So why people (climbers….etc) keep hurting themselves while rappelling ?


Please fill up the list

1- Stuck on a wall with Majid.
2- Human error

What is your point Majid?

Dingus and rgold made excellent posts on the subject. What are you trying to accomplish with this incomprehensible list?

Except neither of them (Mr D and R) ever start a post that target safety unless someone else initiates one and even due such accidents never happens to EXPERT CLIMBERS as we know it, I think ,there is a small chance that may be some climbers get something out of these non-sense list.

Heehee, he called Dingus an expert!

3- Scrambling to get the PTFTW

Given the increasing number of experienced climbers who have rapped off the end of their ropes, I'm begining to come around to the idea that knots at the end are a good idea unless you are in known hang-up terrain such as one finds at Red Rock.

That is indeed dangerous.

3) Human error on the part of the climber or group
a) application and installation of the system
b) understadning of the system
c) focus on the task
d) communication (on the part of the climber or group)
e) personal health (i.e. heat attack)
f) poor gear or improper gear
etc... all possible and responsible for mitigation.

funny thing is, if one were to dig deep enough, I wouldn't be surprised if they were to discover that rappelling accidents are the number one killer of expert climbers who die while climbing.

Todd?

IMO, there was another factor in Todd's accident which most climbers do not know .

Sorry Magid, I just don't share your fascination with accidents. Still, you might enjoy reading this post on gunks.com. Never say never m'boy.

Dingus, I'm still a little uneasy rappelling if I'm several pitches or more off the ground, but the rappels that worry me the most are the shorter ones at a familiar crag that get you to the ground in one rap. We do a ton of these in the Gunks nowadays; these rappels are utterly routine, and I find I'm totally blase about it, which I also know is not good.

As for the backups, either mechanical or prussic-type, I'm not against them but think they are a sort of Maginot line, in the sense that the protect against things that don't happen. Other than perhaps rank beginners, climbers who aren't exposed to objective dangers don't lose control of ordinary rappels. I have no statistics to offer, but my sense from reading the literature is that the majority of rappelling accidents come from going off the end of the rope, and backups will not protect against this eventuality.

Given the increasing number of experienced climbers who have rapped off the end of their ropes, I'm begining to come around to the idea that knots at the end are a good idea unless you are in known hang-up terrain such as one finds at Red Rock.

IMO, there was another factor in Todd [Skinner]'s accident which most climbers do not know .

Now... don't tell me yet... but give a clue.. what number would you give it on your list? 70ish or 700,000ish?

Is this why climbers turn the safety switch off and go to autopilot mode thinking,"it is only rappelling and so simple. Any idiot off the street can do this, here watch me"

....As for the backups, either mechanical or prussic-type, I'm not against them but think they are a sort of Maginot line, in the sense that the protect against things that don't happen. Other than perhaps rank beginners, climbers who aren't exposed to objective dangers don't lose control of ordinary rappels. I have no statistics to offer, but my sense from reading the literature is that the majority of rappelling accidents come from going off the end of the rope, and backups will not protect against this eventuality.

....Yet (ironically nor not) I rarely back up rappel rigs with auto-grip style knots, viewing them as a liability in most situations (not all however).

Perhaps not loing my fear of rappelling has kept me from getting hurt? The only rappel injury I ever received was a badly burned palm after briefly losing control on a goldline rap using a diaper harness and a twice-wrapped biner as a rap device. (Dingus once burned learned a valuable lesson!)

I enjoy having a rap backup in place for high stress raps - high on a wall descending fixed lines, for example. Given the wall climbing enviro I'd likely use a jumar attached to a Yates-style adjustable daisy as the backup, but have used knots as well. I prefer above the device backup and generally detest the knots-on-the-side jury rigs.

DMT

This list is 99.9% unnecessary.

Two Words.

Human Error.