|
winkwinklambonini
Nov 29, 2002, 7:57 PM
Post #1 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 17, 2002
Posts: 1579
|
Beginning a pitch, when you have more cams, or the end, when your dragging more rope?
|
|
|
|
|
flying_dutchman
Nov 29, 2002, 8:56 PM
Post #2 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 20, 2002
Posts: 708
|
at the end of a climb, u have placed all or most of ur gear and the weight of the rope is often spread out over the various pieces of gear and quickdraws so IMO, ur lighter near the end of a climb. Rope drag also reduces the weight of the rope that u feel, so unless im runout on an long overhang, i dont notice the rope's weight much.
Plus, ur gear is all hanging on ur body through a gear sling or on ur harness so u feel the weight more then the rope anyhow.
|
|
|
|
|
bitsofsod
Nov 29, 2002, 9:09 PM
Post #3 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 22, 2002
Posts: 54
|
All I know is that some days when I climb I feel heavier than others. I think it's because gravity isn't constant and there are high gravity days.
|
|
|
|
|
philbox
Moderator
Nov 29, 2002, 9:21 PM
Post #4 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 27, 2002
Posts: 13105
|
Ya gotta remember the number one rule. When beginning the pitch cram as many of the larger cams in as you can, this way you do most of the pitch with as little weight on your harness as possible and conversely your second gets to be weighted down with a bunch of junk. This is particularly important if your second has had the temerity to give you any lip.
This is a similar thing to loading your partners backpack with rocks whilst his back is turned and before a steep aproach.
...Phil...
|
|
|
|
|
winkwinklambonini
Nov 29, 2002, 9:40 PM
Post #5 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 17, 2002
Posts: 1579
|
The more drag, the more "wieght" you feel.
|
|
|
|
|
clymber
Nov 29, 2002, 10:41 PM
Post #6 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 8, 2002
Posts: 1259
|
I feel the heaviest on the approach and the hike out the rest is pretty lite i think
|
|
|
|
|
jefesuave
Nov 29, 2002, 11:09 PM
Post #7 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 2, 2002
Posts: 92
|
When I climb, gravity actually suspends itslef and ceases to exist. That must be why my belayer is always in the air.
jeff
[ This Message was edited by: jefesuave on 2002-11-29 15:10 ]
|
|
|
|
|
duskerhu
Nov 29, 2002, 11:24 PM
Post #8 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 13, 2002
Posts: 1023
|
I say at the end of the pitch you are lighter... relatively...
At the start, you have all the pro hangin' off ya and it can kinda swing you out of balance at times. As you climb and get rid of some of it, the rope does build up drag and get heavier but because its gradual, I don't notice it as much as I notice getting rid of the weight of the pro.
I'll have to remember the one about putting all your heavy stuff in right off the bat to try and punish your unsuspecting partner... That was good...
duskerhu
|
|
|
|
|
climbjs
Nov 29, 2002, 11:54 PM
Post #9 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 1, 2002
Posts: 379
|
At the beginning of a climb, you're carrying more weight. However, you are also fresher. Twoards the end of the climb, you're lower on gear, but may be a bit gripped. Then again, a .10a crack is difficult for me to lead... So don't listen to me
|
|
|
|
|
stevematthys
Nov 30, 2002, 3:45 AM
Post #10 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 13, 2000
Posts: 1248
|
i would rather be weighed down by cams then rope drag. i hate rope drag.
|
|
|
|
|
jt512
Nov 30, 2002, 6:07 PM
Post #11 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 21904
|
Quote:
Rope drag also reduces the weight of the rope that u feel...
Welcome to rockclimbing.com, where everything is good, even rope drag.
-Jay
|
|
|
|
|
tradclimber2
Dec 1, 2002, 6:55 AM
Post #12 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 9, 2001
Posts: 132
|
Ah, but you are all forgetting basic Physics - It is a well-known fact that as you move further away from the center of gravity (ie. UP), the pull of gravity increases thus you begin to weigh more. However, as you unload gear this will counteract the gravity/weight ratio difference so you actually may weigh the SAME at the end of a climb as you did at the beginning!
Now, I also can tell you the best scientific theories for why people 'pass on" yawns, why cats and peanut butter sandwiches land feet/face down and how you can actually harness that phenomenon and create energy! Anyone want to buy some beautiful oceanfront property in Oklahoma?
[ This Message was edited by: tradclimber2 on 2002-11-30 22:56 ]
|
|
|
|
|
coclimber26
Dec 1, 2002, 3:13 PM
Post #13 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 8, 2002
Posts: 928
|
Good question..I would say it's about even. I think it may seem heavier with more drag but on fairly straight routes I would say it's even.
|
|
|
|
|
estwing
Dec 2, 2002, 12:48 AM
Post #14 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Mar 24, 2002
Posts: 344
|
I am definitely heavier at the end of a pitch, because I pride myself on placing most to all of my gear (not that much), regardless of the difficulty of the pitch. This means hardcore rope drag!
Have a nice day,
Sam
|
|
|
|
|
tradguy
Dec 2, 2002, 6:56 PM
Post #15 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 22, 2002
Posts: 526
|
Most likely heavier at the end (top), but it depends on the density of the rope, weight of gear placed (varies by type, size, and brand), and the amount of gear placed. Here's some numbers:
10.2 mm Beal single rope = 65 g/m, so a 50m section of rope will weigh 3.25 Kg.
Full set of 12 WC friends (00-4) = 1405 g.
Full set of 10 WC rocks (1-10) = 383 g.
Full set of 7 WC rockcentrics (3-9) = 565 g.
Draw w/ 2 wiregates and 24" sling = 111 g.
165' pitch w/ 1 piece every 10 ft will require 16 pieces of gear. An average cam weighs 117 g, while an average passive piece weighs 56 g. Assuming an extendable draw is placed on each piece, and the climber uses equal passive and active gear, he'll place (117*8)+(56*8)+111*16 = 3.16 Kg worth of gear, but still be pulling up 3.25 Kg of rope. If the climber places gear less often than 10' (as I think many of us would) the weight difference will be even greater.
|
|
|
|
|
mreardon
Dec 3, 2002, 12:45 AM
Post #16 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 17, 2002
Posts: 1337
|
Don't know the physics, rope drag, or any of the science, however I do know that when I weighed my standard rack for doubling pitches with our 60m rope (most older pitches are 100 ft so we double pitches, or simulclimb a few feet) it weighed about 25 pounds. That's a lot of swinging armor for this 140 pound body in the beginning of the pitches!
|
|
|
|
|
brogers
Dec 3, 2002, 1:08 AM
Post #17 of 17
(2454 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 12, 2002
Posts: 30
|
It's also a well known fact of physics that gravitational pull decreases as the separation of the objects involved increases. Therefore, at the strat of the climb, when you are closer to the center of the earth, gravity is larger than at the end of the climb, when you are further from the center of the earth! We have to consider this as well!
|
|
|
|
|
|
