If you believe these people, it is possible, and some people are born that way.

http://www.asexuality.org/home/overview.html



I find it hard to imagine. But the world is full of strangeness, so who am I to decide what is and isn't possible for someone, especially if they claim that this is how they experience the world.

I believe people can be willingly celibate and lead a happy and fulfilling life.

Interesting. It says, "An asexual is someone who does not experience sexual attraction. Unlike celibacy, which people choose, asexuality is an intrinsic part of who we are." (I added emphasis) For those who are not asexual, which is probably most people, is the choice not to act on sexual attractions/desires one that leads to unhappiness or lack of fulfillment?

Depends on a circumstance?

In general, happiness is a state of mind. As long as a person believes he/she is happy, he is happy, even if everyone around him/her cannot imagine themselves being happy in the same circumstances.

There is a long tradition of abstinence preceding a big competition/race/fight among top-level athletes in power sports. Obviously, those guys get happiness and fulfillment out of winning a medal, so temporary celibacy in this case must be worth it.

I can also see theoretically that there could be other circumstances where the energy not spent on sex could be channeled into other endeavors, like creating a masterpiece of art or some amazing scientific breakthrough. People who are focused single-mindedly on something could very well be happy without a distraction that sex would bring into their pursuit of whatever.



On the flip side, the multitude of sex scandals involving supposedly celibate-by-choice priests suggests that celibacy is rather intolerable to a human being with a sex drive. And do you think there are many celibate-by-choice primates out there?

My sister and I were having a conversation over Thanksgiving, and this question arose. I thought I'd post a poll to see what a random cross-section of English speaking people think. :)

Priests who have sex with or sexually abuse others are, by definition, not celibate. Somebody who, conciously or unconsciously, diverts that same energy normally used for the sex drive into other endeavors (master craftsmen, advanced researchers, etc.) can of course lead a greatly satisfying life without sex.

Yes - but why?

Why what?

Why be sexually inactive?

Priests who have sex with or sexually abuse others are, by definition, not celibate. Somebody who, conciously or unconsciously, diverts that same energy normally used for the sex drive into other endeavors (master craftsmen, advanced researchers, etc.) can of course lead a greatly satisfying life without sex.

Yes, of course.

But what I meant is that some of those priest who chose priesthood and celibacy that goes with it, are engaging in sexual activities (despite possible severe consequences) because the desire for it is stronger than any of the rules that prohibit it.

So having been brain-washed into it, and having every incentive to remain celibate, they still break the rule -- to me this indicates a pretty strong evidence that celibacy is biologically unnatural/hard to maintain for people who are deliberately suppressing a normal biological function, instead of not having that function in the first place, or channeling the energy into something else.

I don't really know how many of those non-celibate priests were going into priesthood with the plan to break the rules quietly, and how many were fully and wholeheartedly buying the whole celibacy thing, and then discovered that they could not abide it.


There is a difference between two scenarios:

scenario 1 -- pursuing whatever passion that is driving you, and discovering that there is no leftover room for sex in your life. => could be a happy fulfilled person, if he/she stops for long enough from their pursuit to reflect on such things.

scenario 2 -- taking sex off the table to begin with, and then saying, O.K., now pursue a happy fulfilling life. => probably not going to work for most people.

Why be sexually inactive?

I think that's true for a lot of things, though, not just sex. If you focus on the negative aspect of "giving up" anything, it just makes it harder to do, whereas if you embrace a positive vision that excludes what you are trying to give up, it's easier. So for me, if I decide I am going to avoid potato chips, that potato chips are bad and satan, it will quickly happen that potato chips are all I want--I will look longingly at them in the grocery store checkout, my resistance will wane when I go to the deli for a sandwich, until finally I am just really unhappy without potato chips in my life and so I cave and get a bag of delicious Cape Cod salt & vinegar . . . yummmm. On the other hand, if I can keep in my mind a positive vision of myself as a healthy, fit person, who puts only good and wholesome things inside of my body, it will naturally exclude junky foods though I'm not particularly focusing on potato chips or any other thing I'm giving up. I guess all that by way of agreeing that it is difficult, but also possible--though maybe not necessarily for everyone--to give up sex in a "scenario 1" type way, if you have a good reason.

I don't know what is going on in your life, but I don't really think it is a good analogy to say that sex is like junk food. Nobody "needs" junk food, though people like to have it in some amount, but in case of sex I do believe that normal people "need" it, unless they are so spent that they have no energy left for it.


In my "scenario type 1" you don't start out with "O.K., I am going to give up sex because I have a goal of achieving something and I think sex will get in the way". Which is how it works if you say "I am going to limit junk food in order to lose weight".


In "scenario type 1", I am thinking something like "I am going to run a marathon" (or climb Everest, or hike to South Pole, or whatever). This leads to something like:"O.K., this week I need to run 3 miles on Mon-Wed, 5 miles on Thursday after work, then do a 10-mile run on Saturday, and rest on Sunday", etc. etc. And maybe as a result of doing all that and thinking about your run times and all the planning and excitement and tiredness you go from having sex constantly on your mind, to not really thinking about it much...

But having less sex drive is an effect in this case, and not something you start with as a pre-requisite. It is NOT "O.K., I am giving up sex for the next 6 months because I want to train for marathon, and I really want to run a marathon, so every time I think about sex I'm going to remind myself that my goal of running a marathon is worth not having sex."

Do you see the distinction?

Yeah, I hesitated over that analogy, because it does break down in several respects. I guess I was thinking, though, that the Scenario 1 goal lined up with "I am going to become healthy and cook/eat healthy foods" or something along that line. But it seems like in your distinction, sex doesn't play into the outcome of the marathon training in the same way that junk food vs. health food does: you could probably run a marathon and also remain sexually active. So why not do both?

I'm not saying you can just trick yourself into giving something up by framing it in a positive way, but don't you think on some level you can know from the outset that a goal/endeavor you choose will exclude something else from your life? Is it more Scenario 1 or Scenario 2 if you make such a choice?

I suppose there could be a number of reasons. Here are some I can think of:

-For a time of physical healing for self/partner
-To allow time for emotional/psychological healing (as from abuse)
-For the sake of a career/personal endeavor--something like a trek to Antarctica or a trip on the space shuttle comes to mind
-To avoid spreading a sexually transmitted disease
-To avoid getting a sexually transmitted disease (as from one's partner)
-For religious reasons
-For other moral/ethical reasons, particularly in a situation or environment where one cannot find a suitable partner
-Habitual disinterest, as lena_chita outlined with the asexuality website

Maybe there are others?