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Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger?
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olderic


Aug 19, 2010, 12:05 PM
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Re: [Rudmin] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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Rudmin wrote:
jt512 wrote:
Lbrombach wrote:
OK, imagine for a moment that my IQ is actually average or above.

[...]

I clipped the rope before ever taking the draw off my loop.

Your high IQ would have been easier to imagine if you had correctly explained how you clipped in the first place. But, hey, thanks for blaming us for misunderstanding your ambiguous post.

Jay

He never blamed you for anything. Why the chip on your shoulder?

You're new around here aren't you?


johnwesely


Aug 19, 2010, 12:29 PM
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Re: [kaizen] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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kaizen wrote:
I'm a bit confused here - you're having a hard time reaching the rope-end biner on a clip, but no troubles reaching the hanger to place the draw? I've personally never encountered this scenario, and can really only see if the rope-end carabiner is in some sort of a feature, blocking access. If that's the case, than I can actually see the benefit of your idea, although that would be an odd bolt placement for a sport route.

I imagine this occurs when the OP tries to clip a bolt too early and has to pull into the wall to clip the bolt. It is probably fairly easy for him to do for the half second it requires to clip a biner to hanger but harder for him to do while clipping the rope. That is my guess.


kaizen


Aug 19, 2010, 1:40 PM
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Re: [johnwesely] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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johnwesely wrote:
kaizen wrote:
I'm a bit confused here - you're having a hard time reaching the rope-end biner on a clip, but no troubles reaching the hanger to place the draw? I've personally never encountered this scenario, and can really only see if the rope-end carabiner is in some sort of a feature, blocking access. If that's the case, than I can actually see the benefit of your idea, although that would be an odd bolt placement for a sport route.

I imagine this occurs when the OP tries to clip a bolt too early and has to pull into the wall to clip the bolt. It is probably fairly easy for him to do for the half second it requires to clip a biner to hanger but harder for him to do while clipping the rope. That is my guess.

That makes much more sense.

In that case, I think there is a much better solution to the OP than his current one.


whipper


Aug 19, 2010, 2:03 PM
Post #29 of 35 (4083 views)
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Re: [Lbrombach] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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I have once, and could see doing it again.
It was on a .12d with a 6-7 foot roof, at the end of it you had to bust a campus move over the lip and get a heel hook above your hands, so my body was beyond horizontal. The bolt was above me, and I knew I dint have a ton of juice, without really thinking about it I grabbed a draw, a short stiff petzle one, and was easily able to slap the bent gate onto the rope, yell clipping and in one movement pull myself up and clip.
Would I make it a habit, no, but that time it worked flawlessly, and none of the things that JT says would happen, did.
I think the real beauty of it was that I wasnt tempted to grab the draw, and was able to climb through until I was over my feet.


rtwilli4


Aug 19, 2010, 2:46 PM
Post #30 of 35 (4064 views)
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Re: [jt512] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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jt512 wrote:
Lbrombach wrote:
Am I the only one who ever does this? I'm not that experienced, but I've done it a couple times and it seems that there are times where it's easier to clip the rope in right next to me, then clip the hanger. I did notice that you must be careful to avoid ending up back clipped. Is there another good reason I never see anyone else do this? Maybe I just need to practice rope clipping from all sorts of weird angles and such.

On 99% of clips you have only one free hand, so let me see how you would do this. You unclip the draw from your harness. Thus you are holding the bolt-end biner. So, you put the draw in your teeth, so that you can switch to holding the rope-end biner. You then do that and you clip the rope. Now, you're holding the wrong biner again, so you put the draw back into your teeth, switch your grip to the bolt-end biner, and finally you clip the bolt.

Jay

There is actually one bolt on one climb that I do this on. I guided on this climb 5 or 6 times a week and the bolt is the last one I clip before about a 30 foot run to the anchor so I remember it well. You can clip it while it't at your eye level and if I did that I would certainly just clip the bolt first. BUT I clip the bolt from above it, standing on a ledge. My draws are short and I can hold the dogbone in my hand and clip either biner... basically what I do is clip the rope w/ one biner and then the bolt with the other at almost the same time.

I can't think that it would actually make sense to do it unless you are standing but in my specific case it actually is quicker.

Of course I usually guide on that climb barefoot and one of the bolts I kind of clip w/ my toes so you probably shouldn't be listening to a word I say.


Lbrombach


Aug 19, 2010, 3:50 PM
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Re: [rtwilli4] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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Ignoring senseless banter... but to add a bit of clarity I'll mention that perhaps rather than clipping too early, I was clipping too late. I try not to clip the moment I can reach the bolt standing on my tippy toes unless it happens to be a very stable position. I TRY to clip where I THINK it's going to take the least energy, while considering safety. The place I felt comfortable stopping to clip had my waist about even with the bolt, only I was a bit off to the side. End result, I was above and to the right of the bolt. I could not quite reach the hanger itself, but by holding the dogbone at the base of the bolt biner, I was able to clip. Could I have planned better? Probably, but in that instance it seemed the thing to do and I lived. Will it ever be useful again? My sample of outdoor sport climbs is too small to provide that info. Criticize my climbing skills if that's what lifts your self esteem, some of you clearly need the boost more than I do.

Thanks for the useful info, I appreciate the perspectives of more experienced climbers.

Oh, one more detail that really matter little but if you're curious I currently use a safetech harness that has gear loops rated for 10Kn. I might get swung around but that loop ain't breaking.


Partner robdotcalm


Aug 19, 2010, 4:22 PM
Post #32 of 35 (4022 views)
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Re: [boku] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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To solve the reach problems use one of these.

vd draw

Cheers,
Rob.calm


jt512


Aug 19, 2010, 5:50 PM
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Re: [Lbrombach] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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Lbrombach wrote:
The place I felt comfortable stopping to clip had my waist about even with the bolt, only I was a bit off to the side. End result, I was above and to the right of the bolt. I could not quite reach the hanger itself, but by holding the dogbone at the base of the bolt biner, I was able to clip.

Sounds like being on route might have helped.

Jay


byran


Aug 19, 2010, 6:25 PM
Post #34 of 35 (3985 views)
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Re: [jt512] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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jt512 wrote:
Anyway, now that you've made clear what it is you're doing, as I see it, the advantage would be only having to reach up to the bolt once. The disadvantages would be twofold: one, reaching up to the bolt would require more strength due to friction between the rope and the pre-clipped biner...

Not just more friction but you'd also be creating a 2 to 1. Where you'd normally pull up 5 pounds of rope drag, you're now be pulling up 10, plus the extra friction. I guess it could be useful on really short, really steep sport climbs where rope drag isn't an issue. But those routes also tend to have fixed draws so...


snoboy


Aug 24, 2010, 10:20 AM
Post #35 of 35 (3848 views)
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Re: [byran] Clip the rope BEFORE the hanger? [In reply to]
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I have seen and used a related technique a couple times. If you preclip the draw, hang it off the rope by your tie in, and loop the rope over your shoulder, then it's much easier to clip the first bolt when it's runout.

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