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stevebontes
Sep 30, 2010, 9:39 PM
Post #26 of 39
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Registered: Sep 30, 2010
Posts: 21
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a shunt is sometimes used in industrial rope access as a backup attached tothe harness by a shock absorbing lanyard on the second rope as two ropes are always used and for accent the croll is used in conjuction with a chest harness for accending the rope the shunt is moved up by lifting it up to maximum lanyard lenght above ,the lanyard is as long as your reach so you can deactivate the shunt after a fall onto it ,however the shunt in this situation must never go below the waist to keep the fall factor low,,,this is a technique used by I.R.A.T.A members
if i remember rightly many years ago when the shunt was new on the market petzl did have diagrams showing the shunt being used for top rope soloing ,,,and still do
http://www.petzl.com/files/all/technical-notice/Sport/B03_SHUNT_B03200-07-1.pdf
in my experience with the shunt in this method i found an older shunt on a new rope to move reasonable freely up a weighted rope ,,,but a new shunt on an older rope to be alot of friction ,,,
i have heard stories of one concern ,the shunt uses friction and gets hot under a fall situation and with no bending like a decender it can slip when hot as the nylon rope melts it becomes a lubricant and it can continue to slide through the shunt which simply pinches the rope against the body of the shunt
as a backup i have found it great below my reverso on rappel for single or double ropes ,,,
there are all sorts of debates on what is best,,,
the best thing is do your research when choosing a tool ,,,you don't buy a cement mixer to drill a hole do you read and research the manufactures limitations before you choose what you trust your life with,,,
climb safe
enjoy
steve
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bertusgeert
Sep 30, 2010, 9:46 PM
Post #27 of 39
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Registered: Sep 20, 2010
Posts: 3
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kifoa wrote: Is there anybody TR soloing only with two clove hitch on rope  I searched the forum and found little information about it.I think compared with the yosemite two mini-traxion style that the clove method have some shortage as below: 1) There is one till two rope loop beside you when climing,maybe it prevent you moving and catch your leg when falling and you have to take the weight of the rope belowe clove hitch. 2) You have to unclip pre clove hitch ,tie a new,then clip in,most time only by one hand.even more complicated than leading. 3) The ff may be 0.5 and the compact force is 400KG when coming near the top.Some time you’ll fall 3 meters.the max value is the half compared with leading. Although clove hitch method have many shortage,it is worth to have a try..you must care for not falling and do some action by one hand.All these are useful training for leading. do you agree  of corse the cliff must have no rock sticking out. kifoa
Have fun, don't die. 
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sherpa79
Oct 1, 2010, 1:19 AM
Post #28 of 39
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Registered: Dec 15, 2004
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Shunts are ok for soloing. I've used one, but do not own one, so my experience is limited. I do however have a handfull of different ascenders so I typically opt for one of these in tandem with a knot as a backup. I use a micropulley to tend the hitch so the whole thing is self tending with a slightly weighted rope. If the pulley hitch combo gets stuck you just have to pull the tail. It's easier than pulling slack through a gri-gri for sure.
Dingus- When I run a knot as backup I use a heat resistant cord in a configuration that's called and "eye to eye". Something I use at work in combo with the micro pulley. It occured to me that it might work quite well in tandem with a minitrax. Thus you would have a knot backing up the minitrax and all on the same biner and also self tending. Something to think about maybe. I don't have a minitrax, so this isn't an option for me. It did have me thinking about possibly soloing pitches longer than half a rope lenght though. This might be a good set up for this.
I have used a knot as a backup above and atached to the body of a basic ascender. Basically the knot is attached to the biner that goes through the top holes and also goes to the chest harness. The basic tends the knot backup just like a pulley does. I've only used this system on a couple pitches, so it's not ironed out. But I think it shows promise for us folks who don't have a pulley/grab combo unit, but do have ascenders and cord etc. This doesn't protect you against the cam lever of the ascender severing the rope because I don't think there would be enough rope above the sever for the knot to grab with any certainty. But this is a very unlikely scenario of you set up your TR solo at all correctly. But I know it took me a while to accept the possibility of using toothed ascenders in a solo TR setup. The possibility quite scared me at first.
If I have time I'll post some pictures of the couple options I use for TR solo...
Oh, and as far as personality goes, climbing has never been about a popularity contest. I climb just as happily alone as I do with other people. Actually I find that climbing alone helps me seperate my ego from the climbing better. This can be a welcome respite from all those climbers full of "personality" shouting move by move beta at you from the ground. Or spraying about their latest project or how cool their prana beanie makes them look. Keep your personality bub...
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stevebontes
Oct 1, 2010, 8:21 AM
Post #29 of 39
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Registered: Sep 30, 2010
Posts: 21
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have you tried a small pvc pipe on your rope create enough distance between your basic and backup knot?
just an idea
steve
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markc
Oct 1, 2010, 2:16 PM
Post #30 of 39
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Registered: Jan 21, 2003
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cruxstacean wrote: iron106 wrote: I am suprised nobody ever mentions using a Petzl Shunt (no teeth, it shows how to do it in the instructions, http://www.petzl.com/...HUNT_B03200-07-1.pdf) or the Trango Cinch (feeds better than the grigri). Just FYI, Trango doesn't recommend using the Cinch for top rope soloing... so, use at your own risk. Now that I think about it, Petzl doesn't approve of using the Grigri for TR solo either do they?
Here's a link to what Malcolm Daly had to say:
http://www.rockclimbing.com/...post=1012551#1012551
The short version is, "if you do try it, AMFYOYO." It could be that some of us don't mention the locking-assist belay device we use due to Mal's clear position on the subject.
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yodadave
Oct 1, 2010, 2:31 PM
Post #31 of 39
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Registered: Feb 11, 2008
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hey qwert, how do you rig it so that your prussik is self feeding?? Do you just rig so that the basic pushes it up the line?
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qwert
Oct 1, 2010, 3:01 PM
Post #32 of 39
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Registered: Mar 24, 2004
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yodadave wrote: hey qwert, how do you rig it so that your prussik is self feeding?? Do you just rig so that the basic pushes it up the line?
I have the prussik above the basic.
It is indeed self feeding, since the top surface of the basic (and probably a few other ascenders) pushes the prussik quite good. It does add some friction however, so sometimes a bit of added weight on the rope at the bottom of the route is needed.
Another bonus of the prussik is, that it probably avoids the number one causes for actually needing a backup, since it protects the entry of the ascenders cam quite good.
qwert
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stevebontes
Oct 1, 2010, 3:04 PM
Post #33 of 39
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Registered: Sep 30, 2010
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what does the AMFYOYO translate to?
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markc
Oct 1, 2010, 3:17 PM
Post #34 of 39
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Registered: Jan 21, 2003
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Adios mother fucker, you're on your own.
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stevebontes
Oct 1, 2010, 5:23 PM
Post #35 of 39
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Registered: Sep 30, 2010
Posts: 21
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hahahahaha
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bearbreeder
Oct 1, 2010, 7:09 PM
Post #36 of 39
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Registered: Feb 2, 2009
Posts: 1960
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qwert wrote: Yes. I have the prussik above the basic. It is indeed self feeding, since the top surface of the basic (and probably a few other ascenders) pushes the prussik quite good. It does add some friction however, so sometimes a bit of added weight on the rope at the bottom of the route is needed. Another bonus of the prussik is, that it probably avoids the number one causes for actually needing a backup, since it protects the entry of the ascenders cam quite good. qwert
i do the same ... klemheist on to of a micro ascender
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gunkiemike
Oct 1, 2010, 8:33 PM
Post #37 of 39
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Registered: Oct 1, 2002
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qwert wrote: yodadave wrote: hey qwert, how do you rig it so that your prussik is self feeding?? Do you just rig so that the basic pushes it up the line? Yes. I have the prussik above the basic. It is indeed self feeding, since the top surface of the basic (and probably a few other ascenders) pushes the prussik quite good. It does add some friction however, so sometimes a bit of added weight on the rope at the bottom of the route is needed. Another bonus of the prussik is, that it probably avoids the number one causes for actually needing a backup, since it protects the entry of the ascenders cam quite good. qwert
I have to wonder if the prusik can grab the rope if - worst case here - the ascender shears (cuts) the rope. Not much one can do about that failure mode except be tied periodically to a second line.
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qwert
Oct 3, 2010, 8:27 AM
Post #38 of 39
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Registered: Mar 24, 2004
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gunkiemike wrote: qwert wrote: yodadave wrote: hey qwert, how do you rig it so that your prussik is self feeding?? Do you just rig so that the basic pushes it up the line? Yes. I have the prussik above the basic. It is indeed self feeding, since the top surface of the basic (and probably a few other ascenders) pushes the prussik quite good. It does add some friction however, so sometimes a bit of added weight on the rope at the bottom of the route is needed. Another bonus of the prussik is, that it probably avoids the number one causes for actually needing a backup, since it protects the entry of the ascenders cam quite good. qwert I have to wonder if the prusik can grab the rope if - worst case here - the ascender shears (cuts) the rope. Not much one can do about that failure mode except be tied periodically to a second line.
How would an ascender completely cut a rope? Maybe the sheath (have heard of that happening, on ropes that should have been thrown away), but the full rope - dont think thats realistic.
qwert
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sherpa79
Oct 3, 2010, 2:59 PM
Post #39 of 39
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Registered: Dec 15, 2004
Posts: 108
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I also find that the basic tends the hitch without any additional stuff and helps to protect things from falling down into the cam.
And as far as severing the rope with an ascender, it can happen of course, but on TR solo I don't consider it a risk that is likely enough to address, provided your system is actually functioning as it should.
I have soloed with just a hitch and a micro-pulley as a tender on a single line. A hitch that will reliably grab the rope in a fall may create a little more friction that might require the occassional tend or a slight weight on the bottom. With a knot you don't really have to worry about severing the rope. I also use an 8 mil heat resistant cord for my hitch, so concerns about melting the hitch are also significanly lower. However, the knot can get a little welded if you fall with a little slack in your system. In order to get it functioning well again it's nice to have either a really easy route, or you can keep the basic on a shoulder runner to slap above the knot to hang from for a minute if the knot requires both hands to get running again.
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