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dagibbs
May 2, 2012, 8:48 PM
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I'm thinking of spending a few days climbing in New Hampshire, both some trad at Cathedral and/or Whitehorse ledges and at Rumney. I'm wondering, generally, how stiff ratings are there? I'm generally looking at the easier end of things -- up to low 5.10 at the hardest.
Obviously, one needs a comparison point for such things, since lots of places grade differently. I've got a fairly good feel for grades in the Luskville, Quebec (Gatineau Park) area around Ottawa, Montagne d'Argent in Quebec, El Potrero Chico in Mexico, and the Chapel Pond area in the Adirondacks.
Thanks.
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tradmanclimbs
May 2, 2012, 10:33 PM
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NH generaly much more reasonable than the Daks and Gunks. Still the best indicator is what year the climb was put up. 5.9 and 9+ from 60's 70,s and 80s can be fairly stiff compared to more recent climbs in the 5.9 to 10a range. more important than the grade is the gear INMOP.. If the gear is good then it is not so bad getting spanked 
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sp115
May 3, 2012, 12:14 AM
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Gunks, Daks, North Conway, all seems about the same to me. Then again, I really don't climb harder than 5.3, so what do I know?
(This post was edited by sp115 on May 3, 2012, 12:15 AM)
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rocknice2
May 3, 2012, 1:03 AM
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sp115 wrote: Gunks, Daks, North Conway, all seems about the same to me
+1^
Beware the 5.9+ this can be anything from 10b - 11a
Luskville, Quebec (Gatineau Park) area around Ottawa, Montagne d'Argent in Quebec, El Potrero Chico in Mexico
Are all softer than northeast NE.
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ensonik
May 3, 2012, 2:25 AM
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I'll chime in on this.
I lead on gear at about 5.8 and have climbed in NH (Cathedral, Whitehorse, Rumney and Canon), Gunks, Daks and Montagne d'Argent.
* Montagne d'$ is by far the softest of the areas I've been to. 2 grades difference in some cases (as far as my limited experience tells me)
* Chapel Pond area is very much equivalent to the cragging I've done in NH.
* As for the rest, I'd say they are very much equivalent. As much as people like to diss the Gunks, it feels pretty much the same as elsewhere in NE. (at least at the grade I climb at).
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wonderwoman
May 3, 2012, 2:45 AM
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Anything that Henry Barber put up is going to be hard for the grade.
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dagibbs
May 3, 2012, 2:58 AM
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ensonik wrote: * Montagne d'$ is by far the softest of the areas I've been to. 2 grades difference in some cases (as far as my limited experience tells me)
Yeah, I find the grades at MdA tend towards the soft, too.
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mikebee
May 3, 2012, 3:01 AM
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In reply to: Anything that Henry Barber put up is going to be hard for the grade.
Funny, we say that for a few crags in Australia too!
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blueeyedclimber
May 5, 2012, 8:41 PM
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dagibbs wrote: I'm thinking of spending a few days climbing in New Hampshire, both some trad at Cathedral and/or Whitehorse ledges and at Rumney. I'm wondering, generally, how stiff ratings are there? I'm generally looking at the easier end of things -- up to low 5.10 at the hardest. Obviously, one needs a comparison point for such things, since lots of places grade differently. I've got a fairly good feel for grades in the Luskville, Quebec (Gatineau Park) area around Ottawa, Montagne d'Argent in Quebec, El Potrero Chico in Mexico, and the Chapel Pond area in the Adirondacks. Thanks.
Rumney will be much softer in those grades than the rest. As alluded to earlier, beware of anything in North Conway rated 9+ or put up by Henry Barber in the 70's.
Also, how much trad have you done? If 10a is your physical limit, then that will limit your choices in NoCo.
Josh
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dagibbs
May 7, 2012, 12:56 AM
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blueeyedclimber wrote: dagibbs wrote: I'm thinking of spending a few days climbing in New Hampshire, both some trad at Cathedral and/or Whitehorse ledges and at Rumney. I'm wondering, generally, how stiff ratings are there? I'm generally looking at the easier end of things -- up to low 5.10 at the hardest. Obviously, one needs a comparison point for such things, since lots of places grade differently. I've got a fairly good feel for grades in the Luskville, Quebec (Gatineau Park) area around Ottawa, Montagne d'Argent in Quebec, El Potrero Chico in Mexico, and the Chapel Pond area in the Adirondacks. Thanks. Rumney will be much softer in those grades than the rest. As alluded to earlier, beware of anything in North Conway rated 9+ or put up by Henry Barber in the 70's. Also, how much trad have you done? If 10a is your physical limit, then that will limit your choices in NoCo. Josh
I've done a fair bit of trad, but I'm not willing to climb at/near my limit while leading on gear. Well, it depends on the gear, of course.
Knowing Rumney is a bit easier on the grades is helpful.
Thanks.
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tomcat
May 7, 2012, 1:14 AM
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The grades are not an issue really. It's granite, so crack technique and smearing skills are important, and if you don't have them things will feel harder.
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dagibbs
May 7, 2012, 11:49 AM
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tomcat wrote: The grades are not an issue really. It's granite, so crack technique and smearing skills are important, and if you don't have them things will feel harder.
Whitehorse/Cathedral are granite -- I don't think Rumney is.
All of the local rock around Ottawa (my home) is granite, so being on granite isn't going to throw me off.
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tomcat
May 7, 2012, 12:09 PM
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That is correct, Rumney is Schist. I'm sorry I responded.
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dagibbs
May 7, 2012, 1:16 PM
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tomcat wrote: That is correct, Rumney is Schist. I'm sorry I responded.
Not a problem -- you were trying to be helpful. If my main experience was, say, EPC style limestone, then climbing on granite might be quite different.
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shoo
May 7, 2012, 2:28 PM
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dagibbs wrote: blueeyedclimber wrote: dagibbs wrote: I'm thinking of spending a few days climbing in New Hampshire, both some trad at Cathedral and/or Whitehorse ledges and at Rumney. I'm wondering, generally, how stiff ratings are there? I'm generally looking at the easier end of things -- up to low 5.10 at the hardest. Obviously, one needs a comparison point for such things, since lots of places grade differently. I've got a fairly good feel for grades in the Luskville, Quebec (Gatineau Park) area around Ottawa, Montagne d'Argent in Quebec, El Potrero Chico in Mexico, and the Chapel Pond area in the Adirondacks. Thanks. Rumney will be much softer in those grades than the rest. As alluded to earlier, beware of anything in North Conway rated 9+ or put up by Henry Barber in the 70's. Also, how much trad have you done? If 10a is your physical limit, then that will limit your choices in NoCo. Josh I've done a fair bit of trad, but I'm not willing to climb at/near my limit while leading on gear. Well, it depends on the gear, of course. Knowing Rumney is a bit easier on the grades is helpful. Thanks.
I agree with most of the above, except perhaps that you'll be limited for trad below 5.10. There is a plethora of fantastic moderate granite trad all the way from 5.6-5.9.
Northeast granite trad, such as Cathedral, Whitehorse, and Cannon, tends to be graded similarly to other old granite trad locations in the US. Expect that they will be substantially harder than typical sport grades, depending highly on your experience with similar styles. Experience with techy fingercrack (particularly at Cathedral in the 5.9 range) and granite slab is very helpful. As above, beware the notorious 5.9+ and the year of first ascent. Also be sure to ask some locals for route advice.
Sport in the northeast, particularly Rumney, is similar to other US sport locations. Maybe a touch harder than average for most major areas, but not by much. However, you'll find that Rumney doesn't offer very much that is really fun below 5.9. There's plenty at 5.9 and above, but most things 5.8 and lower tend to be kinda awkward slabby stuff over ugly rock.
Personally, if I were fairly comfortable with granite trad at, say, 5.8 and pushing sport at 5.10a, I would consider skipping Rumney altogether.
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cracklover
May 7, 2012, 5:09 PM
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shoo wrote: Personally, if I were fairly comfortable with granite trad at, say, 5.8 and pushing sport at 5.10a, I would consider skipping Rumney altogether.
Maybe so, but there certainly are definitely enough super-fun routes at Rumney at 9+ to 10- to make a weekend there on a road trip very worthwhile. A few that come to mind:
Underdog, Lonesome Dove, Dolt, Jolt, Armed & Dangerous & Off, Junco, Oby-Won, Yoda, Rock Du Jours and the Toad climbs (fun multi-pitch!), and Electric Socks are some of the best.
GO
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LostinMaine
May 7, 2012, 10:52 PM
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If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo).
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edge
May 8, 2012, 12:49 AM
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LostinMaine wrote: If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo).
Probably just a mental hiccup, but Echo is West of Conway, about an hours drive, at the northern end of Franconia Notch (right near Cannon.)
I can't speak to the climbing at Echo, in 34 years of climbing in NH, I've never been there.
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tradmanclimbs
May 8, 2012, 2:28 AM
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Short and wet in my experience. Seems like a long way to drive for single pitch. I get that same feeling when I hike past the creature wall on my way to Upper Washbowl. Glad all those people stay down there and leave the good stuff on the real cliff free for those who like to hike......
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blueeyedclimber
May 8, 2012, 12:50 PM
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edge wrote: LostinMaine wrote: If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo). Probably just a mental hiccup, but Echo is West of Conway, about an hours drive, at the northern end of Franconia Notch (right near Cannon.) I can't speak to the climbing at Echo, in 34 years of climbing in NH, I've never been there.
Well, it would be silly for you to go there now, but it is a great beginner trad area.
The only thing a beginner should be aware of is that the hardest moves of a lot of the climbs are often in the first 15 feet and that it stays wet for a little bit after a rain. And the wettest parts are usually those first 15 feet.
Josh
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LostinMaine
May 9, 2012, 9:47 AM
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edge wrote: LostinMaine wrote: If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo). Probably just a mental hiccup, but Echo is West of Conway, about an hours drive, at the northern end of Franconia Notch (right near Cannon.) I can't speak to the climbing at Echo, in 34 years of climbing in NH, I've never been there.
Oops! Indeed it is West.
I've only been to Echo once visiting a friend in the area. It happened to be bone dry that day, so we climbed a ton of routes in a single day. I agree with others that is not a destination crag, but it did have some very nice single pitch climbs in the grade that the OP was interested in.
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wonderwoman
May 9, 2012, 1:27 PM
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LostinMaine wrote: edge wrote: LostinMaine wrote: If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo). Probably just a mental hiccup, but Echo is West of Conway, about an hours drive, at the northern end of Franconia Notch (right near Cannon.) I can't speak to the climbing at Echo, in 34 years of climbing in NH, I've never been there. Oops! Indeed it is West. I've only been to Echo once visiting a friend in the area. It happened to be bone dry that day, so we climbed a ton of routes in a single day. I agree with others that is not a destination crag, but it did have some very nice single pitch climbs in the grade that the OP was interested in.
I like Echo, too. I did not like profile (crag above it), though. It seemed chossy and the book hyped it up to be something that it was not.
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edge
May 9, 2012, 2:14 PM
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wonderwoman wrote: LostinMaine wrote: edge wrote: LostinMaine wrote: If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo). Probably just a mental hiccup, but Echo is West of Conway, about an hours drive, at the northern end of Franconia Notch (right near Cannon.) I can't speak to the climbing at Echo, in 34 years of climbing in NH, I've never been there. Oops! Indeed it is West. I've only been to Echo once visiting a friend in the area. It happened to be bone dry that day, so we climbed a ton of routes in a single day. I agree with others that is not a destination crag, but it did have some very nice single pitch climbs in the grade that the OP was interested in. I like Echo, too. I did not like profile (crag above it), though. It seemed chossy and the book hyped it up to be something that it was not.
I have never climbed at Profile either. If I am going to drive that far (and it's only an hour 15 min for me) then I just can't resist the allure of Cannon. If I can see the big stone from Echo or Profile, then I am sure I would have guilt pangs that I have copped out of the greater adventure.
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wonderwoman
May 9, 2012, 2:47 PM
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edge wrote: wonderwoman wrote: LostinMaine wrote: edge wrote: LostinMaine wrote: If you're spending a few days and looking for some moderates to lead in northern NH, head just a bit East from Conway and spend a day at Echo. It will be worth your while considering the grades you're trying to climb. The grades at Echo seem on par with Chapel Pond area, but maybe a touch softer than Creature Wall grades (which has the most comparable climbing, imo). Probably just a mental hiccup, but Echo is West of Conway, about an hours drive, at the northern end of Franconia Notch (right near Cannon.) I can't speak to the climbing at Echo, in 34 years of climbing in NH, I've never been there. Oops! Indeed it is West. I've only been to Echo once visiting a friend in the area. It happened to be bone dry that day, so we climbed a ton of routes in a single day. I agree with others that is not a destination crag, but it did have some very nice single pitch climbs in the grade that the OP was interested in. I like Echo, too. I did not like profile (crag above it), though. It seemed chossy and the book hyped it up to be something that it was not. I have never climbed at Profile either. If I am going to drive that far (and it's only an hour 15 min for me) then I just can't resist the allure of Cannon. If I can see the big stone from Echo or Profile, then I am sure I would have guilt pangs that I have copped out of the greater adventure.
Cannon is too hard-core for me.
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edge
May 9, 2012, 4:17 PM
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wonderwoman wrote: Cannon is too hard-core for me.
This calls for a separate thread...
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