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ladyscarlett
May 26, 2010, 6:30 PM
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The purpose of this post is to highlight my sheer stupidity as a beginner leader. This may or may not be a waste of your time. Heckle me at will!
I want to lead more, and I need to practice. I've finally gotten myself into the gym and really feel tempted to lead. I have friends who will give me a belay and let me use their rope. I have two seasons of outdoor leading (mostly trad) under my harness so to speak. I've taken lead falls (not many) climbing outside. And yet, I am STILL afraid to lead in the gym!!!
WHY?!?!?
Simple - outside, when topping out and finishing a lead, I'm generally at a solid stance, or hands free/secure setting up an anchor. At the gym, all the lead climbs are overhanging, so they finish from very hands dependent 3 point stances. The unfamiliarity of 'clipping in to the anchor' on lead from a negative body position is getting to my head. What if...
The worst part. I'm not really afraid of taking the fall and more afraid of falling when I take the 'lead test' - required to get the greenlight to lead in the gym. Fall while clipping into the top, and no more leading inside for a long while.
Booo, this is the wrong mentality to have! I can lead, and I itch to get off top rope. And yet a taking a gym test is more daunting than taking a lead fall.
My brain is really messed up. God damn gym tests!
Peanut Gallery...Fire Away! Is this not the stupidest hang up ever? Why can't it be easier to get over the 'what if' factor?!
ls
ps - thanks for being part of my mental process to get over this crap...I'm getting to the point of 'just lead!' I promise!
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jbro_135
May 26, 2010, 6:36 PM
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Why wouldn't you be allowed to lead for a long time if you fail to clip the anchors? People fall all the time, it doesn't mean you're not competent, just that the climb is too hard for you.
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redlude97
May 26, 2010, 6:37 PM
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I assume your gym uses 2 QD's as the top anchor? Clipping into one of the anchors should be no different than clipping any of the draws along the route. If you are scared or pumped, have your belayer take you after you make the first clip, then make the second clip while on tension, before lowering.
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hafilax
May 26, 2010, 6:41 PM
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I don't like leading in the gym. I'm not an extrovert and hate the thought of people watching me (even if they aren't in reality).
Practice clipping until you're convinced that it's not an issue. Really the anchor is no different from any of the other quickdraws that got you there. Once you get the first one you're safe. If you have to, hang on it until you can get the other. It's mostly for a back up and for the top ropers.
This is Rock Warriors Way territory.
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KirbyC
May 26, 2010, 6:43 PM
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I know what you mean about the "What if" fear while taking a gym test.. And it's definitely stupid, but I've felt that same kind of anxiety.
It seems clear that you are a confident leader--so I say just push through it and do it! Remember your breathing, etc. etc. before you start, and just get up and do it. I'd be comfortable betting on you doing just fine.
Are the top anchors wire gate coldshuts? That's what we've got, and they are super easy to clip into--easier, in fact, than a draw, because you really are just dropping the rope on top of them, and they are stationary (unlike a draw).
Just go for it!
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bandycoot
May 26, 2010, 7:13 PM
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To the average person, climbing is pretty damn foreign. There aren't many sports where pushing limits results in freefall. Since it is so foreign, I find that a lot of people learning the sport will soak up what those around them think and feel. They don't know what to think of this sport, how to approach it, or how afraid they should be. As a result, if someone new to the sport is friends with people who are scared or hesitant, they will most likely end up that way as well.
If you want to improve psychologically, one of the ways that I recommend to people is to hang out and climb with people with go for it attitudes. Not idiots, who will do things that are dangerous, but people who know what they are doing, and are willing to take the (safe) whip.
How tall is your gym? Do you have a competent belayer you can trust? If you're afraid you won't clip the anchors and fall, get over that fear by climbing to the anchors and just letting go.
I've never read the Rock Warrior's Way, but I know a lot of people recommend it. If you're taking this seriously, then read that book and surround yourself with people who are willing to fall, push their limits, and will support you with encouragement and positive attitudes.
Josh
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bill413
May 26, 2010, 7:21 PM
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LS - a friend of mine had the same hangups about taking the lead test. So, if it's the stupidest hang-up ever, at least you have company. She had lead in the gym (shhhh), but was scared of taking the test with the evaluator watching. I think what helped was having a couple of folks she trusted there supporting her.
That, and peer pressure, I guess.
GL!
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jbone
May 26, 2010, 7:29 PM
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Next time you do a lead test instead of letting go, when your supposed to fall throw or do some crazy reach for a foothold there is no way you can stick. Imagine yourself landing on the hold and pulling your body into position for the move.
Even though the move is hopelessly impossible it will focus you on climbing instead of falling which is far more natural in lead climbing than climbing to fall.
If this is too hard then start taking falls from every route you climb at the anchors. Instead of clipping them just tag um and leap (let your belayer know your intentions beforehand or you may fall much further than expected).
Hope this helps
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irregularpanda
May 26, 2010, 7:32 PM
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hafilax wrote: This is Rock Warriors Way territory.
This is true. This sounds like more of a comfort/fear issue than anything else.
If you're comfortable falling in the gym, and if you're comfortable clipping draws on overhanging walls, then you should be able to clip the anchors.
Of course, if you "can't" clip the anchors then you'll just go for a ride anyway.
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dugl33
May 26, 2010, 8:20 PM
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Give yourself permission to fail, or redefine success as making an attempt. Is it really the end of the world if you don't pass some goofy gym test first try?
If you can find body positions to clip draws on the way up, you're probably going to find a position to clip the anchors. If you don't, you can always down climb, fall, grab the draw or off-route holds. Yes, this may DQ you from some arbitrary test requirement -- oh well.
Why its not acceptable to simply lower off of any high point draw in a gym is a total mystery to me, but that's just me I guess. Positioning, clipping, not backclipping, rope management, etc. etc all seem like critical leading skills. In a gym it shouldn't matter if you're too pumped to finish a route or whatever the case may be by the time you reach the anchor.
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Psicko
May 26, 2010, 9:57 PM
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dugl33 wrote: Positioning, clipping, not backclipping, rope management, etc. etc all seem like critical leading skills. In a gym it shouldn't matter if you're too pumped to finish a route or whatever the case may be by the time you reach the anchor.
That is exactly what my gym focuses on during the test, as well as taking a fall, and catching someone else's fall. I don't think they even care if you make it to the top. Sounds like your issue is all mental. Falling is unnatural to most. I don't like taking large whippers.
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rangerrob
May 27, 2010, 3:29 PM
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Just stop climbing in the gym...problem solved. Sounds like you already do quite well in the real world.
RR
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swoopee
May 27, 2010, 5:02 PM
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Correct answer.
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tedman
May 27, 2010, 5:49 PM
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the finishing hold is usually a mondo jug too, at least in my gym. Easier to clip from than the holds on the route unless you are so pumped you just cant hold onto anything by that point. Another thing to think about, what happens if you 'fail' and dont get the route clean? you have to take the test again the next time and maybe a bruised ego? pretty low consequences....go for it!
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boadman
May 27, 2010, 7:38 PM
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You're lucky you're not a boy. This level of performance anxiety would make public urinals truly terrifying.
(This post was edited by boadman on May 27, 2010, 8:40 PM)
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ladyscarlett
May 27, 2010, 8:36 PM
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heh, i'm glad i'm not a boy too!
thanks for the support folks! I'll get my head on straight one of these days...
ls
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slidingmike
May 27, 2010, 9:20 PM
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Which gym are you going for certification in? PG or MC?
I was pretty tired and took an extra unscheduled fall near the top during my test at PG -- initially they didn't want to pass me -- but I successfully argued that it showed my trust in the system (plus they hadn't specified extra falls as a criteria to fail you). Truth is, I'm not the worlds greatest climber...
I recall that MC was much tougher; they would fail you if your catch wasn't soft enough.
Just go for it, don't be afraid to fail. It shows that you're willing to put in the work to get there!
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Carnage
May 28, 2010, 6:26 PM
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falling at the top is the best place to fall, you're far away from the ground, lots of rope out, lots to fall into (it's overhanging, so you wont swing into another wall). irrational fear.
if you want somethign to be afraid of, talk about fucking up the second clip, that's where you might get hurt...
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ladyscarlett
May 28, 2010, 7:02 PM
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Carnage wrote: if you want somethign to be afraid of, talk about fucking up the second clip, that's where you might get hurt...
Heh done this...twice. And caught my partner falling at the same place a few times as well. A time where I may have looked like a dork belaying with my helmet, but it helped deflect his feet off of my head.
Been thinking about it and I think dugl33 hit it on the button...in this particular situation, it's the fear of failing rather than falling. I do still fear falling outside (particularly on gear) and am slowly working my way past that. But in the gym, I just don't want to fail the test for some stupid irrational reason. Ah well, it's not a failure, just a step closer in the right direction...
Of course all fear is rational...so now that I've identified it, it will go poof! and won't cause any problems whatsoever. Heh.
Give myself the freedom to fail, what an idea!
cheers
ls
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hafilax
May 28, 2010, 7:13 PM
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ladyscarlett wrote: Carnage wrote: if you want somethign to be afraid of, talk about fucking up the second clip, that's where you might get hurt... Heh done this...twice. And caught my partner falling at the same place a few times as well. A time where I may have looked like a dork belaying with my helmet, but it helped deflect his feet off of my head. Been thinking about it and I think dugl33 hit it on the button...in this particular situation, it's the fear of failing rather than falling. I do still fear falling outside (particularly on gear) and am slowly working my way past that. But in the gym, I just don't want to fail the test for some stupid irrational reason. Ah well, it's not a failure, just a step closer in the right direction... Of course all fear is rational...so now that I've identified it, it will go poof! and won't cause any problems whatsoever. Heh. Give myself the freedom to fail, what an idea! cheers ls
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darkgift06
May 28, 2010, 8:16 PM
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I had a problem clipping the other evening. I was climbing some very overhanging 12, & got to the 5th bolt & just didn't know if I would be able to hold on & clip.. so I was forced to make a hard decision, pull rope & try to clip maybe falling with huge slack or take a fall with what I have for rope out at the time... I decided to just take the fall.. but first I wanted to see if I could hold on while making the clip, so I tried to do the movements with out actually clipping & found my self falling just as I touched the draw. I was happy I saw & knew my limit & didn't take a big whip while clipping.
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losinghand
May 29, 2010, 10:31 PM
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LadyScarlett - I'm in a similar boat. I've been (trad) leading a few seasons now, and while I am a seasonal gym rat - I've never gotten around to doing my lead test at Mission Cliffs. Honestly - not really concerned about it. While there are obviously similarities - I sort of see gym climbing and outdoor climbing as pretty different beasts. Just because I like leading outdoors doesn't necesarily mean I like leading indoors. Hell - I boulder a ton at the gym, and raaarely boulder outdoors.
At least at the gym - the length of falls are limited by having pretty closely spaced protection/bolts. Outside - you can often run stuff out and take a far longer fall than you might indoors - including on terrain that will likely scrape you up a lot worse than the typically-overhung lead routes at Mission Cliffs or Ironworks...
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newcat
May 29, 2010, 11:24 PM
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Just out of curiosity: why not grab the draw in that situation? I'm perhaps much too afraid of falling (I avoid it like the plague), but I wondered why you didn't consider it (and whether there's some obvious disadvantage I'm not aware of).
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