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tigerbythetail
Oct 15, 2002, 2:24 AM
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Got your attention? Good. Went to a local area the other day after work for a few routes. Surprised to see three new bolted routes. Routes that were projects for the future...no I'm not mad somebody beat me to them because it's very likely they would have been too hard for me...I'm pissed off because whoever did these routes chipped them!!! That's right, chipped them. Obviously they must feel themselves to be the best climbers in the world and that these were routes worth the effort, not of climbing, but of chipping. Jerks like this ruin it for us all. If a ranger or almost anybody were to see them doing this it could shut down climbing. This occured in a very public area and my fear is the proliferation of this behavior. I am going to try and find out who did it, strip the routes and would love to kick their ass. If interested the area is Mill Creek near Mentone.
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jmlangford
Oct 15, 2002, 2:57 AM
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I'll help you!
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tigerbythetail
Oct 15, 2002, 3:00 AM
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Cool, you'll need to get in line...kinda like that scene in Airplane! the movie.
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astone
Oct 15, 2002, 3:01 AM
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Those wankers deserve a chip in the head. Anybody who wants to justify chipping can do so here, but you won't! This is because you are ashamed of your despicable behavior. But seriously, if you are some pathetic chisel weany then PM and tell me why you chip.
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jmlangford
Oct 15, 2002, 3:21 AM
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I chip.... my teeth from biners!
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greatgarbanzo
Oct 15, 2002, 3:55 AM
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Such a big deal for a few drilled holds? I donŽt agree with chiping, I dont suport it, but once is done, hey what the hell!!! I am not going to hurt the guy... I might ask him WHAT THE HECK WERE YOU THINKING YOU DUMB F#$%"!!!! but if you think about it chiping is not worst than bolting enviromentally wise... is more a matter of ethics... DO NOT GET ME WRONG... IF I SEE YOU CHIPING SOMETHING ON MY CRAGS I WILL KICK YOUR ASS SO BAD... SO BAD YOUŽLL WISH YOU WERENŽT BORN...
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tigerbythetail
Oct 15, 2002, 7:10 AM
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Just to put things into perspective - there have been 3-4 reported on-sights of 5.14a in the last month. Very few people climb at that level...these actions prove that. Keep the vision.
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roughster
Oct 15, 2002, 7:40 AM
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Ack, I can only assume this is that the Picnic Area, since you mentioned it is very high profile. That is indeed a very foolish place to chip a route, with so much other traffic (non climbing) that area receives. However, will stripping the bolts really be the best course of action? Will those non climbers(which include forest service people) who see the stripped bolts understand anything other than climber can't seem to be able of governing their own actions? Could your action be the ones the jeopardize the access? Sounds like what is done is done unless you are going the full nine yards, chopping the bolts, filling the holes, filling the chipped holds, and then camouflaging them. And even if you do, what will be left will most likely be more visual impacting than if the route was just left as is. Try to find out who did it and talk to them about it, THAT is your best approach. Chopping the route is inviting non-climber scroutiny and possibly starting a bolt war, neither of which climbers want. This may be a matter of perspective. Your idea of chipping may be someone else's idea of extensive cleaning. If this is the case, the person will likely rebolt and maybe strip some of your routes to help pay for the cost of the re-equiping. Worse yet, it could be someone who just might make you eat your words about the ass kicking. I know a lot of the chippers, errr ummmm, route developers in SoCal and some of them I wouldn't want to mess with and I am 6'1" and almost 200 lbs (and no it wasn't me for those of you who think it is because I representing the "other side".) Best case scenario: Talk to them and come to the consensus of why chipping is bad and both walk away friends. Crag intact. Worse case scenario: The crag erupts into a highly visual bolt war with fists of fury action as well as chopping, bolt scars, hold scars, etc.... Sounds like the ball is in your court. I have seen it happen (as I know you have as well). SoCal has too large and diverse climbing community all within highly visible areas. Climbers need to present a unified approach if you don't expect the MAN (ie.. the government) to get involved. Use your head, because this may be the only chance you get. [ This Message was edited by: roughster on 2002-10-15 00:46 ]
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pbjosh
Oct 15, 2002, 7:42 AM
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If you're sure they're chipped (not doubting you, just you'd want to be sure before doing what I suggest), I'd definitely chop them. Maybe leave the first bolt (hangerless or something) with a note attached explaining your actions and mentioning the number of people (including on this board) who were upset and definitely disagree with the practice... josh
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tigerbythetail
Oct 15, 2002, 8:03 AM
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There is no doubt that these routes are chiseled. On one route you grab two previously non-existent holds, get your feet up and bump up left to a match on another chipped hold to clip. Continue ad naseum... If the bolts are pulled I'll fill in the holes and do what's needed to erase their trace, and I'll do it discretely to avoid hassels by THE MAN. Lastly, I'm not scared of these arrogant A**holes...hell they're scared of the rock. All I can say is watch out.
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