|
clee03m
Jul 12, 2010, 3:58 PM
Post #1 of 25
(6577 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 29, 2004
Posts: 785
|
The best I could do for disability insurance regarding rock climbing was insurance will kick in in one year and they will cover for 3 years. I felt this was fine until I had my son. Now I keep thinking about how I may go bankrupt and may have to raise my son in poverty if I become disabled. My husband says I should continue to climb and will deal with it if anything were to happen, but I feel really nervous. I really don't want to stop climbing. Pretty pathetic, but I'm hoping other bread winning parents will somehow ease my mind so I can continue to climb without worry or guilt
Btw, I'm getting a very good life insurance without rockclimbing exclusion.
|
|
|
|
|
Toast_in_the_Machine
Jul 12, 2010, 6:21 PM
Post #2 of 25
(6498 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 12, 2008
Posts: 5208
|
clee03m wrote: The best I could do for disability insurance regarding rock climbing was insurance will kick in in one year and they will cover for 3 years. I felt this was fine until I had my son. Now I keep thinking about how I may go bankrupt and may have to raise my son in poverty if I become disabled. My husband says I should continue to climb and will deal with it if anything were to happen, but I feel really nervous. I really don't want to stop climbing. Pretty pathetic, but I'm hoping other bread winning parents will somehow ease my mind so I can continue to climb without worry or guilt Btw, I'm getting a very good life insurance without rockclimbing exclusion.
Percieved vs. actual risk (http://www.schneier.com/...erceived_risk_2.html)
I try to worry about real risks as close to the statistics risk as possible and try to ignore the rest.
|
|
|
|
|
clee03m
Jul 12, 2010, 6:44 PM
Post #3 of 25
(6478 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 29, 2004
Posts: 785
|
It's not that I perceive rock climbing accidents as more likely to happen than slipping on a bar of soap. It's just that if I get disabled in any other way, I'm covered by insurance. Unfortunately, I think there isn't an easy answer for me here.
|
|
|
|
|
Adayak
Jul 12, 2010, 6:53 PM
Post #4 of 25
(6461 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 7, 2010
Posts: 13
|
It's good know that you've taken the necessary steps to insure yourself in the case of an accident. It sucks that it won't kick in for a year, but if climbing is something that makes you happy and your husband is encouraging it... then I don't see anything wrong in going climbing every now and then to satisfy your urges. Just be extra cautious, and don't attempt and grades you aren't 100% comfortable with.
|
|
|
|
|
joshy8200
Jul 12, 2010, 6:54 PM
Post #5 of 25
(6460 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 1, 2002
Posts: 646
|
I was denied life insurance through USAA. The reason being...climbing at the 5.10 level is perceived as being too dangerous. Yes, USAA partly bases their rock climbing risk for life insurance on Yosemite Decimal System rating.
I now have coverage through Prudential at a very reasonable rate and fully disclosed all my rock climbing activities.
|
|
|
|
|
Toast_in_the_Machine
Jul 12, 2010, 7:46 PM
Post #6 of 25
(6423 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Sep 12, 2008
Posts: 5208
|
I looked at my earlier post and your responce and I think I need to elaborate.
In your posts I hear worry. Why worry only with being disabled? Why not worry about the car accident on the way to the climb? As bad as it sounds, I would rather my kids grow up poor with a diasabled dad than without me.
The financial risks can be mitigated, but the worry is an emotional reaction. I try to remove the ghost fears and focus on solving the real ones. By working on directing my focus, the act of focus takes the worry away.
If I'm working on fixing real problems, then I don't have the time or energy to spend on the act of worrying.
|
|
|
|
|
markc
Jul 12, 2010, 8:11 PM
Post #7 of 25
(6405 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 21, 2003
Posts: 2481
|
I've been giving this some thought and trying to articulate it. I don't actively worry about disability or death from an accident, climbing-related or otherwise. That's not to say I don't get gripped on lead or sometimes think, "What the hell am I doing here?" It's just that those aren't constant specters in my life.
When climbing, I accept that there is always some degree of risk, and I work to mitigate as much of it as I can. I worry about those things within my sphere of influence. If it's outside of my influence I try not to give it too much energy.
Since having a son, the biggest thing that's changed in my climbing has been the frequency. I don't get out nearly as much as I'd like, but I climb in much the same way. I'm a pretty casual climber. I don't push it much on gear, and don't do very much off-rope. I don't free-solo or do any highball bouldering. I know what I risk when I climb, and the level of risk I'm comfortable with. My wife is comfortable with it, as well.
|
|
|
|
|
majid_sabet
Jul 12, 2010, 10:20 PM
Post #8 of 25
(6341 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Dec 13, 2002
Posts: 8390
|
joshy8200 wrote: I was denied life insurance through USAA. The reason being...climbing at the 5.10 level is perceived as being too dangerous. Yes, USAA partly bases their rock climbing risk for life insurance on Yosemite Decimal System rating. I now have coverage through Prudential at a very reasonable rate and fully disclosed all my rock climbing activities.
you got to be kidding
they even have YDS gradings in their policy ?
|
|
|
|
|
caughtinside
Jul 12, 2010, 10:24 PM
Post #9 of 25
(6334 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 8, 2003
Posts: 30603
|
clee03m wrote: The best I could do for disability insurance regarding rock climbing was insurance will kick in in one year and they will cover for 3 years. I felt this was fine until I had my son. Now I keep thinking about how I may go bankrupt and may have to raise my son in poverty if I become disabled. My husband says I should continue to climb and will deal with it if anything were to happen, but I feel really nervous. I really don't want to stop climbing. Pretty pathetic, but I'm hoping other bread winning parents will somehow ease my mind so I can continue to climb without worry or guilt Btw, I'm getting a very good life insurance without rockclimbing exclusion.
Bread winning?
Sounds like a good time to quit.
|
|
|
|
|
mtnjohn
Jul 13, 2010, 12:02 AM
Post #10 of 25
(6277 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 17, 2002
Posts: 230
|
Climb or don't climb.
When people ask these types of question, often times they already know the answer and are looking for either validation to thier perspective or for some one to tell them it's OK to go against the intuition.
Not always. But usually this is the case.
PS Do you have the same worries while driving to supermarket?
|
|
|
|
|
styndall
Jul 13, 2010, 12:17 AM
Post #11 of 25
(6258 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 29, 2002
Posts: 2741
|
mtnjohn wrote: Climb or don't climb. When people ask these types of question, often times they already know the answer and are looking for either validation to thier perspective or for some one to tell them it's OK to go against the intuition. Not always. But usually this is the case. PS Do you have the same worries while driving to supermarket?
She's answered this in the thread. Her disability insurance specifically doesn't cover climbing accidents. She's got a legit worry, and bringing up other areas where accidents may happen isn't helpful.
|
|
|
|
|
mtnjohn
Jul 13, 2010, 12:21 AM
Post #12 of 25
(6249 views)
Shortcut
Registered: May 17, 2002
Posts: 230
|
I typically don't read entire threads.
Really, I don't care. If an OP question catches my attention, for whatever reason, I reply to that individual.
Not every yahoo who feels theneed to respond. yes, like me.
If I duplicate an already expressed opinion or question, big deal.
Glad your here to monior the situation tough, we'll all sleep better now!
|
|
|
|
|
robdotcalm
Jul 13, 2010, 12:39 AM
Post #13 of 25
(6235 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 31, 2002
Posts: 1027
|
There have been many family things that have taken time (and money) away from climbing. Besides children, there are now grandchildren and there was a period of eldercare. I always found it comfortable (not necessarily easy) to put family first. It sounds like you've had this insurance for a while so that it would be less than a year without climbing. That would be my choice. I'm telling you what my choice would be. I'm not giving advice. And, congratulations on the child.
Cheers,
Rob.calm
|
|
|
|
|
lena_chita
Moderator
Jul 13, 2010, 1:46 AM
Post #14 of 25
(6211 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 27, 2006
Posts: 6087
|
I am not sure what disability insurance you are talking about, because I don't have a separate disability insurance that I buy on my own. There is disability insurance for certain amount through work, and there is Social Security-- that's all I have. I guess there must be supplemental insurance that one can buy... is this what you are talking about?
You might be the bread-winning parent in your family, currently, but your husband is not disabled in any way and is, in fact, an educated and capable person, if I remember. If something were to happen to you, and you were to become disabled, I am sure he would be able to find work in order to support and provide for your (and his) son.
Beyond that, you have your extended family... I think your child will have a roof over his head, food on his plate, and plenty of love and support regardless of what happens to you.
So all in all, I am not sure I understand where you are coming from.
But if it is so important, then yes, I guess you could scale back your climbing for a year until the insurance kicks in. You and your husband are the only ones who can decide this, we are all armchair analysits here...
|
|
|
|
|
clee03m
Jul 13, 2010, 5:23 AM
Post #15 of 25
(6169 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Oct 29, 2004
Posts: 785
|
Because I'm not an employee, I have to provide my own insurance. Most people are employees of some sort and would have disability insurance through work. It's not that I don't have insurance for a year. Most disability insurance has a 90 day waiting period before it kicks in when someone is disabled. That is the case with my disability insurance except for in case of a climbing accident, instead of 90 days, it will take a year to kick in.
While my husband is educated, he has not had much luck with jobs that pay a living wage :(
I can't believe there is a part of me that is saying may be I should quit climbing to ensure financial security of my family. It's affected my lead head for sure. Imagine a rational fear interfering with leading. But in the end, I probably won't quit. I love climbing too much for that. So I guess I like the advise to not waste my energy worrying about what is out of my control. Oh well, easier said than done...
|
|
|
|
|
TarHeelEMT
Jul 13, 2010, 11:43 PM
Post #16 of 25
(6088 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jun 20, 2009
Posts: 724
|
joshy8200 wrote: I was denied life insurance through USAA. The reason being...climbing at the 5.10 level is perceived as being too dangerous. Yes, USAA partly bases their rock climbing risk for life insurance on Yosemite Decimal System rating. I now have coverage through Prudential at a very reasonable rate and fully disclosed all my rock climbing activities.
Not only is that insane just on principle, a quick glance at accidents in NA mountaineering will reveal relatively few accidents on 5.10 routes. Low angled terrain is a bitch.
|
|
|
|
|
gazoo9224
Jul 18, 2010, 6:11 AM
Post #17 of 25
(5962 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 20, 2010
Posts: 16
|
that's just plain stupid.
there are relatively less injuries due to climbing compared to playing soccer.
|
|
|
|
|
clc
Jul 18, 2010, 1:19 PM
Post #18 of 25
(5947 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 495
|
yet do many people die form playing soccer?
|
|
|
|
|
curt
Jul 18, 2010, 3:55 PM
Post #19 of 25
(5911 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Aug 27, 2002
Posts: 18275
|
majid_sabet wrote: joshy8200 wrote: I was denied life insurance through USAA. The reason being...climbing at the 5.10 level is perceived as being too dangerous. Yes, USAA partly bases their rock climbing risk for life insurance on Yosemite Decimal System rating. I now have coverage through Prudential at a very reasonable rate and fully disclosed all my rock climbing activities. you got to be kidding they even have YDS gradings in their policy ?
The people at USAA are clearly idiots. Just out of curiosity, are the premiums directly or inversely related to the grade one climbs? 
Curt
|
|
|
|
|
gazoo9224
Jul 18, 2010, 5:13 PM
Post #20 of 25
(5887 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Apr 20, 2010
Posts: 16
|
yet do many people die from climbing?
|
|
|
|
|
nolifeking
Jul 19, 2010, 1:13 AM
Post #21 of 25
(5838 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Feb 18, 2009
Posts: 13
|
curt wrote: majid_sabet wrote: joshy8200 wrote: I was denied life insurance through USAA. The reason being...climbing at the 5.10 level is perceived as being too dangerous. Yes, USAA partly bases their rock climbing risk for life insurance on Yosemite Decimal System rating. I now have coverage through Prudential at a very reasonable rate and fully disclosed all my rock climbing activities. you got to be kidding they even have YDS gradings in their policy ? The people at USAA are clearly idiots. Just out of curiosity, are the premiums directly or inversely related to the grade one climbs? Curt
This is hilarious...I'm going through this right now. The problem is that USAA has some secret formula YDS that means nothing like it does to actual climbers. I as well told them I climbed 5.10, top rope only, and to a height of 75 feet max. I was denied, and I called to find out why.
Turns out, according to their scale, a 5.10 means climbing a wall with no hand or foot holds at approximately 12,000 feet elevation.
For real.
After talking to them about how that number means something totally different to everyone else, I think I can still get a policy, but I won't know until they call me back tomorrow.
|
|
|
|
|
skiclimb
Jul 19, 2010, 4:09 AM
Post #22 of 25
(5824 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 11, 2004
Posts: 1938
|
There are examples of kids who's parents died climbing.. The only one i know of is who has spoken directly to the issue is Dan Osman girl.
She is extremely proud of her father his spirit and legacy.
I would imagine other children Might not be of their parents.
Poverty is not even close to the worst legacy a parent might leave behind.
Abuse and anger and hatred are what damage a child.
Love admiration expectation and an example of a life well lived even if short seem to me the best of all inheritances.
Course this whole discussion would be moot if the American government wasn't owned by corporations but actually served the PEOPLE.
Such that it actually served the first purpose of all government of the people by the people and for the people.
The preservation and protection of it's citizens lives and their children. If you have a better purpose for government and the taxes required for government... well actually you are a moron who is brainwashed.
(This post was edited by skiclimb on Jul 19, 2010, 4:14 AM)
|
|
|
|
|
jomagam
Jul 19, 2010, 5:32 AM
Post #23 of 25
(5806 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Nov 10, 2008
Posts: 364
|
In reply to: There are examples of kids who's parents died climbing.. The only one i know of is who has spoken directly to the issue is Dan Osman girl.
He did not die climbing.
|
|
|
|
|
markc
Jul 19, 2010, 6:33 PM
Post #24 of 25
(5739 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jan 21, 2003
Posts: 2481
|
nolifeking wrote: This is hilarious...I'm going through this right now. The problem is that USAA has some secret formula YDS that means nothing like it does to actual climbers. I as well told them I climbed 5.10, top rope only, and to a height of 75 feet max. I was denied, and I called to find out why. Turns out, according to their scale, a 5.10 means climbing a wall with no hand or foot holds at approximately 12,000 feet elevation. For real. After talking to them about how that number means something totally different to everyone else, I think I can still get a policy, but I won't know until they call me back tomorrow.
Tell them you got worse, and you're now climbing 5.9. Problem solved, so long as you don't die on anything harder than that.
|
|
|
|
|
dynosore
Jul 19, 2010, 7:13 PM
Post #25 of 25
(5719 views)
Shortcut
Registered: Jul 29, 2004
Posts: 1768
|
MetLife covers me and are fully aware that I climb. Didn't affect my premium at all.
edit cuz you already addressed that point
(This post was edited by dynosore on Jul 19, 2010, 7:14 PM)
|
|
|
|
|
|
