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talons05
Dec 20, 2002, 4:49 AM
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What tool is the best deal, but not a piece of crap? Also, I am unsure of what length to get (I have seen 45 and 50 cm versions of many axes...)
A.W.
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buttets
Dec 20, 2002, 5:41 AM
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What will you be using the tools for? Ice, Mountaineering, mixed, etc...
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pbjosh
Dec 20, 2002, 5:50 AM
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For technical tools almost all tools are 50cm. 45cm tools may be appropriate for smaller climbers or climbers with shorter arms. Most climbers I've seen, including petite women, use a 50cm tool, however.
The best tool for the buck is any tool by a reputable company or any tool that feels solid and you like the look, sturdiness, and feel of, that's cheap.
My personal recommendations for a beginner:
The cheapest pair of used BD Shrikes or Charlet Pulsar's you can find.
josh
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vood00
Dec 20, 2002, 7:34 AM
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Black Diamond discontiuned the Rage this year. So you should be able to find a pair pretty cheap. They have a very similar shape to the cobra but with an aluminum shaft. They swing pretty well, and the thin grip is comfortable.....less pumpy, easier for smaller hands to grip. The shrikes are another good tool, and they inexpensive. Personally, I wouldn't swing anything but my BD cobras. Great tools in all. I've used some of the moser tools, but I haven't gotten in that many climbs on them......they seem pretty dam good though.
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bradhill
Dec 20, 2002, 5:04 PM
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I've climbed on Stubai Hornets for two seasons now, leading up to WI4. (and the tools aren't the problem with going higher) They're light and plunge well, so I use them on alpine routes, too. They're a fixed-pick design, so if you manage to break one, they're toast, but I think that's pretty rare until you get to really high end climbing.
Anyway, they're only $80 a pop at promountainsports.com. Excellent bang for the buck.
[ This Message was edited by: bradhill on 2002-12-20 09:07 ]
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tradklime
Dec 21, 2002, 12:42 AM
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The rages weren't discontinued, just changed color. Great all around tool. The grivels are also very nice.
If you are going to get into the sport, in the long run, you'll appreciate getting a guality, "higher end" tool. I think grivel and bd make the best mass produced tools. Although, I'm not too hip on the shrikes myself. You can't go wrong with either brand.
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talons05
Dec 26, 2002, 3:12 AM
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Cool, found a cheap pair of Shrikes on Ebay (New). If I don't get those, I'm going to sell some other gear and buy the quarks... The balance and feel of that tool is mighty-fine.
A.W.
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tim
Dec 26, 2002, 3:40 AM
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SportExtreme.com is selling the Grivel Alp and Lite Wing tools for ~$130 each, that's a MEAN deal... worth looking into and seeing if you can swing them before buying eg. Quarks (great tool if you're not planning on using them for much alpine, otherwise, could be some issues).
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nite_climber
Dec 26, 2002, 2:47 PM
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You guys all talk about Charlet, Grivel, and BD like no one else makes quality tools. To me honest, you need to look at some of the other tools as well. Simond makes a great light tool that swings like a dream. DMM makes some of the lightest tools out there and swing like a dream. Camp also makes a real burly ice tool that sinks like nothing else on the market. Also, the Cassin makes a very affordable quality line of tools that are super easy to place. Check them all out at your local retailers and swing them to see how they feel.
Your first tools will be the ones that you get used to and love, because they were your first ones. Just like your first . . .
Oh sorry, off track there.
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tim
Dec 26, 2002, 2:53 PM
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All well and good, but it can be very hard to find spare picks for Camp, Cassin, Simond, etc. in the States. Nobody ever had trouble finding a spare BD pick...
Not arguing about quality here, just practicalities. Especially if you're buying used, sooner or later you WILL have to replace the picks.
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talons05
Dec 27, 2002, 6:10 AM
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I swung some of the BD Rage tools and some of the Charlet Moser Quarks... The Quarks were definitely a much finer tool. I think I'll scrimp and fast until I can save the bones to buy some...
A.W.
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tradklime
Dec 27, 2002, 7:09 PM
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If you are going to be doing a lot of mountaineering or technical alpine, I suggest trying the grivel alp wing before you make up your mind.
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