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erinakabucky
Aug 10, 2011, 5:54 PM
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I have noticed that the ratings out west (vancouver and Arizona from my experience) and some others I have heard about are not as steep as they are on the east coast (gunks, seneca). for example when only climbing 5.8s on the east I was able to come out west and climb 5.10s. Does anyone know where Utah fits on this scale?
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marc801
Aug 10, 2011, 6:20 PM
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erinakabucky wrote: I have noticed that the ratings out west (vancouver and Arizona from my experience) and some others I have heard about are not as steep as they are on the east coast (gunks, seneca). for example when only climbing 5.8s on the east I was able to come out west and climb 5.10s. Does anyone know where Utah fits on this scale?
Edit to add:
Of course in Utah, there are so many different rock types that you may find some areas more or less difficult than other areas. In Maple Canyon, it's hard to have the endurance to on-sight routes, esp. near your limit, thanks to the overwhelming choice of a dozen or more handholds on every single move (Maple is a conglomerate made up of millions of river rocks glued into a sandstone matrix). The burliness of the crack routes in Indian Creek make many routes an endurance fest and the purity of many of the cracks - meaning few or no foot holds other than the crack - can really up the grade. Do one or two moves and you might say "That's not 5.12a" - do the same move in the same size crack for 160' using 8 of the same size cam and you might feel differently. Also, finger and hand size can mean a difference of a full grade for you as compared to the FA.
(This post was edited by marc801 on Aug 10, 2011, 6:28 PM)
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Jnclk
Aug 10, 2011, 6:48 PM
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Grades at traditional areas tend to be more conservatively graded. Traditional areas out west are comparable in grade to traditional areas in the east. As marc has stated styles may be more of an issue than the grade.
And when you say 5.10 what is your point of reference? Face, slab, dime edging, sport, friction, fingers, hands, roof, offwidth?
(This post was edited by Jnclk on Aug 10, 2011, 6:53 PM)
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erinakabucky
Aug 10, 2011, 8:33 PM
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thanks for the replies. gotcha on the styles point.
my experiences listed are typically for trad areas not sure about the others I have talked to. by 5.10 I am referring to face, slab, crack and I think off width
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funk
Aug 10, 2011, 8:48 PM
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Joe's feels soft. LLC is stiff at times, soft at others.
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superchuffer
Aug 10, 2011, 9:14 PM
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interesting that people would say utah is soft considering that it is the center of climbing in the US. the gunks is old school sandbagged - 5.8 is actually 5.10. if all areas were like the gunks then there wouldn't be 14c
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csproul
Aug 10, 2011, 9:34 PM
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superchuffer wrote: interesting that people would say utah is soft considering that it is the center of climbing in the US. the gunks is old school sandbagged - 5.8 is actually 5.10. if all areas were like the gunks then there wouldn't be 14c
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marc801
Aug 10, 2011, 9:40 PM
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superchuffer wrote: interesting that people would say utah is soft considering that it is the center of climbing in the US. the gunks is old school sandbagged - 5.8 is actually 5.10. if all areas were like the gunks then there wouldn't be 14c
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superchuffer
Aug 10, 2011, 9:43 PM
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In reply to: interesting that people would say utah is soft considering that it is the center of climbing in the US. the gunks is old school sandbagged - 5.8 is actually 5.10. if all areas were like the gunks then there wouldn't be 14c Really?
find another area with that much climbing within an easy day's drive. boulder? boulder is so 1995, and all the boulderites stream to rifle every weekend. where do you suggest?
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csproul
Aug 10, 2011, 9:52 PM
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superchuffer wrote: In reply to: interesting that people would say utah is soft considering that it is the center of climbing in the US. the gunks is old school sandbagged - 5.8 is actually 5.10. if all areas were like the gunks then there wouldn't be 14c Really? find another area with that much climbing within an easy day's drive. boulder? boulder is so 1995, and all the boulderites stream to rifle every weekend. where do you suggest?
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flesh
Aug 10, 2011, 10:52 PM
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Utah,
Little cottonwood canyon, STIFF like Fontainebleau style grades for bouldering and yosimite style ratings for trad routes, STIFF STIFF sport routes.
Big Cottonwood Canyon, Average
American fork, Average
Maple canyon, Soft at the higher levels
Joes Valley, A little Soft
Ibex, Average
Moab/Indian creek, Stiff
Moab bouldering, STIFF
Based on climbing in 12 countries.
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damienclimber
Aug 10, 2011, 11:49 PM
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erinakabucky wrote: I have noticed that the ratings out west (vancouver and Arizona from my experience) and some others I have heard about are not as steep as they are on the east coast (gunks, seneca). for example when only climbing 5.8s on the east I was able to come out west and climb 5.10s. Does anyone know where Utah fits on this scale?
broad spectrum- which places?
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j_ung
Aug 16, 2011, 3:54 PM
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superchuffer wrote: In reply to: interesting that people would say utah is soft considering that it is the center of climbing in the US. the gunks is old school sandbagged - 5.8 is actually 5.10. if all areas were like the gunks then there wouldn't be 14c Really? find another area with that much climbing within an easy day's drive. boulder? boulder is so 1995, and all the boulderites stream to rifle every weekend. where do you suggest?
By that rationale, I'd have to say that the NRG is the center of climbing in America.
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petsfed
Aug 16, 2011, 4:07 PM
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flesh wrote: Moab/Indian creek, Stiff Moab bouldering, STIFF
Admittedly, I come from a pretty stiff crack climbing area, but I felt like Indian Creek, in particular, was quite soft until you hit 5.12 if you knew how to jam the size.
As for the bouldering though, I don't think the word "stiff" can be emphasized enough. I managed to send one V1 at Big Bend, at the absolute pinnacle of my strength, and I've never been able to do it again.
(This post was edited by petsfed on Aug 16, 2011, 4:10 PM)
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caughtinside
Aug 16, 2011, 4:32 PM
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After travelling around and thinking some places stiff, some places soft, this is my opinion of the whole grading thing:
Most major areas are basically right on. However, every place has it's own style. For me, it can take a couple climbing days to figure out the style, see what works at a given area on a new type of stone.
Sometimes, these styles favor my personal strengths as a climber, and the area feels soft for me.
Othertimes, the area highlights my weaknesses, and I either need to step up or get bouted. The place feels hard.
I think at one point or another I have heard every climbing area called both stiff and soft. Yosemite, Joshua Tree, Indian Creek, even the gunks.
The universal truth though is that those 5.6 gunkies will swear up and down they are two grades harder than any other area... while they are at Red Rocks.
My conclusion is that Red Rocks is the only soft major area in the US, and the gunkies love it for this reason, in addition to the cheap airfare, non-NY climate, and the ability to climb more than 200 feet on a single route.
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