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addiroids
Oct 17, 2001, 2:20 AM
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Have anyone of you made any cool homemade aid gear. I made a ledge out of a $40 camp cot, and while I haven't devised a way to get a fly over it, it will work. I just slung the corners with 6mm cord and tied it all in a knot so that it is flat when hung against a 90 degree wall, and coated the wall side with shoe goo on the cord, and Plastic Drip on the ledge. To change the length of the cord while on the wall, just wrap each around a biner. Hopefully your replies will include instructions on how to make it too. Lets keep this aid section active.
TRADitionally yours,
Addiroids
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kagunkie
Oct 18, 2001, 1:48 AM
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Iv made hooks, heads, pins, hangers, nuts, ascenders, hand drill holders and some other stuff I cant think of right now. Oh I made some pulleys too.
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jhundrup
Oct 18, 2001, 1:53 AM
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I have made some cleaning tools out of shelf brackets. I took a lead class and many people didn't have a cleaning tool (which you know is a necessity if you have cleaned before)so I made a bunch from some shelf brackets that I had laying around. The kind with the hooks in the back that slide into the slotted rails that mount to the wall.
They worked quite well.
Jared
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passthepitonspete
Oct 18, 2001, 2:13 AM
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Ask Dr. Piton:
Why, when I was a lad, we used to walk along the railroad tracks and look for nuts which we tied on slings and used for pro..... well, not me, but Don Whillans did!
'Roids, I would HIGHLY recommend you build in some adjustability to the strap length of your homemade ledge! Every time I set my ledge up (136 nights and counting!) it seems to hang in some weird and wonderful way depending on the shape of the rock, the position of the haulbags against which it is resting, and the layout of the anchors for the bags and the ledge.
In the ideal situation for which you now have it adjusted, it just might work, but the walls are usually less accomo- dating! I end up adjusting my buckles to all sorts of different lengths virtually every night. Maybe you could buy yourself six adjustable buckles, and sew them into your system. I would recommend steel buckles over the plastic fastex kind, but the fastex kind WILL work (that's what my Fish ledge uses, A5 uses steel buckles which are better).
Now as for the homemade fly, it's easy. Get yourself a big honkin' tarp, and get yourself a big honkin' wired nut. Make sure the nut has smooth edges and corners - file it if necessary. Stick the nut up from the bottom of the tarp into the centre of the tarp, and bunch the tarp tightly around the head of the nut. (The nut is oriented vertically as you would place it in a crack). Get yourself a 6mm cord, and tie a prusik knot around the wire of the nut on the OUTSIDE of the tarp.
Get it?
The prusik knot cinches around the wire of the nut from the outside of the tarp, so there is no hole in the tarp for water to get through. The prusik knot is your tie-in for the whole kit 'n caboodle. Make sure it's cinched tight, and secured with duct tape. This is what you'll be sleeping on.
Needless to say, you will need a separate backup for both you and the ledge. This you accomplish with a separate rope. Make sure it's attached to both you and your ledge.
Now, if you're using the fly, obviously it's raining, right? Therefore, if the rope hangs straight down from the anchor to you in your ledge, water will run down the rope and right onto you, right?
So what you do is this, pay out an extra five feet or so of slack and let it dangle down beneath your ledge in a slack loop and then come back up to you. Clip a few biners full of pitons or something heavy onto the rope to keep the rope hanging down below you and your ledge. That way water running down the rope will drip onto the biners with pins on them, not onto you.
Get it?
No matter what, you will always get some leakage into your system. Be sure that you have a warm synthetic sleeping bag (not down!), and a good bivi sack with seams well sealed with Seam Grip.
Add to your wall list 1 (one) Big Wall Sponge. Make sure it's a brand new one, and not one that you stole from your mom's sink. (The latter will contain soap that will bubble up all over the place and annoy the heck out of you). Using a big wall sponge to soak up leakage beats the heck out of using a sock. In the absence of either, sub- stitute a Big Wall Crab (caution - he will NOT be amused!)
Finally, adjust the fly over the corners of your ledge, and pad the livin' bejeepers out of it, inside and out, with duct tape, especially on the corners and the inside edge that will rest along the wall.
Ta-da! You've done it.
Lastly, practise setting it up in the dark in the middle of a rainstorm with one hand while hanging from your aiders
Cheers,
"Dr. Piton"
P.S. Is your home-made ledge easy to take apart and set up? Probably not. Do you know how to "flag" your portaledge so that you can leave it set up ALL the time, and haul it when it's set up, so that when you're hauling it it won't get bashed against the rock or turn your haulbag into a giant kite when the winds whip up? If not, ask Dr. Piton....
[ This Message was edited by: passthepitonspete on 2002-01-24 18:16 ]
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addiroids
Oct 19, 2001, 4:53 PM
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Whoa, why the hell don't they include this stuff in John Long's bigwalls book??? I really appreciate the tips Dr. Piton.
Now how DO you flag your ledge so it doesn't get ripped up?? If you could enlighten us O Great One!!
TRADitionally yours,
Addiroids
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ratstar
Oct 19, 2001, 5:01 PM
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I dunno trusting my life to something I made I'd get kinda scared.
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benjo
Oct 19, 2001, 8:28 PM
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You don't trust your life to your portaledge. Stay tied into the rope at all times, so if your ledge does blow, you'll just get a scary wakeup call. The first ledge I ever used was a cot that I found in my parents garage. It lasted for 1 El Cap Route (Magic Mushroom), and a couple routes in Zion. Then one of the sides bent and snapped when I slipped on some talus and fell. But, it did work while it lasted.
I have made some other things, some heads, belay seats, etc... One thing that is mandatory for nailing routes (especially in the desert) are sawed off angles. I just use a hack saw and file.
Ben
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passthepitonspete
Oct 20, 2001, 12:09 AM
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Ask Dr. Piton:
Yo, 'roids,
You are several generations of big wall books removed...you must read The Complete Book of Big Wall Climbing by Chongo. Of course, finding the book may be the crux. Chongo has yet to get himself an email address, but if you're in Yosemite look him up. He sells the important chapters separately if you can't afford the whole book (it's over 500 pages!) I see from your profile that you're close to J Tree. This can be good news - you'll find Chongo there in the winter.
"FLAGGING" YOUR LEDGE
When I soloed Iron Hawk, one day as I was fighting my ledge to put it away (it's a Fish double) the shock cord that runs around its perimeter snapped, and fearful of losing critical parts (I'd have been quite buggered had the corner pieces fallen out!) I simply left the thing set up for the whole climb, and clipped it to the haul bag during hauling.
Little did I know the error of my ways, until the first windy day when I cut the bags free to hang in space while I cleaned the pitch. The ledge acted like a GIANT KITE, and my haul bag with ledge attached began spinning at about 30 rpm. The lower-out line made a whipping sound not unlike that of a helicopter blade as it threatened to decapitate me, and my Wall Flower completely disintegrated, its petals unable to withstand the centripetal acceleration.
At any rate, there IS a better way - there is always a better way - this being to "flag" your ledge. (Thank you for taking the 'bait', by the way....)
First thing you do is tighten up on your haul line, which is something you have to do anyway before you release the load from its anchors to haul it. This can be done by your partner up top, or by yourself from the bag if you're soloing when you use the Far End Hauler.
To visualize "flagging your ledge", imagine that the haul line is a flagpole. The weight of the bag insures that the rope is rigid. This is why you have to tighten up on the haul line FIRST. Next, take three carabiners and attach them along one side of your ledge - doesn't really matter which side. One crab on each corner, and one crab in the centre. A fourth crab, which is a locker, is attached to the top of the six suspension straps.
While your ledge is safely clipped in so you don't drop it, grab a corner crab and clip it to the stiff haul line above your load. Now lift the ledge up and connect the other three carabiners to the haul line, pushing your ledge up the stiff haul line as you clip each crab, so that your ledge is now attached to the haul line like a "flag". Its orientation is "portrait" as opposed to "landscape", know what I mean?
The ledge is now attached to the haul line and it is above the load. It is NOT clipped to the load in any way; it is only attached to the haul line.
Now you can haul at will. (Poor Will, everybody's always firing at him, too.)
The ledge acts like a giant wind vane - no matter how hard the wind blows, the ledge simply orients itself to maintain the smallest amount of resistance to the wind. Doesn't matter whether it's swirling, or gusting, or shifting - the ledge provides almost no resistance to the wind. It's really quite amazing - I've watched my load (with the flagged ledge attached) hang in space for an hour or more as I cleaned a pitch (remember, when soloing, I can't haul til I get back up after cleaning) and get buffeted by fifty and sixty mile per hour winds, all with no more effect than to deflect the bag maybe five feet out of plumb.!
FIVE feet only, in a fifty mile per hour wind, dangling on the end of a two hundred foot haul line!
You won't believe how easy it is to do. No more fighting your ledge every morning to put it away, no more struggling to set it up at night. No more sitting on a belay bench while your partner leads - since your ledge is set up the whole time, you can LIE down while belaying. Belay with a Gri-Gri and totally relax, fall asleep, take pictures, read a book, and keep changing those CD's, eh?
Ah, so, young glasshoppah, you wondah what happen when redge hits ovahhang while hauring... (hauring, hauring, hard word to plonounce....)
Not much, actually. The ledge usually just turns itself away from the rock and finds its own way up. So touching the rock, going around GENTLE roofs, or going up a slab (as long as it's not too terribly low-angled) is no problem, the fragged redge, er, flagged ledge, will be fine.
Now, you may think that this would put a lot of wear and tear on my ledge, but I've spent 136 nights on the side of El Cap, and hauled my ledge flagged for literally hundreds of pitches, and it's AOK.
Next time I'm up on El Cap, you'll recognize me for sure, or at least you'll recognize my flagged ledge. For a photo of my ledge, take a look at the "solar-powered shower" photo from Jolly Roger in the Routes/North America/California/El Capitan/Southwest Face section (work in progress, lots more photos and beta coming!)
Please click here to see a swell photo of my "flagged" ledge being hauled.
Cheers,
"Dr. Piton"
P.S. What do you think sounds better - "Dr." Piton, or "Professor" Piton. (And don't get to holier-than-thou on me re. the Dr. bit - you ain't one YET.....)
[ This Message was edited by: passthepitonspete on 2002-01-24 18:34 ]
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addiroids
Oct 21, 2001, 8:18 PM
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I understand everything you said. I will have to ask around Josh this winter to see if I can find Chongo and get a few pages. I wouldn't be opposed to buying the entire thing if it is like $20 and keeps him on the rocks and out of a real job. Maybe Todd Gordon knows his whereabouts. Ohh, and I saw your pics with your crab ledge. Good one. Ohhh Canadaaaa, da duh duh duh da duuuhhhh.
As far as the name, I'm sure you have done your time to earn your W.D. (Wall Degree). Doc sounds just fine. I'm sure pasting those #00 heads is just like surgery. I have so much to learn. Sank yu master, sank yu veddy veddy much.
TRADitionally yours,
Addiroids
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passthepitonspete
Oct 22, 2001, 2:16 AM
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Ah, so, sirry man.
Chongo book cost ninety dollah.
You buy chaptah fo twenty dollah. You cheap buggah!
But it worth every penny!
Sank you for compriment (aah, vely hard word to plonounce - compriment....)
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radistrad
Mar 3, 2002, 7:58 PM
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You can find Chongo in the Valley. Just saw him 2 days ago. He can be found in the "Caff" at Yosemite lodge. His resident table is right next to the mens room.
ANd Yes his book is $90. But you will get more info out of it than in any other wall book. Home made trinckets, I stole the food bucket idea from some wall climbers. Got a circular bucket, rigged it with webbing for a tie in point and lashed the top so it does not get lost. Works on the wall as well as at the crags to keep the rodents out of the grub.
[ This Message was edited by: radistrad on 2002-03-03 17:45 ]
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krustyklimber
Mar 5, 2002, 8:17 AM
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I didn't make my gadget...instead of using a pop bottle for a knot protector on my haul bag, I use a transmission fluid funnel (you know the long skinny ones). It rides over most edges and bulges pretty well, and it covers not only the knot but the biners and part of the straps. So far, with a little duck tape reenforcing, it has lasted a couple of walls.
Jeff
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apollodorus
Mar 5, 2002, 8:25 AM
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I once ground a couple of RURPS down, so that only about a third of the blade remained. I used them for these little pockets that were too long for the full 1" blade. I guess this was sort of like a beak
I figure that trad and sport climbing has little or no room for experimentation (Uh, Huber's Freerider topo calls for an 8" Big Daddy cam...), but aid climbing is, and has always been, the domain of the Inventor, the Innovator, the Experimenter and the Flat Out Crazy.
"Stove legs? Pounded into cracks?? And used to support body weight??? What madness is this????" Thanks, Warren. We'll always be grateful. You were the best. You were the original homemade aid trinket man.
[ This Message was edited by: apollodorus on 2002-03-11 16:33 ]
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mrhardgrit
Mar 8, 2002, 11:48 AM
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My sister is an absolute ace with the industrial sewing machine - she has made a really good big wall rack (kinda like the Yates one) from a design that I put down on paper.
It's built from the frame of an old harness and rucksac and shoe bag. You can make all the gear loops with 6mm rope threaded through clear plastic tubes and the rest is easy!
You can check it out this summer if you're in the valley...
[ This Message was edited by: mrhardgrit on 2002-03-08 03:48 ]
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krustyklimber
Mar 11, 2002, 5:18 AM
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Here's my new one... go to the computer store and get a pair of the cheap computer speakers, hook 'em up to your walkman, and you've got an ultralight boom box, it's no Dr. P sound system, but it is easy to carry to more remote walls than the Captain.
Jeff
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passthepitonspete
Apr 22, 2002, 1:04 AM
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You can click here if you would like to see the consequences of an IMPROPERLY 'flagged' portaledge!
Bwah-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha!!!! [Diabolical Dr. Evil laughter]
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bmgard
May 12, 2002, 9:06 AM
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I've made adjustable personals for cliping into the bolts or gear at the top of climbs (or in the middle if I'm in over my head). I just took about 6 feet of 6mm cord tyed it into a 3 foot loop. Then i i tied a prusik knot around my finger. I then feed the other end of the loop throught the prusik. So that it is tyied back on it self. I put a carabiner through the resulting loop and girth hitch the other end through the tie in points on my harness. Now when ever i need to clip in i just unclip it from my gear loop and extend it to as long as i want. It works really well when you have to hang from the bolts while cleaning a top rope. You can position yourself exactly where you need to be.
I use 2 of these and I can equalize them perfictly and adjust them quickly if I change my stance.
[ This Message was edited by: bmgard on 2002-05-12 02:09 ]
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krustyklimber
Aug 4, 2002, 4:51 AM
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Ok so I have finally learned how to post photos and with a little html assistance from the good Dr. I now can put a pic of my homade Krustyledge into a post... like this...
I have a close up of the clip-in piece, which is modeled after the one on the Bombshelters...
and the crossbeam cannot be seen in the shade, it gives the PVC frame an unbelievable amount of stiffness. The white tube at the top is a pull-up bar so I can unweight the bed to make adjustments. The ledge is 33 by 72 inches, and is roomy and strong enough for two adults and a medium sized dog to sit on comfortably.
Smithclimber and Yossarian have seen it and said I did a good job, I am flattered by this.
My nine year old nephew thinks it is the coolest thing in the world, and loves to sleep on it as much as possible.
With the addition of a used fly for $80 bucks I'm into the whole package about $160, but my brother calls me Mr. Ridiculous for the amount of design and prototyping that it took (I built the thing three times, four including the miniature).
Jeff
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passthepitonspete
Aug 4, 2002, 4:07 PM
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Nice work, Krusty!
The pullup bar might be a really good idea! Usually the first thing I do, before I take my harness off, is to clip my adjustable fifi into the suspension point of the ledge, to unweight the ledge and allow me to adjust the straps that way.
Once the ledge is adjusted, and the buckles backed up with a slipknot (I have a circa 1996 Fish ledge with plastic Fastex buckles which slip) then I take my harness off. I never wear my harness in the ledge - I just wrap my daisies round my waist and girth hitch them as my backup.
[Note: I have yet to actually fall out of my ledge to test this system, and I am not looking forward to that eventuality, though after a hundred and fifty plus nights, I might actually know what I'm doing...]
The pullup bar would allow easier fine tuning once you've removed your harness.
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krustyklimber
Aug 4, 2002, 5:07 PM
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Pete,
Thanks for the compliment and the idea I got it from you!
Earlier in this thread you explain the whole issue, of fastex buckles, and it being hard to adjust (not to mention I broke a plastic buckle on the prototype), so I was at first hanging a Yates Bigwall Ladder at the clip in point and using the "bar" on the clip in point.
Thanks go out to the good Dr. once again! We are lucky to have him around... especially me!
Jeff
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russwalling
Aug 5, 2002, 9:49 PM
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Krusty: Looking good on the ledge manufacturing!
Just so dark ages Pete knows, FISH ledges use (and have for a few years now) METAL Ankra cam lock buckles and they do not slip. We still use the Fastex variety around the bottom adjusters, (we have 12 total buckles, 6 up top that are METAL, and 6 down low that are Fastex) but the main suspension buckles are METAL. Petes slip because he has used his lege for 27,000 nights or so, and adjusting the buckles basically wears the teeth out on the old style buckles. Glad we got that cleared up....... METAL!!!!
adios,
Russ
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wildtrail
Aug 5, 2002, 9:59 PM
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I made one of those bolt guns. Like from that lousy movie "Cliffhanger". Works great!
I have a friend that makes his own heads and stuff. He had them looked at too. They are just as good as Fish, too!
Steve
[ This Message was edited by: wildtrail on 2002-08-05 15:01 ]
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passthepitonspete
Aug 8, 2002, 7:44 PM
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Russ' ledges are The Shit, and are highly recommended by Dr. Piton.
When I complained a few years ago that my Fastex buckles slipped, Russ sent me a complete new strap/suspension system gratis.
Russ is one manufacturer who stands behind his product.
I now await a replacement bed, because I need to use my ledge in Yosemite on August 28, and my poor ol' bed is showing some wear on account of those 27,000 nights...
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skloppen
Aug 8, 2002, 8:27 PM
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Krusty,
That's a cool ledge. Would you mind explaining what the "crossbeam" is? All I can see from the picture is the rectangular PVC frame.
thanks
from Stefan
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krustyklimber
Aug 8, 2002, 10:50 PM
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O.K guys I dragged the thing out today, and set it up, and took a good shot of the frame and the crossbeam. I'll submit it in a few days or so (I have to finish the roll and get it developed), in the mean time I will look for the link to the photo of the guys who I stole/borrowed the crossbeam idea from.
Thank you all for your compliments and interest, I have otherwise not gotten much for my considerable investment of time and brainwork. But this flattery feels quite rewarding at this point!
If you can't wait 'til then e-mail me or PM me (like some of you alreadt have been).
Jeff
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