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evanwish
Jan 14, 2010, 7:26 AM
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Two of my partners and I are planning on breaking into big walls together this May.
Our first three climbs planned are the South Face Washington Column, Leaning Tower, and NW Face of Half Dome (because we don't have enough $$$ yet for portaledges).
For a group of two or three, would it be best to get one BIG bag and split the cost or two of us get our own smaller bags?
And... for routes like the ones mentioned above, how many cubic inches would be best?
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Durin
Jan 14, 2010, 4:26 PM
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On SFWC and LT(I'm assuming west face), you have nice large bivy ledges -- especially on SFWC. Dinner ledge is enormous. If you packed em tight you could get 25 people up there.
Even on the Ahwahnee Ledge on Leaning Tower, you have room to take tons of stuff out of the piggy and simply set it down.
If you can fit all your stuff for 3 people into one big bag for said walls, do it for sure. It won't get stuck as much as 2 bags, and it's easier to dock it and move it around.
If you're on a 3-4 day route on portaledges, do you want to take 3 people's worth of gear out of your one haulbag and hang it or set it on the ledge, all at the same time, to get to your sleeping mat, or that clif bar that fell to the bottom?
Having just experienced 5 days of Zodiac last week, I was facepalming myself for bringing one huge bag instead of two little ones.
For 3 people on SFWC or WFLT, 2 days each, you might be able to get by with the biggest haulbag BD makes (140 liters). Otherwise I'd go with two 100-liter bags. Basically, on the smaller walls it doesn't matter. On larger walls you want two bags.
I haven't done the face of half dome yet -- I planned it out and it fizzled at the last minute. But all of the advice I've heard from everyone is that doing it wall-style is a pain. Out of the first 17 pitches, 13 go at 5.9 or under. If you can cruise the 5.10c section, you've only got to aid two short sections and then a bolt ladder before getting to Big Sandy Ledge. I encourage you to think about doing it in a long day instead -- even if it takes 20, or even 30 hours.
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climbingaz
Jan 14, 2010, 6:06 PM
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How about just a party of two on SFWC? Would you still recommend the largest BD bag (Zion) or maybe the middle size (Touchstone)?
(This post was edited by climbingaz on Jan 14, 2010, 6:14 PM)
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evanwish
Jan 14, 2010, 9:24 PM
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Yeah we're just sticking to portaledge-less routes till I actually get an income.. ( and besides, the routes look great!!)
I'm pretty sure I'll be getting a Fish haul bag too. I just want to get something that will last long and work for most walls.
As far as Half Dome, I think we'd pack light (think alpine style) and free as much as possible to speed up hauling and the approach/descent. and bivy on the ledges of course
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Durin
Jan 14, 2010, 10:24 PM
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I did SFWC as a party of two. We used a Metolius bag about the same size as a BD Touchstone. It was plenty.
Also, I have a BD Zion (140 liters) but recommend against it. I love most BD gear, but not their haulbags. If you can, get one where the straps at the bottom continue all the way up the side and over the top. Hope you can visualize that. I think Fish bags all do that.
The Half Dome route really isn't that long. It doesn't require too much aid, and hauling on it isn't really alpine style at all. Light and fast on that route means NO sleeping bag, NO stove, NO haulbag. When it gets dark, spoon on the pitch 17 bivy ledge, or climb through the night.
Setting up a minitraxion to haul a "small" bag with a third rope to bring up three people's worth of bivvy gear will slow you down horribly as the bag drags over slabs, up chimneys and through roofs.
Do it in a push!
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evanwish
Jan 14, 2010, 10:58 PM
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Durin wrote: It doesn't require too much aid, and hauling on it isn't really alpine style at all. Light and fast on that route means NO sleeping bag, NO stove, NO haulbag. When it gets dark, spoon on the pitch 17 bivy ledge, or climb through the night.
of course not, but i mean like still bring only the lightest gear, no stove, no extra food, and my sleeping bag is so small its only about 4x4x6" when stuffed and super light. I'm just going to be tired by the Big Sandy! lol
i'll decide on that one later though, i still have Washington Column and WFLT on the list first!
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Durin
Jan 15, 2010, 5:51 AM
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Awesome, best of luck to you =)
Also, you might consider not finishing SFWC. The top couple pitches are loose -- climbers on dinner ledge have been killed by rockfall from other climbers on the last two pitches of SFWC. My partner and I decided in advance to rap from the big tree (forget what pitch) to dinner ledge and then rap out. Didn't have to bring the piggy past Dinner ledge! Regardless, be cognizant of this if you do top it out. It's not as satisfying, but the top pitches are supposedly crap anyway. The money of the climb is the Kor Roof and the few ensuing C1 pitches.
I was glad we brought a set of hooks (one normal cam hook, one wide, one talon, one cliffhanger, one grappling) on WFLT.
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evanwish
Jan 15, 2010, 6:09 AM
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yeah we're still deciding on rap or walk...
but that's a great tip about the hooks. We didn't know if they were needed on that route so i'll definitely pick up some.
thanks!
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dugl33
Jan 16, 2010, 10:11 PM
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I would recommend not getting the biggest of haul bags. You could probably get a team of three up a small 2 day wall with a bag the size of the metolius half dome.
If you need more, you could get a "half dome" and a "quarter dome". This gives you three options, from a quick light push with the quarter dome all the way to the 1-1/2 combo of the half dome and quarter dome. Remember, you gotta carry these suckers to the climb and the descent or walk off. Nice to be able to split loads a bit easier, bulky stuff in the big pig, heavier stuff in the smaller pig.
Anyhoo, just another strategy. Hook the smaller piggy below the bigger pig. Choo Choo.
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evanwish
Jan 17, 2010, 4:38 AM
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ok, so i'm thinking i will get the Fish Budget haul bag, 7,500 cu (100 less than the Metolious Half Dome)
an El Cap bag is just way too "ahead of the game" for me right now (i want to get on it when i am in TOP TOP shape so i can do it quickly and without risking slowing anyone down). When that day comes i think we'll haul two bags.
Anybody know how long it takes Russ to make and ship a bag?
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russwalling
Jan 17, 2010, 5:44 AM
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evanwish wrote: ok, so i'm thinking i will get the Fish Budget haul bag, 7,500 cu (100 less than the Metolious Half Dome) Anybody know how long it takes Russ to make and ship a bag?
Depends™
An item like that can be on the way in a few days if I'm in town. If I'm out of town, like I am right now, be sure to put a "drop dead date" on your order for a timely delivery.
My .02 on haul bags and sizes:
I use a Grade V bag. Each guy on the team uses 1 grade V bag. If you have more stuff than that, run the overflow in an Atom Smasher. When the wall is done, carry the atom smasher down in one of the haul bags. (since there will be room from all the beer you have consumed the last few days.) The above is a good method for something in the 3 to maybe 4 nights range..... for a short wall outing, one night or so, maybe just one bag like the Budget, and perhaps an Atom Smasher just to keep things tidy.
In the end though.... it all depends. 
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guangzhou
Jan 22, 2010, 5:50 AM
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I own two medium bag from Black Diamond and a Small Metolius haul bag for one day blast on long routes.
I decided on the smaller bags bigger two bags are mor versatile. One Grade V walls, one is usually enough for both me and my partner. On long Grade six, we use two bags. That also makes carrying everything out a bit easier when we're done.
Cheers
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evanwish
Jan 24, 2010, 11:40 PM
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russwalling wrote: evanwish wrote: ok, so i'm thinking i will get the Fish Budget haul bag, 7,500 cu (100 less than the Metolious Half Dome) Anybody know how long it takes Russ to make and ship a bag? Depends™ An item like that can be on the way in a few days if I'm in town. If I'm out of town, like I am right now, be sure to put a "drop dead date" on your order for a timely delivery. My .02 on haul bags and sizes: I use a Grade V bag. Each guy on the team uses 1 grade V bag. If you have more stuff than that, run the overflow in an Atom Smasher. When the wall is done, carry the atom smasher down in one of the haul bags. (since there will be room from all the beer you have consumed the last few days.) The above is a good method for something in the 3 to maybe 4 nights range..... for a short wall outing, one night or so, maybe just one bag like the Budget, and perhaps an Atom Smasher just to keep things tidy. In the end though.... it all depends.
order sent, thanks!!
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