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what do you anchor yourself to the belay with?
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Poll: what do you anchor yourself to the belay with?
climbing rope 124 / 53%
daisy chain 29 / 12%
sewn slings 57 / 24%
other 24 / 10%
234 total votes
 

full1346


Oct 19, 2008, 2:27 PM
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what do you anchor yourself to the belay with?
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 i have seen alot of methods and was just interested in seeing what the majority of people use to anchor themselves to the belay anchor when they are belaying.


dj69


Oct 19, 2008, 2:31 PM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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Well.. it depends.

Most of the time on trad i just clove hitch the rope to the anchor.

On sport routes though i use a daisy.


Partner cracklover


Oct 19, 2008, 3:02 PM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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Rope. Unless I'm going to be rapping when my partner gets up to the ledge, in which case I use a sling.

GO


Factor2


Oct 19, 2008, 3:07 PM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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I regularly use all the methods you listed and more depending on the situation


climbingtrash


Oct 19, 2008, 3:07 PM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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For belaying multi-pitch routes, bolted or crack, I use the climbing rope...makes the most sense if you think about it.


superory


Oct 19, 2008, 4:50 PM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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i always clip my P.A.S. right onto one of the bolts or pieces making the anchor and then clove the rope in to the powerpoint. might be overkill but it dosnt take that long and its backed up and freakin truck.


(This post was edited by superory on Oct 19, 2008, 4:54 PM)


altelis


Oct 19, 2008, 6:01 PM
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Re: [superory] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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i've got to chime in here

i'm not entirely comfortable with the current trend of climbers today using the phrase "freakin truck" or even "fucking truck" in place of the commonly accepted and time tested phrase "bomber" or "bomb proof"

now- i understand that each situation demands its own special rules and in climbing everything is situational, but most of the time "bomber" or "bomb proof" is the way to go.

for sure i use "fucking truck" in other aspects of my life, like "don't mind the rattling noises from the elevator, its fucking truck" or, "that nail in the dry wall is fucking truck- go ahead and hang your 400lb mirror from it!" or my (and other tuck owners) personal favorite "its official guys, after last night i can say i own a fucking truck!"

Cool


kane_schutzman


Oct 19, 2008, 6:11 PM
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Re: [altelis] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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Use the rope, most the time I do an eight on bite, clip it in. Sometimes clove if I have a good stance, the eight feels better.


superory


Oct 19, 2008, 6:31 PM
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Re: [altelis] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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ill interchange bomber and truck often with no real rhyme or reason to why other than that one just popped into my head first. but i dont see any harm in expanding our vocabulary


altelis


Oct 19, 2008, 6:43 PM
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Re: [kane_schutzman] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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kane_schutzman wrote:
Use the rope, most the time I do an eight on bite, clip it in. Sometimes clove if I have a good stance, the eight feels better.


i really don't get this.
Clove Advantages: you can adjust your distance without untying the knot; tying/clipping one handed is easy; bomber
Eight Advantages: bomber

the knots are equally well suited in terms of strength, why not add adjustability and ease of tying (esp one handed- why would a good stance mean clove instead of 8, i would think the opposite)?



and damnit we're climbers- we're not here to expand our vocabulary!


socalclimber


Oct 19, 2008, 7:04 PM
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Re: [altelis] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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Mostly rope. Clove first, pull some slack, then figure 8 for a backup.


Partner angry


Oct 19, 2008, 7:05 PM
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Re: [altelis] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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altelis wrote:
i've got to chime in here

i'm not entirely comfortable with the current trend of climbers today using the phrase "freakin truck" or even "fucking truck" in place of the commonly accepted and time tested phrase "bomber" or "bomb proof"

now- i understand that each situation demands its own special rules and in climbing everything is situational, but most of the time "bomber" or "bomb proof" is the way to go.

for sure i use "fucking truck" in other aspects of my life, like "don't mind the rattling noises from the elevator, its fucking truck" or, "that nail in the dry wall is fucking truck- go ahead and hang your 400lb mirror from it!" or my (and other tuck owners) personal favorite "its official guys, after last night i can say i own a fucking truck!"

Cool

I think we should come up with entirely new vocabulary.

For now on, badly placed pro will be referred to in the context of mouse balls, IE: that thing couldn't hold up mouse balls

I'm going to call all good solid placements "taxes and death", IE: that nut is as sure as taxes and death.

Do not feel free to come up with your own cliches. Yours will suck. Just use mine, you'll feel better about it and won't make yourself look stupid by trying too hard.


climbingtrash


Oct 19, 2008, 8:04 PM
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Re: [angry] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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angry wrote:
...Do not feel free to come up with your own cliches. Yours will suck. Just use mine, you'll feel better about it and won't make yourself look stupid by trying too hard.

Don't tell me what to do.


superbumbly


Oct 19, 2008, 9:54 PM
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Re: [climbingtrash] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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somebody notify homeland security.

This thread has been well and truly hijacked

Back on to topic.

Base up, , screw gate to my harness clipped to 8mm cordellette sling, clipped to three =ised pieces of bomber/death&taxes pro. Lead down, figure 8 clipped to belay loop with screw gate running to second screw gate clipped to my harness clipped to figure 8 tied from climbing rope clipped to three =ised pieces of bomber/death&taxes pro.


(This post was edited by superbumbly on Oct 20, 2008, 5:40 AM)


superory


Oct 19, 2008, 10:35 PM
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Re: [superbumbly] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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superbumbly wrote:
somebody notify homeland security.

This thread has been well and truly hijacked

Back on to topic.

Base up, , screw gate to my harness clipped to 8mm cordellette sling, clipped to three =ised pieces of bomber/death&taxes pro. Lead down, figure 8 clipped to belay loop with screw gate running to second screw gate clipped to my harness clipped to figure 8 tied from climbing rope to clipped three =ised pieces of bomber/death&taxes pro.

you forgot "freakin truck"Wink


davidwebb1969


Oct 20, 2008, 3:29 AM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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I use the climbing rope and tie in short and then use my Daisy Chain as a redundancy for the system.


erclimb


Oct 20, 2008, 4:06 AM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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daisy to get hands free; then, clove hitch on the rope...i not only like the redundancy, the doubling allows for easier/safer adjustments if necessary (like when your partner insists on coming up on the right even though the left is much easier and you made plenty of room and set up your own anchor that way and starting the next pitch will now require climbing over/around your partner...but she's really cute)


Gmburns2000


Oct 20, 2008, 6:45 AM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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Clove each rope to a different piece if not rapping off. Sewn sling if rapping.


Partner xtrmecat


Oct 20, 2008, 7:29 AM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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I always clip the anchor upon arrival just like a piece of pro, and then with a twist of the wrist I can throw a clove. I then equalize the bolts/pieces and build a power point and then run the belay rope through this beaner. I always back myself up to the PP with a sewn runner and then bring up the second.
I find it very disturbing that anyone at all uses a daisy. They are not made for this, they do not even come close to doing the job right. There are no daisies in the current gear market that are more than body weight only. There are many other ways to screw up anchoring with a daisy that could end up in death. This fact has been brought up many times previously and this practice still occurs. Darwins theory will sort it out eventually.
Bob


brownie710


Oct 20, 2008, 8:00 AM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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initially I clip the rope to the first piece while building the anchor
then once it's done i clip a double length sling to the powerpoint and to myself (unclipping the rope from the first piece of the anchor.

then...yes, then...once i pull the rope up for my second and set up the guide i then clove in with the rope. i have found that if i clove in first that the rope sometimes becomes clustered.


hafilax


Oct 20, 2008, 9:14 AM
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Re: [brownie710] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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I tie in with the rope unless leading in blocks or rappelling. For those times I use a sewn sling.

I think that it is a good idea to tie in with a dynamic rope. This protects the anchor from the human funkness device. Some people build a tie in with an old piece of rope. I think they call it a cow's tail or something like that. Some even make a double cow's tail for redundancy.

Backing up the rope tie in with a sling defeats the purpose of having a springy connection. If you're that worried about the rope you should be on doubles.

The PAS and similar are far superior to daisy chains if you are really determined to use that system.


thatguyat99


Oct 20, 2008, 1:18 PM
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Re: [hafilax] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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I use a cow's tail made from cordelette
that is girth hitched to my harness. This
is what I tie in with 1st.

Then once the anchor is built I back it
up with the rope using a clove (or cloves).
I have used slings before but
the most common for me is the
cordelette.


acorneau


Oct 20, 2008, 2:13 PM
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Re: what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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I use a Purcell Prussik for a tether because it's adjustable (like a daisy) with the benefit of being shock-absorbing as well (like the rope).

I'll also throw on a clove hitch when I'm settled.

Just found this interesting quote:
In reply to:
Research was done by Mike Gibbs of Rigging for Rescue in Ouray Colorado on the results of shock loading daisy chains and other commonly used positioning lanyards. In addition to being the owner of one of the premier rescue training organizations in the country (R4R), Mike is an active climbing guide as well as a member of the Ouray Mountain Rescue team. Mike performed dynamic testing on daisy chains as well as a number of positioning lanyards commonly used in climbing and rope rescue. The results of this testing were informative, to say the least. After reading this post, many of you may want to reconsider your choice in positioning lanyards.

Mike designed a drop test representative of what could take place in the field that would provide some indications as to the capabilities and/or limitations of positioning lanyards. A common example in canyoneering would be slipping from a stance when starting a rappel with the anchor at your feet resulting in dynamically loading your safety lanyard. The purpose was to examine the magnitude of peak forces as well as the integrity of the connections on certain commercially and user-created lanyards in a dynamic event. The drops were conducted with 80 kg and 100 kg mass simulating the weight of a climber or climber with a heavy pack and fall factors from 0.5 to 2.0. The surprise was how easily daisy chains and some other lanyards resulted in catastrophic failure on relatively short drops.

Test results were sobering at best. Particularly considering how many canyoneers still insist on using the daisy chain (almost 30% of poll responders) as their primary positioning lanyard. Daisy chains failed in short falls (FF 0.5-1.0) and slings made of Spectra/Dyneema webbing exhibited alarmingly high impact forces (>12kN) and catastrophic failure at surprisingly low fall factors. In canyoneering this could easily happen at any rap anchor below chest level. One slip and bang, you've dynamically loaded the anchor.

Nylon slings (not nylon daisy chains) and the Purcell Prusik came out on top as a result of their shock absorbing abilities. Typically, nylon slings held falls with reasonable impact forces (<10kN). The Purcell Prusik did best holding up to factor 2 falls with impact forces of less than 12kN. (FYI acceptable impact forces: CE 6kN, CSA/OSHA 8kN and UIAA 12kN).

Found the PDF here: http://www.marski.org/...gid=74&Itemid=26


(This post was edited by acorneau on Oct 20, 2008, 2:29 PM)


Alpinisto


Oct 21, 2008, 8:55 AM
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Re: [socalclimber] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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socalclimber wrote:
Mostly rope. Clove first, pull some slack, then figure 8 for a backup.

Simple. Classic. No extra gear needed. What I do.

Obviously, this won't work for rapping, in which case I girth hitch two shoulder-length slings to my tie-in points, one to clip into the rappel anchor and the other to extend the rap device.


chossmonkey


Oct 21, 2008, 10:04 AM
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Re: [full1346] what do you anchor yourself to the belay with? [In reply to]
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Clove to the anchor

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