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jkotranza
Mar 25, 2010, 2:01 AM
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Hello all, let me start by saying I have aabsolutley no clue about the first thing when it comes to rock climbing. But I think you who do are my best bet for answering some questions. So this is not exacty rock climbing related but I will be using rock climbing equipment. So here is goes. I was in a car accident a year and a half ago leaving me paralyzed. Being an avid deer hunter this posed many problems for me. First of all I have had to hunt from the ground for the last two years. I am now working to get back into a tree stand the best proscess I have come up with to reach the 20 feet or so in the air I want to get is to use a rock climbing harness and rope tying loops in it every 1.5 feet or so and pulling myself up loop by loop while being hooked to the rope at all times. So I guess my question is who can tell me if this is an idea that will actually work or am i being dumb with this idea and if am is there a better way to do this? secondy, I need advice on equipment. On this site i seen a harrness that was reasonably cheap and seemed like it will work for what I want to do the Alpine bod... also I need advice on a good rope. I want to leave it outside all the time septbember through december. Is this a bad idea? it will be out in rain snow and ice I don't want it to wear and break on me... also i am assuming I need special clips for cimbing so If some could tell me how good or bad of an idea this is I would appreciate it. Also I don't know if it matters but there won't be any sharp edges for the rope to contend with just the weather. I am about 215lbs and 6' tall so really any one with some information It would be SOOOOOO helpful thank you Josh
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coastal_climber
Mar 25, 2010, 2:34 AM
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one word: paragraphs.
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happiegrrrl
Mar 25, 2010, 2:56 AM
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I don't really have an answer for the OP's question since I don't have the technical ability to explain jugging a rope with ascenders. But I do have one question.... How will you get the rope up there?
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jkotranza
Mar 25, 2010, 3:01 AM
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I have hunting buddies that are more than willing to help me out in that aspect. And to help me hang the stand.
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bhp
Mar 25, 2010, 3:17 AM
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For rope you'll want a pretty burly static rope, which is often sold by the foot so you don't have to buy a full "standard" length. There are probably lots of ways to do this, but one way is with a pair of ascenders like this: http://www.rei.com/product/782459. Each one gets tied to your harness, then you ascend by pulling yourself up on one, sliding the other one up the rope, rinse, repeat. The method you propose seems possible, but I think with all the clipping and unclipping you would get tired pretty quickly.
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jkotranza
Mar 25, 2010, 3:37 AM
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Thank you for your advice
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gmggg
Mar 25, 2010, 1:57 PM
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jkotranza wrote: Hello all, let me start by saying I have aabsolutley no clue about the first thing when it comes to rock climbing. But I think you who do are my best bet for answering some questions. So this is not exacty rock climbing related but I will be using rock climbing equipment. So here is goes. I was in a car accident a year and a half ago leaving me paralyzed. Being an avid deer hunter this posed many problems for me. First of all I have had to hunt from the ground for the last two years. I am now working to get back into a tree stand the best proscess I have come up with to reach the 20 feet or so in the air I want to get is to use a rock climbing harness and rope tying loops in it every 1.5 feet or so and pulling myself up loop by loop while being hooked to the rope at all times. So I guess my question is who can tell me if this is an idea that will actually work or am i being dumb with this idea and if am is there a better way to do this? secondy, I need advice on equipment. On this site i seen a harrness that was reasonably cheap and seemed like it will work for what I want to do the Alpine bod... also I need advice on a good rope. I want to leave it outside all the time septbember through december. Is this a bad idea? it will be out in rain snow and ice I don't want it to wear and break on me... also i am assuming I need special clips for cimbing so If some could tell me how good or bad of an idea this is I would appreciate it. Also I don't know if it matters but there won't be any sharp edges for the rope to contend with just the weather. I am about 215lbs and 6' tall so really any one with some information It would be SOOOOOO helpful thank you Josh No one quoted this?? Anyway, you are making it too difficult. Just use a collapsible or rope ladder: with a via ferrata lanyard clipped to a rung above your head. Here's a picture and location for that: This connects to your harness and you can clip one carabiner into the upper rung take a step up, clip the other carabiner to a higher rung, take a step up, un-clip the lower carabiner and re clip it to a higher rung, repeat till you are in your stand. Just make sure that the top clip is always at or above shoulder level. You could also do this if they had'nt made it illegal.
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j_ung
Mar 25, 2010, 2:29 PM
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Sorry to hear about your accident, man. Glad you're you're still getting out there. IMO, none of the suggestions (including your own) really take into account your paralysis and how that will effect your freedom of movement. Doesn't mean you're fucked, though. Check this guy out: http://saltlake2002.paralympic.org/.../wellman_video.html# (Google "Mark Wellman," for much more.) Check the first video and pay particular attention to the ascending system he uses. Now, he's climbing much longer distances than you will be, so maybe you don't need such a complicated rig. But, armed with the knowledge that there is something better than what you have in mind, I think you should find an AMGA guide to spend a day with you and devise a system that is both convenient and effective. Edit: where do you live?
(This post was edited by j_ung on Mar 25, 2010, 2:30 PM)
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qtm
Mar 25, 2010, 2:32 PM
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Sorry to hear about the accident and the injury. Do you have the use of your legs? From your description, it seems that you were planning on pulling yourself up by your arms alone. The usual way of using ascenders is to push one up high, stand up on a sling attached to the ascender, then move the next one up and hang off that. If you can't stand up, ascenders probably won't be too effective as you're going to be using both arms to pull yourself up, and won't be able to move the other ascender. If that's the case, a self-belay device like the Silent Partner might be more useful to you. As you pull yourself up, the (weighted) rope feeds through the device. Still, hauling yourself up is a lot of work. You might just want to rig a 3:1 or 5:1 pulley system to lift you up. Remember, you have to get down, and the ascenders won't do the trick there, you'd have to rap. I think it might be safer to use the same pulley lift system, especially if your body is chilled and your fingers half-frozen. Anyway, good luck!
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soNVclimbing
Mar 25, 2010, 2:59 PM
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I would recommend not buying a harness but, instead go to your local west marine and buy a bosun's chair. It will be much easier to get into and you can hang in it for hours unlike most harnesses.
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acorneau
Mar 25, 2010, 3:01 PM
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Get a nice fat static rope, toss it over a high limb and tie one end to a low limb or the trunk. Get a Grigri, an ascender and a DMM Revolver locker or a simple pulley on a locker (optional, but makes things easier). Rig the Grigri to your harness and the ascender above with the pulley. Run the free end coming from the Grigri up through the pulley. Pull on this end until you're up to the ascender, the Grigri will lock holding you in place, then slide the ascender up as high as you can reach. Repeat until you're up to the stand.
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captainstatic
Mar 25, 2010, 3:19 PM
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You might want to contact and / or get involved with Paradox Sports http://www.paradoxsports.org/ a non-profit organization that helps people with disabilities to get out and enjoy outdoor sports and activities. Their mission: "Paradox Sports provides inspiration, opportunities and adaptive equipment to the disabled community, empowering their pursuit of a life of excellence through human-powered outdoor sports."
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gmggg
Mar 25, 2010, 3:43 PM
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chadnsc wrote: "gmggg wrote: irrelevant advice You missed the part where the OP said he was paralyzed didn't you. To the OP, you may want to look into using a chest ascender and doing a modified Frog technique. Check out this link for the basic idea. http://www.climbing.com/...t/techtips/ttaid226/ Best of luck with your hunting! I read it. I just offered him an easier way to pull himself up rather than loops of rope. He didn't describe the nature of his paralysis and since he thought that he could haul himself up a length of rope I figured that riffing on that idea would be faster and safer than any advanced rigging systems. As far as rigging systems go Acorneau has the best idea so far... +1 for that set up.
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greatview
Mar 25, 2010, 3:50 PM
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get in touch with treeclimbers, those taking care of trees, professionally ... its very well possible to get up trees by installing the rope from the ground, well established systems that have worked for quite a while. getting up will be harder for you but a pulley system will make it easier. good luck hunting
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qtm
Mar 25, 2010, 3:57 PM
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greatview
Mar 25, 2010, 3:59 PM
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just use a croll or something similar, to get down use the grigri. weight aint important in that case i guess.
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chadnsc
Mar 25, 2010, 4:02 PM
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gmggg wrote: chadnsc wrote: "gmggg wrote: irrelevant advice You missed the part where the OP said he was paralyzed didn't you. To the OP, you may want to look into using a chest ascender and doing a modified Frog technique. Check out this link for the basic idea. http://www.climbing.com/...t/techtips/ttaid226/ Best of luck with your hunting! I read it. I just offered him an easier way to pull himself up rather than loops of rope. He didn't describe the nature of his paralysis and since he thought that he could haul himself up a length of rope I figured that riffing on that idea would be faster and safer than any advanced rigging systems. As far as rigging systems go Acorneau has the best idea so far... +1 for that set up. So when you told the OP to 'take a step up' on that ladder you meant for hime to do one arm pull ups up the ladder huh?
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djlachelt
Mar 25, 2010, 4:14 PM
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Kudos for getting out there and trying to overcome your hard situation.
soNVclimbing wrote: I would recommend not buying a harness but, instead go to your local west marine and buy a bosun's chair. It will be much easier to get into and you can hang in it for hours unlike most harnesses. I think you should pay attention to this advice. Sitting in a harness for a long time can be uncomfortable... and worse can lead to life-threatening problems as the circulation gets cut off. A non-paralyzed person would be able to feel the discomfort and either adjust their position, or come down when it became unbearable. If you cannot feel the discomfort then you could get into a bad situation. http://www.elcosh.org/...s-kill-you%253F.html I also agree with the advice of talking to the folks at Paradox Sports. Good luck.
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gmggg
Mar 25, 2010, 4:15 PM
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chadnsc wrote: gmggg wrote: chadnsc wrote: "gmggg wrote: irrelevant advice You missed the part where the OP said he was paralyzed didn't you. To the OP, you may want to look into using a chest ascender and doing a modified Frog technique. Check out this link for the basic idea. http://www.climbing.com/...t/techtips/ttaid226/ Best of luck with your hunting! I read it. I just offered him an easier way to pull himself up rather than loops of rope. He didn't describe the nature of his paralysis and since he thought that he could haul himself up a length of rope I figured that riffing on that idea would be faster and safer than any advanced rigging systems. As far as rigging systems go Acorneau has the best idea so far... +1 for that set up. So when you told the OP to 'take a step up' on that ladder you meant for hime to do one arm pull ups up the ladder huh? Nope, I was merely describing the system to him. I'm sure he knows his capabilities and had something in mind for the other system he was describing. He's paralyzed not infantile. Go niggle somewhere else.
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qtm
Mar 25, 2010, 4:23 PM
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djlachelt wrote: I think you should pay attention to this advice. Sitting in a harness for a long time can be uncomfortable... and worse can lead to life-threatening problems as the circulation gets cut off. The harness is to protect him while he climbs up into his tree stand.
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jaablink
Mar 25, 2010, 4:31 PM
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Block_and_tackle Sorry to hear about your accident man. I would recommend doing some research on block and tackle rigs. 1 static line and the correct block and tackle setup and you could lift a car off the ground with minimal effort.
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chadnsc
Mar 25, 2010, 4:31 PM
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gmggg wrote: Nope, I was merely describing the system to him. I'm sure he knows his capabilities and had something in mind for the other system he was describing. He's paralyzed not infantile. Go niggle somewhere else. So you needed to describe the system to the OP because you didn't think he was intelligent enough to know how to use a ladder? Take a step up . . . take a step up . . . . Yet you knew the OP was paralyzed and couldn't use his legs but you recommended that the best system for him was a ladder and Viv Feria (sp)? Face it, the system you suggest to the OP use was simply unrealistic, impractical, and idiotic. I'm now don niggling with you.
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gmggg
Mar 25, 2010, 5:10 PM
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chadnsc wrote: gmggg wrote: Nope, I was merely describing the system to him. I'm sure he knows his capabilities and had something in mind for the other system he was describing. He's paralyzed not infantile. Go niggle somewhere else. So you needed to describe the system to the OP because you didn't think he was intelligent enough to know how to use a ladder? Take a step up . . . take a step up . . . . Yet you knew the OP was paralyzed and couldn't use his legs but you recommended that the best system for him was a ladder and Viv Feria (sp)? Face it, the system you suggest to the OP use was simply unrealistic, impractical, and idiotic. I'm now don niggling with you. Man, you are a niggling queen. And have misquoted me for a second time. I used "step" as a movement descriptor in conjunction with a safe clipping process for a via ferrata set up. And yes, pulling yourself up a ladder is much easier than a rope. I will agree that it is not an optimal system, but it is better than the OP's and with more minimal practice and investment can be safer than rigging lines.
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