plate" ?? One of the first "guide plate" belay devices was the "Plaquette" or "Plaquette Magique" (Magic Plate).  reg wrote: ok - i use to use a stitch plate: I still do.. dispite my collection of belay devices, because of it's size, simplicity, and the fact that it works so well with smaller diameter double ropes. For interest sake (of those who haven't seen it yet).. Dr. Gary Storricks collection of over 1000 rappelling and ascending devices, breaks " Belay Devices" into the following categories: Slotted "Sticht" Belay Plates These are devices that are essentially flat plates with one or two slots that are used like a Sticht Plate. Other Belay Plates This includes plate belay devices that do not function like Sticht plates. Slotted Blocks This includes belay devices (other than belay tubes) that function in the same way as Sticht plates, but have irregular top and or bottom surfaces. Belay Tubes This includes Tubers, ATCs, and similar devices that have tall slots with thin walls. Lever Box Belay Devices This includes the Grigri, Cinch, and similar devices that enclose the rope and have control levers. Solo Climbing Self Belay Devices Belay devices for roped solo climbing. Miscellaneous Everything else, including some nice devices. You'll even find the Home Depot Chain Link in there. Most of the devices include Technical details, Comments, and sometimes the Pros & Cons of each device, although many of the comments are his personel opinion, he brings up many good points about friction, heat dissipation, functionality, and durability.
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paulraphael
Jul 9, 2007, 3:15 AM
Post #32 of 41
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Registered: Feb 6, 2004
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good god, some of this guy's toys actually look like my McGyver wisecrack:
http://storrick.cnchost.com/VerticalDevicesPage/Glance/GlancePages/Glance5.html
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el_layclimber
Jul 9, 2007, 4:46 AM
Post #33 of 41
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Registered: Jan 9, 2006
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Would love to rap in to a crowded area on one of those just to freak out some squares. On the main page, I am pretty sure I also see a teton.
I can see how the chain links could double as a belay plate, my question was regarding Majid's comment that seemed to imply that two chain links could be used to make an auto-blocker. I've seen a two-biner auto blocker, but can't figure out how I'd fashion one out of chain links.
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skinner
Jul 9, 2007, 8:20 AM
Post #34 of 41
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Registered: Nov 1, 2004
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el_layclimber wrote: Would love to rap in to a crowded area on one of those just to freak out some squares. On the main page, I am pretty sure I also see a teton. I can see how the chain links could double as a belay plate, my question was regarding Majid's comment that seemed to imply that two chain links could be used to make an auto-blocker. I've seen a two-biner auto blocker, but can't figure out how I'd fashion one out of chain links.
Ya, I'd like to hear it too! I know how I would "try" to do it, no idea if it would work or not, but I imagine that you'd pull the rope through the center of the bigger link which you'd clip onto your harness, then pull the rope through the center of the smaller link and clip a biner onto the loop of rope to act as the break bar. Then let Majid jump off of a cliff with it to see if it works.
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stymingersfink
Jul 25, 2007, 7:55 AM
Post #35 of 41
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Registered: Aug 12, 2003
Posts: 7250
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skinner wrote: el_layclimber wrote: Would love to rap in to a crowded area on one of those just to freak out some squares. On the main page, I am pretty sure I also see a teton. I can see how the chain links could double as a belay plate, my question was regarding Majid's comment that seemed to imply that two chain links could be used to make an auto-blocker. I've seen a two-biner auto blocker, but can't figure out how I'd fashion one out of chain links. Ya, I'd like to hear it too! I know how I would "try" to do it, no idea if it would work or not, but I imagine that you'd pull the rope through the center of the bigger link which you'd clip onto your harness, then pull the rope through the center of the smaller link and clip a biner onto the loop of rope to act as the break bar. Then let Majid jump off of a cliff with it to see if it works.
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sungam
Jul 25, 2007, 11:51 AM
Post #36 of 41
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Registered: Jun 24, 2004
Posts: 26804
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Ah, now I understand, MS, you're running out of things to post about, so you decided to spice it up and get some people into making you some new matirial?
Fair 'nuff.
-MagnuS
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sixleggedinsect
Sep 11, 2007, 2:46 PM
Post #37 of 41
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Registered: Apr 14, 2004
Posts: 385
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stymingersfink wrote: pretty simple, really. Use the top link to attach to the anchor, use the bottom link to rig the rope through, with the brake side of the rope lying under the climber side of the rope. Pretty much the same manner that the rope would be situated if placed properly within the atc-guide for auto-block belaying of a seconding climber.
im a little slow- help me out. are you saying use chain links, or *quick* links? i can see making an autoblock out of QLs, or out of one large chain link (as the plate) and a couple biners, but chain links only? i can only see doing it if you untie the rope and thread it through, which would be silly.
what is the second chain link for? and why are they different sizes?
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sixleggedinsect
Sep 11, 2007, 2:47 PM
Post #38 of 41
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Registered: Apr 14, 2004
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and why is this thread in the lab at all? this is a gear forum question.
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angry
Sep 11, 2007, 2:54 PM
Post #39 of 41
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Registered: Jul 22, 2003
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billcoe_
Sep 12, 2007, 4:24 AM
Post #40 of 41
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Registered: Jun 30, 2002
Posts: 4694
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Majid: Damn it! This is the second time I've seen you recommend this.
I have used chain. Works great.
BUT, you are potentially setting someone up to die if they follow your incomplete advice get the wrong size and strength, and you don't mention a thing about it.
Wasn't it actually the 3/8 diameter, welded steel lifting chain which was the schiz?
Double check it and get back to us with the full meal deal and include red and green arrows if you would like next time.
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stymingersfink
Sep 12, 2007, 5:13 AM
Post #41 of 41
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Registered: Aug 12, 2003
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sixleggedinsect wrote: stymingersfink wrote: pretty simple, really. Use the top link to attach to the anchor, use the bottom link to rig the rope through, with the brake side of the rope lying under the climber side of the rope. Pretty much the same manner that the rope would be situated if placed properly within the atc-guide for auto-block belaying of a seconding climber. im a little slow- help me out. are you saying use chain links, or *quick* links? i can see making an autoblock out of QLs, or out of one large chain link (as the plate) and a couple biners, but chain links only? i can only see doing it if you untie the rope and thread it through, which would be silly. what is the second chain link for? and why are they different sizes?
I would not thread the rope through the link per se, but a loop would need to be pulled through the link to clip the biner to, just like any other tube-style belay device.
agreed that perhaps this would be more pertinent in the Gear Forum, but this is where it's at now, so this is where the replies may continue to accumulate.
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