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uhoh
Apr 30, 2009, 4:27 AM
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For a while I've been trying to teach guitar to myself and over the last few months I've found playing to be more intuitive and easier in general. I have not yet learned any chords. I can play some chords but I haven't had any success in memorizing them. Aside from practice and repetition, what else helped you learn to play and remember chords?
(This post was edited by uhoh on Apr 30, 2009, 4:27 AM)
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robbovius
Apr 30, 2009, 11:30 AM
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uhoh wrote: For a while I've been trying to teach guitar to myself and over the last few months I've found playing to be more intuitive and easier in general. I have not yet learned any chords. I can play some chords but I haven't had any success in memorizing them. Aside from practice and repetition, what else helped you learn to play and remember chords? um, practice and repetition. ;-) that's what I tell my students. but the more enjoyable way is to learn some tunes that you like, and play them. enjoy, and good luck.
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krillen
Apr 30, 2009, 1:16 PM
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robbovius wrote: uhoh wrote: For a while I've been trying to teach guitar to myself and over the last few months I've found playing to be more intuitive and easier in general. I have not yet learned any chords. I can play some chords but I haven't had any success in memorizing them. Aside from practice and repetition, what else helped you learn to play and remember chords? um, practice and repetition. ;-) that's what I tell my students. but the more enjoyable way is to learn some tunes that you like, and play them. enjoy, and good luck. Key. But you'll have to learn chords to play most of them, even if it's just bar chords. Plus it keeps you from getting bored playing the same scales/modes/fingering exercises over and over.
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fresh
Apr 30, 2009, 1:25 PM
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take lessons. lots of people are purists and want to learn without lessons, which is fine if you don't care about actually playing well. if you don't want/can't afford lessons, I'd say the most important thing to learn is the modes. major and minor (ionian and aeolian, respectively, for the pedantic) are obviously the most important. you need to know chords, but if you don't understand where they come from, it's harder to apply them. if you want to riff, learn the minor pentatonic.
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robbovius
Apr 30, 2009, 2:18 PM
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fresh wrote: take lessons. lots of people are purists and want to learn without lessons, which is fine if you don't care about actually playing well. I disagree. I took a a few months of lessons on 1965, and from then on am purely self-taught. http://www.soundclick.com/robbovius
In reply to: if you don't want/can't afford lessons, I'd say the most important thing to learn is the modes. major and minor (ionian and aeolian, respectively, for the pedantic) are obviously the most important. you need to know chords, but if you don't understand where they come from, it's harder to apply them. again I disagree. some of my students want theory, and some just want to play tunes that they think are kewl. I tell them all that music is the same a learning another language. you don't necessarly have to be able to read it, to be able to speak it fluently. train your ear. you know what songs you like, and sound good to your ear, right? mimick those. there's quite a lot to be learned by mimckry, trust me. in fact, the essence oif teaching, is havin the student mimic the teacher.
In reply to: if you want to riff, learn the minor pentatonic. the minor pentatonic (5-tone) scale is the source for about every blues and rock improv that you'll come into contact with, as well as the souce for many rock chord progressions, and blues tunes... like this: http://www.youtube.com/...feature=channel_page to the OP though, the most important thing is to play. A LOT. ;-) have fun!
(This post was edited by robbovius on Apr 30, 2009, 2:31 PM)
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wideguy
Apr 30, 2009, 2:35 PM
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Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up.
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robbovius
Apr 30, 2009, 2:40 PM
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wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others.
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wideguy
Apr 30, 2009, 2:51 PM
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robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others. Yeah man, DAMN whole new level of frustration... "I know people do this all the time... it MUST be possible " the fact that my hand is about 60% palm and only 40% finger probably not a huge help either LOL it was a hoot... I was sitting there going "OK I remember Robb and Krillen making a big point about keeping my thumb low, resisting the urdge to roll the thumb high on te neck.... How the fuck do you DO that ?"
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robbovius
Apr 30, 2009, 2:55 PM
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wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others. Yeah man, DAMN whole new level of frustration... "I know people do this all the time... it MUST be possible " the fact that my hand is about 60% palm and only 40% finger probably not a huge help either LOL it was a hoot... I was sitting there going "OK I remember Robb and Krillen making a big point about keeping my thumb low, resisting the urdge to roll the thumb high on te neck.... How the fuck do you DO that ?" .. well the answer is...It depends ;-) playing the C-maj in the usual form, it actually helps to wrap your thumb a bit. Not over the top, but upwards. helps with "clamping", if you get my drift.
(This post was edited by robbovius on Apr 30, 2009, 2:57 PM)
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wideguy
Apr 30, 2009, 3:05 PM
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robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others. Yeah man, DAMN whole new level of frustration... "I know people do this all the time... it MUST be possible " the fact that my hand is about 60% palm and only 40% finger probably not a huge help either LOL it was a hoot... I was sitting there going "OK I remember Robb and Krillen making a big point about keeping my thumb low, resisting the urdge to roll the thumb high on te neck.... How the fuck do you DO that ?" .. well the answer is...It depends ;-) playing the C-maj in the usual form, it actually helps to wrap your thumb a bit. Not over the top, but upwards. helps with "clamping", if you get my drift. Ahhh the nuances.... thanks for the help... but it may be time to admit that my dream of playing in a kick-azz Cheap trick cover band are dead. would still love to be able to strum a chord or two though LOL
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krillen
Apr 30, 2009, 4:30 PM
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wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others. Yeah man, DAMN whole new level of frustration... "I know people do this all the time... it MUST be possible " the fact that my hand is about 60% palm and only 40% finger probably not a huge help either LOL it was a hoot... I was sitting there going "OK I remember Robb and Krillen making a big point about keeping my thumb low, resisting the urdge to roll the thumb high on te neck.... How the fuck do you DO that ?" .. well the answer is...It depends ;-) playing the C-maj in the usual form, it actually helps to wrap your thumb a bit. Not over the top, but upwards. helps with "clamping", if you get my drift. Ahhh the nuances.... thanks for the help... but it may be time to admit that my dream of playing in a kick-azz Cheap trick cover band are dead. would still love to be able to strum a chord or two though LOL There's your problem right there....
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wideguy
Apr 30, 2009, 4:56 PM
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krillen wrote: wideguy wrote: Ahhh the nuances.... thanks for the help... but it may be time to admit that my dream of playing in a kick-azz Cheap trick cover band are dead. would still love to be able to strum a chord or two though LOL There's your problem right there.... ROFLMAO
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robbovius
Apr 30, 2009, 5:01 PM
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wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others. Yeah man, DAMN whole new level of frustration... "I know people do this all the time... it MUST be possible " the fact that my hand is about 60% palm and only 40% finger probably not a huge help either LOL it was a hoot... I was sitting there going "OK I remember Robb and Krillen making a big point about keeping my thumb low, resisting the urdge to roll the thumb high on te neck.... How the fuck do you DO that ?" .. well the answer is...It depends ;-) playing the C-maj in the usual form, it actually helps to wrap your thumb a bit. Not over the top, but upwards. helps with "clamping", if you get my drift. Ahhh the nuances.... thanks for the help... but it may be time to admit that my dream of playing in a kick-azz Cheap trick cover band are dead. would still love to be able to strum a chord or two though LOL dude, that's cake. let me introduce you to teh miracle of root-5th and root-5th-octave neutrals, aka "power chords". they only take two fingers. ;-)
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hafilax
Apr 30, 2009, 5:51 PM
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When I was 14 I went through a fakebook of 101 Beatles songs with chord charts and tried to learn to play as many of them as possible. It's best when you know the songs well so that you don't have to think about the rhythm. Eventually the muscle memory gets programmed and you don't have to think about it. The programming can be so good that it becomes a challenge to play a different guitar. If I've been playing a lot of acoustic I end up misplacing my fingers on my SG which has a tiny neck. My guitar style is a little different from others I know. It may be because I'm self taught on the guitar but come from a classical violin and piano background.
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wideguy
Apr 30, 2009, 6:34 PM
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robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: robbovius wrote: wideguy wrote: Man, I've picked up my son's guitar a few times, I can't even stretch my fingers to play C major without my fat fingers hitting two extra strings and my fingers cramping up. I hear ya. my fingertips are blunt and spadelike, and of my army of guitars, there are certainly some that favor my hand better than others. Yeah man, DAMN whole new level of frustration... "I know people do this all the time... it MUST be possible " the fact that my hand is about 60% palm and only 40% finger probably not a huge help either LOL it was a hoot... I was sitting there going "OK I remember Robb and Krillen making a big point about keeping my thumb low, resisting the urdge to roll the thumb high on te neck.... How the fuck do you DO that ?" .. well the answer is...It depends ;-) playing the C-maj in the usual form, it actually helps to wrap your thumb a bit. Not over the top, but upwards. helps with "clamping", if you get my drift. Ahhh the nuances.... thanks for the help... but it may be time to admit that my dream of playing in a kick-azz Cheap trick cover band are dead. would still love to be able to strum a chord or two though LOL dude, that's cake. let me introduce you to teh miracle of root-5th and root-5th-octave neutrals, aka "power chords". they only take two fingers. ;-) any that only require two fingers preferably on two adjoinibng stings, less than two frets apart? LOL
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fresh
Apr 30, 2009, 8:29 PM
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robbovius, you're gonna have to elaborate on where you're disagreeing with me because so far I'm right with you. did you feel that your lessons were a waste of time? a small amount of knowledge of musical theory will go a long way. learning chords isn't as important as learning why certain notes sound how they sound when played together. and learning modes gives you a roadmap for the fretboard. and like robbovius said, play what you like!
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squierbypetzl
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Apr 30, 2009, 11:20 PM
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wideguy wrote: any that only require two fingers preferably on two adjoinibng stings, less than two frets apart? LOL Try Eminor . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . and D 6(E)- open . . . . . . . . . . . . 6----x 5---- 2nd Fret . . . . . . . . . . 5----x 4---- 2nd fret . . . . . . . . . . .4----open 3---- open . . . . . . . . . . . . .3----2 2---- open . . . . . . . . . . . . .2----3 1(e). open . . . . . . . . . . . . .1----2 . Then try: Emajor just add 3----1st fret and A 6---x 5---open 4---1 3---1 2---1 1---open There, now go form a punk band.
(This post was edited by squierbypetzl on Apr 30, 2009, 11:20 PM)
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wideguy
Apr 30, 2009, 11:59 PM
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squierbypetzl wrote: wideguy wrote: any that only require two fingers preferably on two adjoinibng stings, less than two frets apart? LOL Try Eminor . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . and D 6(E)- open . . . . . . . . . . . . 6----x 5---- 2nd Fret . . . . . . . . . . 5----x 4---- 2nd fret . . . . . . . . . . .4----open 3---- open . . . . . . . . . . . . .3----2 2---- open . . . . . . . . . . . . .2----3 1(e). open . . . . . . . . . . . . .1----2 . Then try: Emajor just add 3----1st fret and A 6---x 5---open 4---1 3---1 2---1 1---open There, now go form a punk band. ROIGHT! How's my SNARRRL!?
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hafilax
May 1, 2009, 12:35 AM
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Is that your metal face?
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robbovius
May 1, 2009, 12:55 AM
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fresh wrote: robbovius, you're gonna have to elaborate on where you're disagreeing with me because so far I'm right with you. did you feel that your lessons were a waste of time? no, but they were beginner lessons, no theory at all, the basic kind of lessons you give a 5th grader, so that he can struggle to get "Hot Cross Buns", or "Jingle Bells" to come out of the guitar, know what I mean? what those lessons did for me, was teach me how to fret notes, and make music come out of the guitar. thats about it. ...and then, one day, I had a$2 left over from the money my mom gave me to pay my teacher, so I took it and bought the sheet music for the Beatles tune "Help"...the usual stuff, the melody in staff, lyrics, with chord diagrams above the staff. I asked my guitar teacher to teach me how to play it, and he said no, that I wasn't ready for that yet. I was immediately dissillusioned, and quit lessons within a month. then I taught myself how to play it. and that's how my career as a guiratist progressed, by ear, and teaching myself how to play things that I thought sounded kewl, pretty much exclusively by ear. (from the beginning, I was coming up with my own songs. I been writing songs since I was like, 11. ;-) ) along the way, I've taught myself theory, but that wasn't nearly as important as ear. I was playing modes, without knowing what they were, simply because I thought they sounded interesting.
In reply to: a small amount of knowledge of musical theory will go a long way. I agree with this, in the sense that it makes it interesting to know whats going on in the music, and being able to identify 5ths, 4ths, and 3rds, by ear, but there again, ear trumps theory.
In reply to: learning chords isn't as important as learning why certain notes sound how they sound when played together. This I disagree with, especially considering the needs of the beginner. A beginner, and even an intermediate student, doesn't much care why chords sound the way they do, or why they are pleasing to their ear. they only want to make them come out of the guitar so that they sound good. Later on, when they're playing well enough so divert some of their attention away from simply makeing the tones come out of the guitar, THEN they MIGHT develop an interest in learning the theory. but again, this will be long after their ear is trained to simply hear intuitively what sounds good, or interesting.
In reply to: and learning modes gives you a roadmap for the fretboard. true, but unless you can hear what's going on in the music around you, and make what you platy fit those structures pleasingly, knonwing the modes, or having a broad theoretical base will be of little help. unless you're taking tests on theory in an academic situation, ear trumps theory. thus endeth my lecture. ;-) YMMV, IMO BIWAS ;-)
In reply to: and like robbovius said, play what you like! yeah BABY!
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robbovius
May 1, 2009, 1:04 AM
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hafilax wrote: When I was 14 I went through a fakebook of 101 Beatles songs with chord charts and tried to learn to play as many of them as possible. It's best when you know the songs well so that you don't have to think about the rhythm. Eventually the muscle memory gets programmed and you don't have to think about it. The programming can be so good that it becomes a challenge to play a different guitar. If I've been playing a lot of acoustic I end up misplacing my fingers on my SG which has a tiny neck. My guitar style is a little different from others I know. It may be because I'm self taught on the guitar but come from a classical violin and piano background. My bold. this is VERY true. I have 15 guitars at my disposal at any time (including basses) and I find that if I don't rotate them thru my playing weekly, I suffer the same little while of acclimatization.
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fresh
May 1, 2009, 1:21 PM
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gotcha. well, it worked better for me. I started taking lessons about six months after I started playing guitar, and it helped answer a lot of the questions I'd built up. fortunately my teacher had gone to berkley, and really emphasized theory. so it kick-started my own playing. meh, everyone learns their own way.
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robbovius
May 1, 2009, 6:36 PM
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fresh wrote: gotcha. well, it worked better for me. I started taking lessons about six months after I started playing guitar, and it helped answer a lot of the questions I'd built up. fortunately my teacher had gone to berkley, and really emphasized theory. so it kick-started my own playing. meh, everyone learns their own way. yeah, everyone has their own path, and as long as you enjoy it, whats not to like? I 've been in a couple bands with players from berkely. a couple were really inspirational, had a real mastery of the instrument, but a few were absolute duds, all theory, no feel.
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miademus
May 3, 2009, 12:15 PM
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...well practice is what you need. depends what kind of guitar you play the location and the time of your practice changes.i.e. e-guitar= garage/anytime classic = room/afternoons acoustic=park/noon flamenco=under the bridge/dusk besides my best tip is you should get familliair with all the devices that are used thruought guitar players and get an idea what are elite bass guitarists and lead players....if you practice make sure you have goals for a certain genre dn't play what just sounds good cuz if a guitar player is listening to it he'll notice your jst taping the strings with no pace.
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uhoh
May 11, 2009, 8:58 PM
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Thanks for the advice, guys. Much appreciated.
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