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Valarc
Jun 21, 2008, 5:34 PM
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I'm sure this one has been covered in the forums before, but my lack of search-fu is evident today, because I can't find anything useful.
I've started some routesetting in a new gym, and I've previously developed a pretty efficient ascending system for getting myself up ropes to bolt on holds. The problem is, the management of this new gym will not let me use my toothed ascender on their ropes, so if I want to keep up with the same setup, I need to get my hands on a toothless ascender. I've been doing it with friction knots, but I prefer the smooth feed of a mechanical ascender.
I'm open to handled or mini designs - whatever feeds easily and grabs reasonably decently (not using this for solo toprope or anything). Bonus points for being cheap, as this is essentially going to be a gym-only device.
What are the best toothless ascenders out there?
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rock_fencer
Jun 21, 2008, 5:41 PM
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Gri-Gri
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jkd159
Jun 21, 2008, 5:45 PM
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I have the Ushba Basic and it works great.
You could use the Ushba in conjunction with a GriGri. Makes getting down easy -- no need to switch devices to rappel. Not cheap, but if you already own one...
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Valarc
Jun 21, 2008, 6:02 PM
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I already use a gri gri as part of my system - an ascender with a foot loop above, grigri on my belay loop. Nice part about this system is, if I'm hauling a somewhat heavy load hanging off my ass (5 gallon bucket full of resin holds, for example), I can throw a carabiner on the ascender, redirect the brake strand through it, and get some mechanical advantage.
The ushba looks like a good option, although pricey for what it is. I've also considered a petzl shunt but it doesn't look like its all that well suited, and it's almost as expensive as the ushba basic.
I was kinda hoping there were more options out there than these two.
(This post was edited by Valarc on Jun 21, 2008, 6:03 PM)
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8flood8
Jun 21, 2008, 6:02 PM
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gri gri + petzl shunt.
shunt retails like $40.00 or less.
shunt is primarily a rappel back-up , but can double as an ascender.
believe me, its smooth sailing with this. connect your shunt above your gri gri , weight the shunt, take up slack on the gri gri-- tie a knot if you want to, rinse and repeat
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stymingersfink
Jun 21, 2008, 6:24 PM
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was it the micro-cender or the rescue-cender that has a textured-face cam, rather than teeth?
one-na dem.
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oldsalt
Jun 21, 2008, 7:26 PM
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My Petzl Rescuecender has cross grooves (OK, texture) on the cam. I have not seen the Microcender.
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angry
Jun 21, 2008, 7:29 PM
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Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't Dingus a toothless or mostly toothless ascender?
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vegastradguy
Jun 21, 2008, 8:28 PM
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in the gym? i'd just use a Wild Country Ropeman plus a grigri if they wont less you use a toothed ascender (i'm surprised they wont)
either that, or i'd climb the wall and fix my own line to set- this is probably what i'd do, it being cheaper than buying a new ascender.
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Valarc
Jun 21, 2008, 9:09 PM
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hafilax wrote: It's pretty silly that the gym won't let you use any ascender.
I thoroughly agree, but it's a minor enough point that I don't feel like raising a fuss over it. I always like excuses to buy new gear, and if I don't find something I like, a friction knot is effective if less pleasant to use.
Then again, if you saw how shitty their ropes are, you might agree with their decision to avoid touching that fuzz with anything remotely pointy...
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doz
Jun 22, 2008, 12:03 AM
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The micro does not have teeth-horizontal ridges. It works like a champ.
Doz
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shockabuku
Jun 22, 2008, 12:51 AM
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Petzl microcender is the way to go. No teeth but horizontal ridges (~1/2 in. diameter or so) on the camming surface. Works very well; nice piece of equipment.
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onceahardman
Jun 22, 2008, 12:53 AM
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I have old-school Gibbs ascenders. Probably the original horizontal ridges-no teeth. Why they never built Gibbs with a handle, I'll never know. They work great, and might be the safest ascenders ever. Great design. Cavers and rescue guys tend to like them.
(This post was edited by onceahardman on Jun 22, 2008, 12:55 AM)
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gunkiemike
Jun 22, 2008, 1:57 PM
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onceahardman wrote: Why they never built Gibbs with a handle, I'll never know.
Simple - because the Gibbs are "cam loaded" devices vs. regular ascenders which are "frame loaded" devices. In plain English, pulling on the body of a Gibbs unweights the cam. Same reason you'll never see a handled Tibloc or Ropeman.
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milesenoell
Jun 24, 2008, 7:28 AM
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majid_sabet wrote: Gibbs ascenders probably got the least sharpest tooth among the ascenders but still, if you fall on it, it could damage the rope.
My understanding was that the teeth weren't supposed to truly penetrate the outer sheath, but rather to stay clear of the core strands to avoid unseen core damage. Thus, whatever damage to the rope should at least be face value.
Other than a couple of minor fuzzy spots my rope looks fine after using it to TR solo with a Petzl Ascension for a couple years.
Do you know of any problems from people damaging ropes by using ascenders? (other than some fuzzy spots)
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moondog
Jun 25, 2008, 4:25 PM
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milesenoell wrote: Do you know of any problems from people damaging ropes by using ascenders? (other than some fuzzy spots)
I've never seen any damage from ascenders going up the rope, but poor downclimbing technique can result in snags and "picking" of the sheath fibers. Most of the concern about toothed ascenders damaging rope is baseless.
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rocks_good_hippies_bad
Jun 25, 2008, 7:59 PM
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Another knot option would be a Bachmann or Klemheist friction knot on a biner. Giving you a handle to work with making it a lot easier. You could then clip on a second biner to run the rope through for your mechanical advantage on the gri-gri. I'm pretty sure both of these are in FotH or easy to find online.
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broscetti
Jun 26, 2008, 3:42 PM
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Been setting for many years using a ladder and a gri-gri ( the gym's equipment). You should be able to use the gri-gri as a form of self belay. make a few moves then take up the slack. Hang from it while bolting holds, or haul by taking weight off and pulling the rope through ( aka - climbing) Never hurts to use an existing easy route, or throw on a few temporary big holds for "ascending". You may also elect to tie an occasional backup knot in the rope below.
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