|
jmnhawk
Aug 13, 2009, 1:53 PM
Post #1 of 13
(3809 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 10, 2009
Posts: 4
|
I'm looking into getting 60m of 7mm to tie into the lead rope for long rappels on multi-pitch routes. I'd like to use this as a haul line for the leader's pack, but that might put too much wear on the thin cord. I'm hoping to hear what works for people who use similar systems (types of cord, whether you use it as a haul line, too, etc) I've used doubles when climbing with friends, so I'm familiar with some aspects of the system (european death knot). Thanks
|
|
|
|
|
shoo
Aug 13, 2009, 2:35 PM
Post #2 of 13
(3792 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 1501
|
jmnhawk wrote: I'm looking into getting 60m of 7mm to tie into the lead rope for long rappels on multi-pitch routes. I'd like to use this as a haul line for the leader's pack, but that might put too much wear on the thin cord. I'm hoping to hear what works for people who use similar systems (types of cord, whether you use it as a haul line, too, etc) I've used doubles when climbing with friends, so I'm familiar with some aspects of the system (european death knot). Thanks
1. If it's the leader's pack, why isn't he wearing it? Why do you need to haul anything at all? The second brings the pack.
2. If you absolutely need to haul something (which you almost certainly don't unless you are big walling), you'll want a much more wear resistant line than 7mm cord. You'll shred that thing pretty fast.
3. Euro death knot with significantly different sized cords is a bad idea. If you want to rap a full rope length, the most convenient way is with doubles. If you must use a single and a skinny line, there are other options (biner/knot block, etc.), but they pretty much all suck in comparison to just using doubles.
4. Why is this in the alpine and ice forum?
|
|
|
|
|
jmnhawk
Aug 13, 2009, 3:14 PM
Post #3 of 13
(3766 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 10, 2009
Posts: 4
|
1) The leader wouldn't wear a pack if the climbing is near the limit of his or her ability. Also, in the case of a multi day apline effort when the second cannot carry eveything
Thanks for 2 and 3, I'll look into those
4) Because it's in the context multi-pitch ice or mixed climbing
|
|
|
|
|
shoo
Aug 13, 2009, 3:28 PM
Post #4 of 13
(3758 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 22, 2006
Posts: 1501
|
jmnhawk wrote: 1) The leader wouldn't wear a pack if the climbing is near the limit of his or her ability. Also, in the case of a multi day apline effort when the second cannot carry eveything Thanks for 2 and 3, I'll look into those 4) Because it's in the context multi-pitch ice or mixed climbing
In that case, I defer to better opinion. My experience with multi-day alpine is non-existent.
However, it would make it easier for others to help you if you could specify the kind of climbing you plan on doing, such as how many days, specific routes, what kind of conditions, what you'll be hauling, etc.
|
|
|
|
|
.sam.
Aug 13, 2009, 9:47 PM
Post #5 of 13
(3707 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 19, 2008
Posts: 21
|
streling makes some nice technora crod called power cord which ive used its very strong and abrashion resistant. another option is to use the skinnyest twin rope you can find use it for tagging hauling ect. if your main single line is damaged you still have a dynamic rope. if you do use a static line get it longer than 60m to acomidate for the strech in your main line
|
|
|
|
|
coastal_climber
Aug 14, 2009, 12:24 AM
Post #6 of 13
(3672 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 17, 2006
Posts: 2542
|
Get about 65m, since the lead line stretches.
|
|
|
|
|
the_climber
Aug 14, 2009, 5:15 PM
Post #8 of 13
(3621 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 9, 2003
Posts: 6142
|
We use 7mm static tag lines a lot. Matching the legth meter for meter with your lead line will leave you short.
Our setups that we use include a 55m 7mm line matched with 50m rope, a 75m (or is it 78m) 7mm with a 70m rope, and a 100m 7mm rope matched with a 80m rope.
That last one will be cut down a bit. About the best way to match the length is to get too long of a 7mm line and stretch yout lead line on rap add ~2m on top of that and mark the tag line. Cut at home, and there you have it.
Keep in mind when buying/ordering those lengths of 7mm cord that many spools of static cord are split/spliced aomwhere in the middle. IF you're planning on ordering a spool and cutting it down yourself make it clear when you order that you need a spool that isn't split/spliced! Same goes if your local shop needs to order a new spool to meet your needs.
As for attaching the ropes... we use a double fishermans on the lead line and a tripple fishermans on the 7mm. That works for us on ropes from 9.1mm to 11mm.
(This post was edited by the_climber on Aug 14, 2009, 5:16 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
budman
Aug 14, 2009, 5:30 PM
Post #9 of 13
(3608 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 10, 2004
Posts: 170
|
Personally use a 6mm Esprit Personal Escape. My lead and tag are 60m, just a personal preference that works fine for me. Dam thing is tough and takes the abuse. I use the system you suggest, where I'll haul a small pack on multi pitch climbs when the climbing gets hard. Esprit is out of Canada, they are online, and great people to talk to when you have questions. Have quite a few friends that have used their ropes on expeditions with only good things to say about their products.
|
|
|
|
|
adnix
Aug 14, 2009, 8:18 PM
Post #10 of 13
(3576 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 20, 2003
Posts: 584
|
In reply to: I'm looking into getting 60m of 7mm to tie into the lead rope for long rappels on multi-pitch routes
Why would you need a 7 mm cord?
If I know I'll have to do long vertical rappels I always choose half/twin ropes. It saves some weight.
If rappeling unlikely or if it's done only in case of retreat I mostly choose one single rope of 60m. It's usually long enough for rappeling. You might have to leave a sling or two in some cases but I don't think that as a problem. You can always replace them. It also gives motivation for sending the route.
|
|
|
|
|
.sam.
Aug 15, 2009, 2:44 AM
Post #11 of 13
(3551 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 19, 2008
Posts: 21
|
one other option i forgot to mention before you go out ordering all kinds of sppols is a simple one. if hauling is your primary concern a nice option is to use a single rope and when the leader reaches a point wear he feels that the pck will threaten his ability they clip it to a piece of pro. when the second reaches the pack they use their cordellett to tie a prussic at head hight or a little higher the reast dangels down and the leaders pack is attached by a sling. this way as the leader pulls the rope up he is hauling the bag and if the seconed climbs fast and geirates slack the prussic is high enough it wont go directly on him. works well if the leaders pack is light. if not use a direct off the ancher belay and put a prussic on the seconds side clip this to the sack side and it will give you a simple self locking pully it is slower to take in slack but if the climbings hard it shoudent be a problem
|
|
|
|
|
jmnhawk
Aug 16, 2009, 11:34 AM
Post #12 of 13
(3500 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 10, 2009
Posts: 4
|
Thank you all for the constructive advice. This has been extremely helpful.
|
|
|
|
|
sspssp
Aug 20, 2009, 6:32 PM
Post #13 of 13
(3376 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 2, 2003
Posts: 1731
|
Some where along the way I have tried almost every combination of ropes.
I've gone with a 6mm. It save weight but I found it difficult to handle.
7mm works fine. If you are only occasionally hauling a pack that isn't too heavy, it should be fine. But it will eventually fuzz up with a lot of heavy hauling (although 7mm static is not too pricey to just replace as needed).
I tie the ropes together with a EDK. I do make the tails long enough that I can take the tail of the skinny cord and tie a fisherman knot with it (so the skinny tail cannot pull through the EDK). Double fisherman is also safe (but can be more of a pain to untie).
Nowadays, I'm more inclined to carry a dynamic 8.1mm because of the back up potential.
Make sure you rap system can handle the skinny cord. I have been happy with the Jaws (atc style with V slots) and a leather glove.
(This post was edited by sspssp on Aug 20, 2009, 6:35 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
