Oh gosh not you at all. No! Oops. Not you.

I think my comments (not to you at all) were just kind of "in the future" like what will this guy turn out to be like? I think he's going buy climberguy2011 or some such. I was just wondering what type of person he really is.

He just came off here as a really emo, angry person. When he does have kids (I actually hope he does. I hope he does by choice not accident.) he's going to learn how much work it takes to harness all that energy that is a child. Children are not awful but they sure do get a bad rap from people who don't raise theirs with love, compassion, etc...

When people go somewhere (like a crag) and let their kids go insane when other people are around it really makes them look bad or it should. Ironically people go off about the kids. In this case the parents were really the issue. They really were. But gosh even that's subjective. I didn't witness any of it. These kids may not have been that bad at all I have no idea. This guy feels they were though so I might be making a bigger mistake to take his word (I probably am.) for truth.

Anyway, someday this guy might get to try his hand at it. It's not the kids fault. They are really just wanting someone to notice them and take the time to get on their level. When you pay attention to kids the silence tells the tale. When you don't the chaos is hard to ignore unless... Well so anyway.

I just hope this guy does it better when/if it becomes his turn. Parenting is hard. Really hard. But it's fun too. I'm not one of those that thinks it makes you a better person and your a lesser person for not having kids. I don't buy into that. If you need "things" in your life to "make" you a better person then you've got big problems. Life's experiences should by nature make you better and whether you raise kids or don't really doesn't matter at all.

Wow I have rambled. I guess I'm responding to a few thoughts expressed.

To you though... no. Your words to me were kind and I appreciate them a lot. My reply was to you but not about you in the least. I can tell your living your life with a full rack and you have a pretty good idea about how to use it and when. That came right through. So I appreciated your comments a lot. Mine were to you but about the OP.

Hopefully that's more clear now. I meander a lot (I think I write a lot like I climb) and wander around when I'm writing.

I'm not going to say much about the original topic. I've seen annoying kids at the crag, I've seen bad parents at the crag. I've also climbed with people who bring their kids to the crag (Lena is one of them), with no calamitous effects..

Given that his username has "2011" in it (probably a graduation date), and that he sprays freshman-level pseudo intellect (overpopulation! I'll NEVER have kids! durrrrr), that he does not have a clear idea of basic genetics or reproduction ("I haven't allowed my chromosomes to join with an X chromosome," wft?), that he sprays on about taking a WFR class (Oh NOEZ! I skinned my knee! Good God get me a WFR!), here's my profile:

You're going to be a sophomore, probably started majoring in biology, switched your major to something like outdoor rec, you probably surround yourself with lesser climbers while boldly hangdogging the bolted 11a's, similarly, you sate your ego by aspiring to some sort of "guiding" job, and You probably have around a B-/C+ GPA. And whether I am right or not, you are going to tell me that you are really smart, and that you climb way better than your profile says.

that was fun.

Nope, never did.

Maybe you're forcing your opinions on child rearing on other people.

Maybe your a selfish prick for choosing to pursue the all the freedoms you enjoyed when you didn't have children. That's so unfair to your kids. You have to give things up for them; they're yours afterall. Your priorities are fucked up and you need to figure them out. The kids come first, not you.

I disagree with you. If you can't tell the difference between daycare because you have to work and the inherent dangers of climbing (that your kids did not ask for) AND there ARE things you have to give up as a parent, then you probably do not have the common sense to be a parent, let alone a climber. I'm not saying to teach them to stay at home and learn to knit and watch TV all day, but there is a difference between raising them in a bubble and exposing them to dangerous situations that they aren't able to handle. This is why kids don't drive. Or hang out in bars...Climbing is a serious, adult situation for adults. Thats not to say you can't teach them to climb...just be smart about it. And less selfish?

The FU is hardly enough. What a jackass. My kids started when they were two (yes two). They have grown into incredible kids, climbers, and friends to even some adults. They are very well behaved. Your elitist attitude sucks. Hope you climb here in Durango someday so my little 12 y/o bad ass can climb circles around your punk ass.

several weeks ago while hiking on a popular trail, I ran in to a completely naked 3-4 years old boy playing behind the rock with no parents in sight.

So I yell to nearest person in the trial if they know who this kid was belonging to and she said oh yaa, his parents are over there. Then i said; call them up and let come and get this kid or or I will be taking him down.

A minute later,some ignorant lady comes and says, yes that is my boy and what seems to be the problem ?

i reply nothing seems to be a problem but kids do disappear which make s a CF of hell for others to find your kid then she goes come on boy and kids run toward the trail. then she tells her husband; hey jeff, can you watch the boy while boy is running toward class 2 river.

WTF

So I ran in to guy and told him that river kills people in 1 minute so you may want to stop your kid from getting near it and the guy was so fucking relax like he did not give a sh*t if his kid died.

well, if that is you up there then do not bring your kid cause you will piss off people.

Swearing does make you look kools. I dont like or dislike kids, but would rather not be around them climbing. Simply because swear sometimes, Ok alot, and the last thing I want to hear is," HEY watch your mouth there are kids here." Like I give a shit. I usually tell parents in this case. I am not going to watch what I say I am not in court or church. Like you would find me in church anyways. They usually pack up. If the kids are a real pain just swear like you have torrets. If the parents yell at you Yell back. Show those little fuckers that you have a freedom of speech and you intend on exercising your right. This thould help fuel your fire

Congratulations. You may be a bigger douche than the OP.

There you go again, putting your opinions of things onto other people.

So I should stay home and take care of my kids. And not have a job? What shall I feed them with? What shall I do when I'm so stressed out by doing nothing but taking care of them that I want to kill them? Do I go to work? Well, how often? Oh please tell me oh fountain of wisdom.

I have four kids, based on your posts, I'd say they're all more thoughtful, intelligent, and well behaved than you.

I forgot to add that 3/4 of my kids climb better than you too.

You implying there's something wrong with dog-people?

[img]http://www.billpullman.org/film/spaceballs/S3.jpg[/img]

Parenting rescued me from a life of traveling at will, having plenty of money whenever I wanted something and generally getting-life-on however I chose. Boy I'm so glad they pulled me out of a life like that. Sounds so awful.

There's some truth to that... truly. But in return I have a ton of fun packed into 3 human beings sometimes I call them "human bings"

Job is an essential you fucktard. If you can't support your family enough to keep them happy then you are failing miserably. When you're a parent, you must think about your kids first (i.e. if I fell on an approach 10 years ago and broke my ankle it would hurt. If I fell now it would hurt, I wouldn't be able to work, and I wouldn't be able to play with my kids or do work around the house. As a post earlier noted, you see things differently. This is perfect example.

As for your model kids, that's great I hope they pass on the torch by looking out for number 1 first just like ol pops.



I could care less what your kids climb. I don't update my climbing logs because I could give a shit less what waterheads like you think. If your kids are as impressive as you think they could beat me in a mile run. You are acting like those annoying people who always want to whip out their wallets and shove pictures of their kids in my face. Those people crack me up.