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TradEddie
Nov 17, 2010, 7:37 PM
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If you were thinking of checking out this area, don't bother, the whole place is disgusting. Almost any face more than 2ft high is covered in graffiti, and the ground is littered with beer cans. It was never the nicest place, but I went up there today for the first time in a while and it has got completely out of hand.
TE
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Arrogant_Bastard
Nov 17, 2010, 11:28 PM
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Pennsylvania sounds filthy.
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healyje
Nov 18, 2010, 12:14 AM
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Yeah, we have an in-town spot here called Rocky Butte that is covered with needles, condoms, and replete with Russian teens chucking beer bottles down on you. That, and I-205 whizzing by at the base so you can barely hear yourself think.
Went out there one time to do some rope soloing and ended up using my Camry and trees to winch up an engine block and old dishwasher someone had just chucked off the top of the route.
Funny thing is the lines are quite good, but you do have to screen out a lot of bullshit to climb there.
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Dip
Nov 18, 2010, 12:37 AM
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In reply to: Pennsylvania sounds filthy.
Every time i see Pennsylvania get trashed on rc.com i feel a sudden uncontrollable urge to rush to it's defense. Then the fact that i have to drive out of state to climb anything of quality that rises more than 25 feet from the ground slowly sinks in, and my urge passes as quickly as it came on.
I will say we have some really good bouldering spread out around the state, just apparently not at the place mentioned in this thread.
(This post was edited by Dip on Nov 18, 2010, 12:39 AM)
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TradEddie
Nov 18, 2010, 12:47 AM
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Dip wrote: Then the fact that i have to drive out of state to climb anything of quality that rises more than 25 feet from the ground slowly sinks in
Sorry, but its simply not true. There is quality climbing in PA, not much perhaps, and certainly not at St Peter's village. There are far, far worse places in the US. Even if there wasn't a pebble worth climbing here, we're within a days drive of everything from Maine to Kentucky.
TE
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Dip
Nov 18, 2010, 2:45 AM
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In reply to: There are far, far worse places in the US. Even if there wasn't a pebble worth climbing here, we're within a days drive of everything from Maine to Kentucky.
right but that goes back to my statement that i need to drive out of state to find good roped climbing. I mean think about it, take Birdsboro for example. Would you call that a high quality climbing spot? Don't get me wrong it's okay and i certainly enjoy climbing there once in a while, but it's not comparable to what you can find in West Virginia, New York, Kentucky, New Hampshire, etc. As far as states on the eastern seaboard go, we're near the bottom. Again, not that we don't have a few places in state where one can have a fun day out, god knows i'm glad i don't live in southern Florida, but the quality and quantity of trad and sport climbs here leaves something to be desired.
And as i said i'll stick up for PA bouldering all day, it's great.
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rokdoc
Nov 18, 2010, 4:13 AM
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Post-industrial ghetto cragging at its best.
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socalclimber
Nov 18, 2010, 1:51 PM
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We have a place out here in So Cal called the Riverside Quarry that's pretty bad. Although in all fairness I haven't been in there in many years. I went a total of three times because you could practice nailing and nobody would care.
Junked car, old appliances litter the area. We got a late start on an A3 aid route and were just getting to the anchor just after dark. Next thing I hear is a barrage gun fire coming from the adjoining neighborhood. With in a minute a different barrage erupted.
You have never seen two people rap a route that fast before.
Haven't been back since!
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dynosore
Nov 18, 2010, 1:52 PM
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Dip wrote: In reply to: There are far, far worse places in the US. Even if there wasn't a pebble worth climbing here, we're within a days drive of everything from Maine to Kentucky. right but that goes back to my statement that i need to drive out of state to find good roped climbing. I mean think about it, take Birdsboro for example. Would you call that a high quality climbing spot? Don't get me wrong it's okay and i certainly enjoy climbing there once in a while, but it's not comparable to what you can find in West Virginia, New York, Kentucky, New Hampshire, etc. As far as states on the eastern seaboard go, we're near the bottom. Again, not that we don't have a few places in state where one can have a fun day out, god knows i'm glad i don't live in southern Florida, but the quality and quantity of trad and sport climbs here leaves something to be desired. And as i said i'll stick up for PA bouldering all day, it's great.
True. I don't know why people are so passionate about defending places that are so obviously bad for climbing. I'm in Michigan, fact: I have to drive at least 5 hours to get to good trad climbing. This is a climbing wasteland. One of several reasons I'm moving west soon.
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Dip
Nov 18, 2010, 4:24 PM
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You guys have really good ice though don't you? If you're into that sort of thing...
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Dip
Nov 18, 2010, 4:26 PM
Post #11 of 28
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In reply to: One of several reasons I'm moving west soon
This illustrates my point. I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone who says "man, the climbing in my state really sucks, i'm moving to Pennsylvania."
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kennoyce
Nov 18, 2010, 4:54 PM
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I completely agree. I don't even know why I keep coming back here day after day...... oh wait, you're talking about some area in Pennsylvania, not RC.com, well carry on then.
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shuffleboardfan
Nov 18, 2010, 5:56 PM
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healyje wrote: Went out there one time to do some rope soloing and ended up using my Camry and trees to winch up an engine block and old dishwasher someone had just chucked off the top of the route.
...Who has a winch on their Camry?
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joeforte
Nov 19, 2010, 1:11 PM
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Dip wrote: In reply to: There are far, far worse places in the US. Even if there wasn't a pebble worth climbing here, we're within a days drive of everything from Maine to Kentucky. right but that goes back to my statement that i need to drive out of state to find good roped climbing. I mean think about it, take Birdsboro for example. Would you call that a high quality climbing spot? Don't get me wrong it's okay and i certainly enjoy climbing there once in a while, but it's not comparable to what you can find in West Virginia, New York, Kentucky, New Hampshire, etc. As far as states on the eastern seaboard go, we're near the bottom. Again, not that we don't have a few places in state where one can have a fun day out, god knows i'm glad i don't live in southern Florida, but the quality and quantity of trad and sport climbs here leaves something to be desired. And as i said i'll stick up for PA bouldering all day, it's great.
If you're using Birdsboro to gauge the quality of climbing in PA, you're way off. There are many high-quality areas to rope up, and while birdsboro might be fun, it is not a good representation of the rock in PA. Most of the best rock in PA is not listed on this site, because it is nearly all access sensitive, so I won't go listing the best spots. I will however mention some of the best "public" spots, which are listed on this site.
When I think of high quality rock (for roping up) on public accessible lands in PA, these come to mind:
Main Wall
Paradise
Boxcar
Breakneck and other SW PA sandstone
Ohiopyle crags
Delaware Water Gap (it's not as loose as some people say, unless you are climbing the 5.5s and below)
Again, I can't mention the BEST spots, which are on private property, and make up 90% of the good climbing in PA. Many of these spots have owners that allow climbing, but just don't want it publicized. So if you're traveling, PA is not a destination, unless you have a connection. If you're a local, PA is GREAT.
I've stopped wasting my gas money traveling to the Red, New, and Gunks. Now I climb hard testpieces here in PA that were put up by guys like Hugh Herr, Bob D'antonio, Eric Horst, Jim Nonemaker, Darryl Roth, ect. In the late 80's-mid 90's , those guys were putting up hundreds of routes in the 5.11-5.13 range all over the state. Ask one of them if PA has good rock! Just don't expect them to tell you where...
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dynosore
Nov 19, 2010, 2:18 PM
Post #15 of 28
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joeforte wrote: Dip wrote: In reply to: There are far, far worse places in the US. Even if there wasn't a pebble worth climbing here, we're within a days drive of everything from Maine to Kentucky. right but that goes back to my statement that i need to drive out of state to find good roped climbing. I mean think about it, take Birdsboro for example. Would you call that a high quality climbing spot? Don't get me wrong it's okay and i certainly enjoy climbing there once in a while, but it's not comparable to what you can find in West Virginia, New York, Kentucky, New Hampshire, etc. As far as states on the eastern seaboard go, we're near the bottom. Again, not that we don't have a few places in state where one can have a fun day out, god knows i'm glad i don't live in southern Florida, but the quality and quantity of trad and sport climbs here leaves something to be desired. And as i said i'll stick up for PA bouldering all day, it's great. If you're using Birdsboro to gauge the quality of climbing in PA, you're way off. There are many high-quality areas to rope up, and while birdsboro might be fun, it is not a good representation of the rock in PA. Most of the best rock in PA is not listed on this site, because it is nearly all access sensitive, so I won't go listing the best spots. I will however mention some of the best "public" spots, which are listed on this site. When I think of high quality rock (for roping up) on public accessible lands in PA, these come to mind: Main Wall Paradise Boxcar Breakneck and other SW PA sandstone Ohiopyle crags Delaware Water Gap (it's not as loose as some people say, unless you are climbing the 5.5s and below) Again, I can't mention the BEST spots, which are on private property, and make up 90% of the good climbing in PA. Many of these spots have owners that allow climbing, but just don't want it publicized. So if you're traveling, PA is not a destination, unless you have a connection. If you're a local, PA is GREAT. I've stopped wasting my gas money traveling to the Red, New, and Gunks. Now I climb hard testpieces here in PA that were put up by guys like Hugh Herr, Bob D'antonio, Eric Horst, Jim Nonemaker, Darryl Roth, ect. In the late 80's-mid 90's , those guys were putting up hundreds of routes in the 5.11-5.13 range all over the state. Ask one of them if PA has good rock! Just don't expect them to tell you where...
So you're saying PA has climbing on par with RRG? Interesting.
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Dip
Nov 19, 2010, 3:04 PM
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In reply to: If you're using Birdsboro to gauge the quality of climbing in PA, you're way off. There are many high-quality areas to rope up, and while birdsboro might be fun, it is not a good representation of the rock in PA. Most of the best rock in PA is not listed on this site, because it is nearly all access sensitive, so I won't go listing the best spots. I will however mention some of the best "public" spots, which are listed on this site. When I think of high quality rock (for roping up) on public accessible lands in PA, these come to mind: Main Wall Paradise Boxcar Breakneck and other SW PA sandstone Ohiopyle crags Delaware Water Gap (it's not as loose as some people say, unless you are climbing the 5.5s and below) Again, I can't mention the BEST spots, which are on private property, and make up 90% of the good climbing in PA. Many of these spots have owners that allow climbing, but just don't want it publicized. So if you're traveling, PA is not a destination, unless you have a connection. If you're a local, PA is GREAT. I've stopped wasting my gas money traveling to the Red, New, and Gunks. Now I climb hard testpieces here in PA that were put up by guys like Hugh Herr, Bob D'antonio, Eric Horst, Jim Nonemaker, Darryl Roth, ect. In the late 80's-mid 90's , those guys were putting up hundreds of routes in the 5.11-5.13 range all over the state. Ask one of them if PA has good rock! Just don't expect them to tell you where...
I will concede that i can't speak for the secret places around PA that i don't know about, and i sort of picked the Bird as an example because it's not a good example. But Boxcar? Really? I've been up there a few times, and wasn't incredibly impressed. Again i have to stress that i did have fun, but there's no way i'd include that place on a list of the best climibng in the state, let alone a conversation about great climbing in general.
I've vistited most if not all the other places you've listed, and don't disagree that there are some quality lines there. But for my money, living in the middle of the state, if i'm driving the 3+ hours to Ohiopyle and other SW crags, i'm just going to suck it up and go the extra 2 to the New, where there are literally hundreds of great lines over miles of real estate.
I guess what i'm trying to say is, i'm not trying to come across as unappreciative of the climbing at my disposal, and i probably should have just kept my mouth shut earlier when i said there's nothing here, i just feel like the geology gods robbed us in comparison to neighboring states. You said yourself we're not exactly a destination. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing.
(This post was edited by Dip on Nov 19, 2010, 3:18 PM)
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j_ung
Nov 19, 2010, 3:40 PM
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joeforte, if I'm ever looking to climb in PA, you're the cat I'm calling.
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justroberto
Nov 19, 2010, 3:55 PM
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j_ung wrote: Dip wrote: i'm just going to suck it up and go the extra 2 to the New, where there are literally hundreds of great lines over miles of real estate. Hundreds?! HUNDREDS?!  
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sethg
Nov 19, 2010, 4:01 PM
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You secret scenesters in PA should spread the word around about this great climbing in your state and give up on the Gunks. It is a TOTAL waste of your gas money.
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Dip
Nov 19, 2010, 4:10 PM
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In reply to: You secret scenesters in PA should spread the word around about this great climbing in your state and give up on the Gunks. It is a TOTAL waste of your gas money.
Sorry buddy, i'm not in all the secret stuff. I'll have to continue to contribute to the overcrowded cluster that is the Gunks. FWIW you'll rarely find me there on the weekend...
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dynosore
Nov 19, 2010, 4:45 PM
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Dip wrote: In reply to: You secret scenesters in PA should spread the word around about this great climbing in your state and give up on the Gunks. It is a TOTAL waste of your gas money. Sorry buddy, i'm not in all the secret stuff. I'll have to continue to contribute to the overcrowded cluster that is the Gunks. FWIW you'll rarely find me there on the weekend...
Yeah, tons of secret crags as good as RRG. Sure. I know of another El Capitan here in Michigan too. I secretly date supermodels. Obama consults with me regularly. I drive a Bugatti at night. Can't talk about it. Uh-huh.
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joeforte
Nov 19, 2010, 5:11 PM
Post #24 of 28
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dynosore wrote: joeforte wrote: Dip wrote: In reply to: There are far, far worse places in the US. Even if there wasn't a pebble worth climbing here, we're within a days drive of everything from Maine to Kentucky. right but that goes back to my statement that i need to drive out of state to find good roped climbing. I mean think about it, take Birdsboro for example. Would you call that a high quality climbing spot? Don't get me wrong it's okay and i certainly enjoy climbing there once in a while, but it's not comparable to what you can find in West Virginia, New York, Kentucky, New Hampshire, etc. As far as states on the eastern seaboard go, we're near the bottom. Again, not that we don't have a few places in state where one can have a fun day out, god knows i'm glad i don't live in southern Florida, but the quality and quantity of trad and sport climbs here leaves something to be desired. And as i said i'll stick up for PA bouldering all day, it's great. If you're using Birdsboro to gauge the quality of climbing in PA, you're way off. There are many high-quality areas to rope up, and while birdsboro might be fun, it is not a good representation of the rock in PA. Most of the best rock in PA is not listed on this site, because it is nearly all access sensitive, so I won't go listing the best spots. I will however mention some of the best "public" spots, which are listed on this site. When I think of high quality rock (for roping up) on public accessible lands in PA, these come to mind: Main Wall Paradise Boxcar Breakneck and other SW PA sandstone Ohiopyle crags Delaware Water Gap (it's not as loose as some people say, unless you are climbing the 5.5s and below) Again, I can't mention the BEST spots, which are on private property, and make up 90% of the good climbing in PA. Many of these spots have owners that allow climbing, but just don't want it publicized. So if you're traveling, PA is not a destination, unless you have a connection. If you're a local, PA is GREAT. I've stopped wasting my gas money traveling to the Red, New, and Gunks. Now I climb hard testpieces here in PA that were put up by guys like Hugh Herr, Bob D'antonio, Eric Horst, Jim Nonemaker, Darryl Roth, ect. In the late 80's-mid 90's , those guys were putting up hundreds of routes in the 5.11-5.13 range all over the state. Ask one of them if PA has good rock! Just don't expect them to tell you where... So you're saying PA has climbing on par with RRG? Interesting.
I am saying it has rock QUALITY on par with the RRG. Not QUANTITY, or DENSITY, or HEIGHT. There are areas in PA with steep overhanging sandstone jugs for 100 feet, with difficulty up to 5.13 and still some projects. With stuff like that in the state, I don't feel the need to drive 10 hours to climb literally the same style routes on the same quality rock. If I lived equal distance to both, I'd drive to the Red, but I live 10 mins from these areas and 10 hours from the Red. Driving 10 hours there and back equates to 2 days I don't get to climb.
As far as the Gunks, it is the SAME ROCK as the Delaware Water Gap. The Gap is 30 mins from me, the Gunks is 3 hours. I have to pay at the Gunks and deal with the crowds. The gap is free, and you're almost always alone. The scenery and exposure at the Gap is WAY better than the Gunks. The only thing better about the Gunks is that the routes see more traffic, so they tend to be slightly cleaner. That doesn't bother me, because I like alpine routes and exploration.
The New is 8 hours from me, and I go once a year for the Rendezvous. I love the rock at the New, but again, it is 2 days of driving, that I'd rather be climbing.
The only traveling I do to climb anymore is for big stuff or alpine stuff, because PA maxes out at about 300-350 feet, depending on where you go. I also like to see new places, so I'll travel for that as well. My favorite places to drive for a weekend would be the Dacks and the Whites.
Dip, I'm wondering what you climbed at Boxcar? My first few times there I was unimpressed, especially at the bouldering and toproping. Since then I have put some time into leading the sport routes on the long wall and the harder trad routes, and there is some quality face climbing there for sure! Every face route on the long wall is balancy and techy. They really make you think, especially on the sharp end!
P.S. J_ung, I would gladly show you some of our hidden gems in PA. You will be surprised for sure! If you're ever heading north, feel free to stop in for a day or two. I've got a place for you to crash as well.
(This post was edited by joeforte on Nov 19, 2010, 5:22 PM)
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Dip
Nov 19, 2010, 5:56 PM
Post #25 of 28
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In reply to: Dip, I'm wondering what you climbed at Boxcar? My first few times there I was unimpressed, especially at the bouldering and toproping. Since then I have put some time into leading the sport routes on the long wall and the harder trad routes, and there is some quality face climbing there for sure! Every face route on the long wall is balancy and techy. They really make you think, especially on the sharp end!
I'm not sure the names. It does have a special place in my heart as that 5.5 crack on the main wall was my first ever lead on gear. I had no idea what i was doing and i'll never forget my heart racing when i clipped the anchors on top of that big block at the top. Other than that i did one sport route toward the far right side of the main wall.
I know i keep repeating myself but it's not that i didn't enjoy myself there, i really can't stress that enough. Maybe my problem is no matter how far away, i get limited full days away to spend climbing outside, maybe 1-2 a month. So when i do, i guess i aim more toward the "famous" stuff, rather than obscure crags with a few quality routes.
I am very interested in checking out DWG one of these days. I've just heard if you're going to drive there from Harrisburg you might as well keep going and hit the gunks. Probably better to find out for myself though .
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