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billcoe_
Oct 18, 2009, 5:05 AM
Post #26 of 52
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tigerlilly wrote: Things I look for in climbing pants: Stretch - I can't stand clothing that binds Slim or cinchable at the ankle Thigh pockets - low enough to be out of the way of leg loops and big enough for a Clif bar Nothing inside the waistband - size adjusters usually dig in when you have a harness on No belts or cute little sashes at the waist - they just get in the way Non-cotton
This!
Make the pockets not too far down to use and make them deep too so that clif bar doesn't fall out, and/or have one zip as well. I'm wearing a dry pair of Outdoor research pants that saw somewhere between 2-3 inches of rain today. Of course, most of that was watching it from an overhang:-)
Stonemaster sucks as they do use cotton, lots of it, although I see they finally have a pair that is only 30% cotton available for sale now. I've tried Mike Grahams stuff when he was doing Grammici, and IMO, these OR pants are as comfortable as any cotton pant Grammici ever made. Patagonia pioneered outdoor fabrics that performed in adverse conditions, while Royal Robbins used lots of organic cotton and went for "comfort and style". Learn from that lesson as Robbins sales appear to be a small fraction of Patagonia's. FORM SHOULD FOLLOW FUNCTION! Not the reverse. In the case of RR and Patagonia, it appears you can't just market or sell cheaper and get market share.
Good luck!
(This post was edited by billcoe_ on Oct 18, 2009, 4:10 PM)
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rgold
Oct 18, 2009, 6:00 AM
Post #27 of 52
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A whole lot of U.S. cragging is sunny and dry, that's what the Stonemaster pants were designed for, and I think there's nothing better. But why they fit so well and move so superbly is not easy to describe. You'd have to buy a pair and study the construction.
In wetter climates or alpine conditions, some kind of softshell fabric like the expensive but very effective Schoeller materials is called for. But the pattern still counts; I've owned four or five such pants and they haven't been equally good. If Stonemaster chose to make a Schoeller alpine climbing pant, I'm guessing it would be the best of the lot.
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jaablink
Oct 18, 2009, 3:12 PM
Post #28 of 52
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charlenelieu wrote: doesn't jeans restrict your movements for high steps and heel hooks?
Of course it is easier to make those moves in shorts or a lightweight synthetic pant ,or naked- even better … I can still do them in jeans. In the temps we have here now in NH, I wear thermals under my jeans and still make very technical moves. In the dead of winter - I have gone to the Gunks in snow pants & thermals, and pull roof after roof all day, that require heal hooks and really stretchy moves (the thick clothing may not be optimal but you will adapt ). You sacrifice protection , warmth, and durability for lightweight and flexibility.(there is always a trade off somewhere) Also keep in mind that lightweight rip stopper fabrics for clothing are tested on the trail… they may encounter occasional contact with branches & scrub brush., but they do not hold up to the abuse they will encounter from the rock.
You wear what you like to be comfortable in the environment you are in, with the monies you can afford to through away (it adds up fast). I like a comfortable jean that gives me some added protection when using knee bars, crack climbing, the daily wear the rock and outdoor environments place on the fabrics , and light on the wallet…
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error
Oct 18, 2009, 4:43 PM
Post #29 of 52
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Posts: 69
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Vinny_A wrote: My favorite pair of climbing pants are my Levi 514 Slim Straights, the best pair of jeans I have ever owned. I have had one pair for years with no rips/tears in them. 
My 0.02:
1. No belt loops. An internal low profile webbing belt would be perfect.
2. Breathable softshell fabric with reinforced ankle patches and waterproof seat and knees.
3. How about a small zippered thigh pocket for car keys? People normally change jackets over the day, and it is such a PITA to dig out the car keys in the dark when you are cold, tired, and miserable.
4. Make them affordable. There's no point to buy $150 pants and shred them in the third outing.
5. Hint: if you are going to offer repair service, tailor the inner lower leg panel as separate part. In that way, crampon-shred pants can be repaired easily: just open the seam, replace the torn panel, and send 'em back.
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Vinny_A
Oct 18, 2009, 4:57 PM
Post #30 of 52
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error wrote: Vinny_A wrote: My favorite pair of climbing pants are my Levi 514 Slim Straights, the best pair of jeans I have ever owned. I have had one pair for years with no rips/tears in them. It might be a good idea to add some reinforcement patches at the ankle - crampon holes may be pretty big sometimes Unfortunately for me, I don't ice climb  (some day I will learn though). If I did though, I would have a nice pair of soft shell pants to climb in, not my jeans
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wccranne
Oct 18, 2009, 6:40 PM
Post #31 of 52
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charlenelieu wrote: caughtinside wrote: But truth be told price is the most important factor. I abuse them and expect them to wear out fast, so I don't pay more than 20 dollars. Outlets and thrift stores is where I shop for climbing pants, but I see lots of climbers with $70 pants so the market is there. But would you pay $70 if there's a 5 year guarantee and lifetime repair service?
Yes, I personally would. I wear carhartts while climbing as they are cheap and very durable, although can be stiff and restrictive at times. Typically I wear the standard pants, but will even wear the heavier double fronts in cooler weather. I have been climbing in my current pair for almost two years and barely any tears; they are also great protection for off widths. I find most climbing pant material too gossamer for any real protection against insult, and frankly too expensive.
So if a $70 pant had a guarantee and lifetime repair, heck yes Id be interested!
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tigerlilly
Oct 18, 2009, 6:59 PM
Post #32 of 52
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caughtinside wrote: A gal pal of mine often complains of fashion before function on womens pants. Womens harness rises are high, but most pants hang lower on thehips. I guess this is fairly uncomfortable. She wears unfashionable high waisted pants but she's in the minority.
I'll second this. Plus, it seems most women's outdoor wear is designed for cute young things in their 20's. Some of us who climb are rapidly approaching the mid-century mark and look better with more coverage rather than less. We are apparently enough of a minority that the market largely ignores us. Just try to find a women's shirt that actually stays tucked into your pants, or even reaches down to meet the damn pants, for heaven's sake.
My Patagonia Guide pants are probably my fav for all the reasons I mentioned, plus the waistband is actually at my waist. Too bad they are too warm for much of the season.
Kathy
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west_by_god_virginia
Oct 18, 2009, 8:05 PM
Post #33 of 52
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Registered: Mar 5, 2009
Posts: 106
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patagonia rock guide pants....in black
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tradrenn
Oct 18, 2009, 8:18 PM
Post #34 of 52
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I love my Prana Spendex pants, they are so comfortable, stretchable, don't limit my movement, it almost like I'm climbing naked.
I think it could be a good idea to bring them back but, maybe skip on all that crazy patterns from the 80'ties and make them all green or gray for boys and nice blue or pink for girls.
V.
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lena_chita
Moderator
Oct 18, 2009, 8:24 PM
Post #35 of 52
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charlenelieu wrote: Oh, and how much do you care about how they look? This is especially for the ladies... 'cause there are plenty of technical climbing clothes I would not be caught dead in.
Agreed!
I think you would have to break it up separately into male and female perfect pants, b/c IMO it is not going to be just the exact same model that is made with smaller waist and wider hips to fit women.
In my experience, women are looking for different things than men in climbing pants. I bet you that everyone replying that they love clmbing in jeans, Carharts, and the like is a male-- that's for starters. I've seen many guys climbing in jeans or various strong canvas/twill pants. Women-- not so much.
my requirements would be two-part, one set for warm weather, and one set for cold.
Warm:
-stretchy
-breathable and quick-drying
-length just below knees or midcalf
-low waist that doesn't interfere with harness
-flat seams
--and ---please!!! this is my pet pieve--- no extra buttons, zippers, belt loops, 10 side/back/front pockets, flaps, drawstring cords, etc. etc.
Cold:
-Wind-resistant fabric
-Some sort of a snap at the bottom of the legs that would allow you to roll up the pants and keep the rolls in place while climbing, so you are not stepping on your pant leg, but release easily once you aren't climbing, for warmth.
-loose enough to be able to put layers underneath, if needed, but still form-fitting enough that you don't look like a sack.
-pockets, belt loops, etc.-- once again, kept to the minimum
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TradEddie
Oct 18, 2009, 9:41 PM
Post #36 of 52
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Posts: 164
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10 years ago, my wife bought me two pairs of Grammicci nylon pants that are still going strong. Sure I'm only a weekend warrior but those pants have been through just about everything in those ten years and are holding up better than I am.
Nylon that dries in minutes, unobtrusive belt, great rip-stop, big pockets. And they look like sweatpants, so nobody thinks you are posing...
TE
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paulraphael
Oct 19, 2009, 3:17 AM
Post #37 of 52
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Registered: Feb 6, 2004
Posts: 670
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I wear jeans for everything. Except climbing! Can't stand them for that.
My favoritest rock climbing pants of all time are Prana Stretch Zions. For one thing, they're among the only ones that fit. I have long legs; most climbng pants fit me like knickers even though they're not.
The cut Is comfortable, mobile, and looks good enough to wear around town. They're nylon, but don't look like it. They're durable and dry quickly.
Complaints: they changed to a new style of built-in belt which is dorky. It broke on my last pair. Earlier version had a better belt but a velcro fly that I didn't like. Expensive (but worth it ... my oldest pair looks shabby but i've never worn any of these out).
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shockabuku
Oct 19, 2009, 3:45 AM
Post #38 of 52
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I like a waistband with a built-in belt and buckle with a little elastic to spread out the gathering. Slightly stretchable is nice but I really prefer pants that fit. Most pants I find these days that fit my waist don't fit my butt and legs. Thigh cargo pockets are nice; low profile, not too big. Durable stitching and tough but not coarse fabric. Being able to cinch up the ankles is nice so I don't catch my shoes in my pants. Gusseted crotch. Light as well as dark colors. Dark is great for cool weather but sucks in the summer.
(This post was edited by shockabuku on Oct 19, 2009, 3:49 AM)
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landongw
Oct 19, 2009, 3:57 AM
Post #39 of 52
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Posts: 114
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fast drying nylon
non cotton
heavy denim like fabric or thin softshell reinforced but and knee
lap glued seems for water repellency
dwr finish
dirt colored
pockets on legs, zippered so stuff can't fall out
draw string on cuffs
big enough cuff to fit over an ice boot/ski boot for approach (straight leg boot cut)
gusseted crotch
articulated knees
integrated belt
holes on cuffs to substitute for gaiters, long enough legs to accommodate that. (ankle sunburn is a bitch)
sexy cut, this is very important :)
this would be my ideals for a mountain pant for 3 season use or paired with a gore-tex shell. obviously you would want something different for desert climbing.
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olive
Oct 19, 2009, 4:36 AM
Post #40 of 52
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First things that came to my mind
Things that I absolutely look for:
gusseted crotch
comfortable but durable fabric
some flexibility
non-cotton/quick drying
something that fits and looks good - I cant make myself wear things that look awful on me even if they are functional - thus, yes, I do care about how my climbing clothing looks.
Things that would be nice to have
pockets that have zippers
colors beside black and beige/sand etc.
I have some blurr pants that I love. They are not extremely flexible but enough that I can highstep easily, have gusseted crotch, are extremely durable (do not rip at all), are not very thin so I can wear them when it is chilly (it feels like it is easier to find warmer weather climbing pants) and last but not least: they have a really cool cut.
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olive
Oct 19, 2009, 4:39 AM
Post #41 of 52
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lena_chita wrote: -Wind-resistant fabric -Some sort of a snap at the bottom of the legs that would allow you to roll up the pants and keep the rolls in place while climbing, so you are not stepping on your pant leg, but release easily once you aren't climbing, for warmth.
I think this is a great idea...
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airscape
Oct 19, 2009, 8:19 AM
Post #42 of 52
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Registered: Feb 26, 2001
Posts: 4240
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Levi 501
Very comfy and they last forever.
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ladyscarlett
Oct 19, 2009, 8:48 AM
Post #43 of 52
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If you can make it functional AND pleasurable, well there would be some pants! I have no idea how you would go about this though.
I have a wool jacket that though fleece lined, has satin lined sleeves, and putting my bare arms into the sleeves always gives me a tingle of pleasure.
To have a pair of climbing pants that gives me tingles might help me ignore the fact that I wear them 7 to 10 days in a row!
Not a priority, I know, but I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to figure out a way to have a little functional feel good while having fun....
just a thought
cheers
ls
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mikebee
Oct 19, 2009, 9:09 AM
Post #44 of 52
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I recently got a pair of Arc'Teryx Spotter Pants.
I've been quite enjoying them for cooler weather climbing. Burly Canvas, deep pockets (below leg loop length), gusseted crotch and awesome fit make them strong contenders I reckon.
In hot weather (ie Aussie summers) I tend to climb in my Prana Mojo shorts. Mega comfy, quick drying (double as boardies if needed) and they feel super light. The plain elasticated waist works a treat too.
Mountain Hardware Mesa Pants get a honourable mention too. Good for if you might get a bit wet, or if 9oz canvas is too heavy, then these are great. Drawcord around the ankles, low profile waist, cargo pockets below leg loops, gusseted crotch and quickdrying pretty abrasion resistant nylon.
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ghisino
Oct 19, 2009, 10:45 AM
Post #45 of 52
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(for sport climbing and bouldering)
fabric : anything that feels nice on the skin. Big no on totally syntethic stuff, the best i found is cotton mixed to a very low percentage of stretch fibers.
cut : i like a combination of low waist, high inseam, diamond crotch and really baggy legs. I find it gives the best overall freedom of movement.
most contemporary design have too much distance between belt and inseam- the result is that either you have a low rapper-like crotch that's stylish but really limiting leg movement, or you have to tighten them really high on your belly, limiting breathing to some extent, or to roll up the waist.
my test for any climbing pant is to put them on and lift one foot as high as possible, spread it to the sides, etc... the perfect climbing pant should feel like there isn't any friction between fabric and skin, not even at the most extreme range of movement.
also, i can say that the most committing test for climbing-specific a pant is bouldering.
Harnesses somehow help to keep your pants up and fix the "rapper inseam" problem, so for sport climbing basically any pant with baggy legs feels ok.
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yodadave
Oct 19, 2009, 1:04 PM
Post #46 of 52
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for shorts i second the stretch zions, for pants i have some patagucci synthetic carharrt look-a-likes.
I like both for the same reasons;
they fit my skinny ass 27/28 inch waist
gussetted crotch, before these i would shred the crotch of pants in months
they look good at the end of the day (they dry fast, don't hold stains, don't rip and mud can be brushed off easily
they are comfy, if they weren't i wouldn't wear them
they were both on sale cheap, i refuse to pay the overinflated "technical" clothing tax
now if they could be improved it would be in their eco friendliness
as synthetics they are both pretty much oil products. Are there and companies working on soy based fabrics? if we can make crash pad foam from soy surely we can make fabrics.
P.S. patagucci no longer makes the synthetic carharrts to my knowledge 
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ncrockclimber
Oct 19, 2009, 1:40 PM
Post #47 of 52
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Carhartt or Dickies. If at all possible, I wear shorts. However, when the weather gets too cold, I like the heavy duty cotton. I only rock climb (no alpine) so tech fabrics are not that big of a draw for me.
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sspssp
Oct 19, 2009, 8:08 PM
Post #48 of 52
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charlenelieu wrote: I'm a clothing designer and am tired of ripping my pants on the wall... about to design "the perfect climbing pants" and wanted to know about what you would like to see in climbing pants.
I think you should say ask about "perfect pants" for what type of climbing.
For alpine climbing I have both the Patagonia guide pants and, for warmer/lighter conditions, the simple guide pants. They fit well and have enough stretch and they have been durable and have zip pockets.
I like zip pockets both because it keeps things from falling out and a pocket that is zipped closed cannot snag the nose of a carabiner like a normal pocket can. I hate expensive pants that have zip pockets with flimsy mesh inside. After a few months of walking around with car keys, that mesh has a hole and the pockets are no longer usuable.
An elastic top without belt or belt loops for comfort under a harness.
Reinforced knees and seat.
There seems to be a lack of good choices for warmer, multi-pitch conditions.
From time to time I have found a light pair of pants that have zip pockets, a good fit, and decent durability. Lately, most of the pants that have zip pockets have some type of breathable/water resistant fabric and they seem to be either too warm/heavy and/or they have zero durability.
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nodakclimber
Oct 19, 2009, 9:49 PM
Post #49 of 52
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Registered: Aug 12, 2009
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prana zion stretch pants. I use them for every climb unless it's too hot. I where my prana mojos when the heat gets too overwhelming.
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boadman
Oct 19, 2009, 10:16 PM
Post #50 of 52
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I'll be the big-thighed tester. I'm 6' tall and 200 pounds, most climbing pants don't really fit my legs.
charlenelieu wrote: caughtinside wrote: If there was a guarantee like that I think you would lose money. No material or seams can hold up to a large volume of climbing for that long. The alternative would be to have heavyweight fabrics and triple stitching, which wouldake them hotter and stiffer. With advanced technical materials, I think it's possible to have lightweight and rip stop... the seam is an issue, but there is now heat seal reinforcements... I've got beta testers lined up around the country to test the new designs... I'm not willing ot settle for hot stiff pants. I mean, whatever it is I design, I'm gonna have to want to wear em myself. I don't intend to lose money on this, with advance wear test, I will know how long the pants would last before I offer the guarantee. |
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