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Alpine07
Mar 30, 2009, 2:54 AM
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So i've had this question buzzing around my head for a bit now. What is the preferred method for retreating from a big wall climb? Mainly getting the enormous haul bags down. I can certainly envision methods of doing it, but am wondering what is the best way to go about it.
[epoch edited this title]
(This post was edited by epoch on Mar 30, 2009, 3:52 AM)
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epoch
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Mar 30, 2009, 3:54 AM
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I broke this from the Beginner Aid in New England thread, since this is a new question that was unrelated to the conversation in that thread.
Cheers!
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Alpine07
Mar 30, 2009, 4:05 AM
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Hey, sorry about that. Thanks for correcting it 
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pmyche
Mar 30, 2009, 4:39 AM
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tomtom
Mar 30, 2009, 8:19 PM
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When retreating from a route with haul bags, you get to 'ride the pigs'. The key is to put the bags on rappel and attach yourself to the bags.
Here's a long-winded explanation:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/...forum.cgi?post=21375
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pmyche
Mar 31, 2009, 4:36 AM
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Invaluable technique, 100% yes. I don't think it's going to come much into play on the hardest bail pitches, though. On a rap route or where it's relatively plumb, definitely.
I never really understood how people make the technique complicated. Clip the bag to your belay loop or rap device biner. Rap. Clip bag to anchor, then yourself.
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Alpine07
Apr 1, 2009, 2:38 AM
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Thanks, very well composed post. Exactly what I had been searching for.
On the last bit about haul lines. What is the reason for not recommending 8mm haul lines? Less durable would be a factor I would guess. I'm thinking to just designate a older dynamic cord as a haul line, good course of action?
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pmyche
Apr 1, 2009, 4:45 AM
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Glad to help, A07. Thankfully tomtom bailed me out on my hasty oversight.
I wasn't clear about the haul lines. I love 8mm lines whenever I don't have to rap them singly and jug them. As haul lines, they're great. 8mm just starts getting a little spooky to me for life support. No problem in a pinch, but I don't plan ahead to jug 8mm line as routine. Petzl jugs are rated down to 8mm, but still... I'm sure some mountaineers would laugh at me.
I had a PMI 8mm that lasted way longer than any other 8 mils I've owned. I'd like to get another one. After your 8mm gets coreshot, that dia. makes a nice let-out line or TR extension.
PS: Recycled lead line for haul line: Great plan IMO.
(This post was edited by pmyche on Apr 1, 2009, 6:28 PM)
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tomtom
Apr 1, 2009, 8:06 PM
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Alpine07 wrote: What is the reason for not recommending 8mm haul lines?
Less margin for error. If your upper belay is not directly above the lower, you'll be lowering out the bags. A weighted haul line can get cut if it's dragging across a sharp edge as you lower it out. Thicker ropes have thicker sheaths and can handle more such nonsense.
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moof
Apr 1, 2009, 10:24 PM
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If you're climbing with a partner, and the route is a real mofo to rap (overhanging, traversing) then here's the simply sequence I've done:
1. Dude 1 down aids with just a light rack, and the haul line in tow (Dude 2 can pay it out to keep the cluster and snags under control). Bouncing and swinging allow Dude 1 to put a piece in only every 20-30' depending on the severity, just often enough to keep the swinging and frictioning reasonable.
2. Dude 1 get to the anchor and builds a minimalist anchor suitable for hanging 2 dudes and their crap on. The end of the haul line is fixed to the lower anchor.
3. Dude 2 raps with the pigs. At the bottom either Dude 1 pulls him in, or for only moderate overhangs/penjis Dude 2 can yard himself in.
4. Dude 1 jugs the lead line and cleans the gear, realizing how badly he hosed himself with widely spaced gear... Any residual anchor at the top is cleaned. Dude 1 raps back down. Lines are pulled and the process is repeated until a fresh supply of beer is at hand.
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Alpine07
Apr 2, 2009, 10:59 PM
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Awesome, thanks for the replies. It's now time to head to the crag to practice down aiding and "riding the pigs," this should be fun. 
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