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jacques
Jun 1, 2015, 3:05 PM
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you are climbing and place a bad gear and the gear pull out. you enter in a difficulty and saw, with horror, that you can died. You live the most intense moment of your life
what is your trainiing? try to plan aid climbing session to place better gear or you learn how to place bolt from the top? .
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granite_grrl
Jun 2, 2015, 3:34 PM
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jacques wrote: you are climbing and place a bad gear and the gear pull out. you enter in a difficulty and saw, with horror, that you can died. You live the most intense moment of your life what is your trainiing? try to plan aid climbing session to place better gear or you learn how to place bolt from the top? .
Start sport climbing?
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sungam
Jun 2, 2015, 4:45 PM
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Sidenote: Jaques - you are un-ironically the poster that I wish I could be.
I tend to avoid getting into situations where I would die if I fell unless the climbing is really easy and the rock is solid. I've never been in a really shit situation.
I have, however done some preperation for such an occasion.
Most of it is in the shower, but sometimes it is while I am, ahem, sitting around for a while the day after my infamous "chilli cheese wedges" (all homade, of course, except for the cheese cuz that shit is pretty complicated and I don't have a cow).
Generally it is purely mental simulation, going through the motions of what would happen if there was, for example. an eruption of Mount Ben Nevis while I was nailing the sick crux on the 6th (pronounced "Sick-th") pitch of a new project that I was onsighting the FA of -but sometimes I flex my muscles in time with the moves.
I guess there isn't really a grade in my dream (kinda like Sharma not grading the mandala) but obviously it is sick hard because I'm finding it pretty hard and just looked down at my last piece of pro, which is obviously pretty fucking far below me because I am balls out gnarly in my daydreams.
Anyways, the Mount Ben Nevis is pretty much doing it's best Vesuvius impression and loosens up the rock I'm on and shakes out my links cams making me really run out, and if that wasn't bad enough the magmqa is, like, cooking my belayer who is telling me I need to send right goddamn now so he can second the pitch and escape the heat before it melts our ropes.
I realize that if I don't do anything I'm going to pump out and whip onto non-existant gear and factor-2 a belay that has been dangerously compromised by molten lava.
Shit. Time to get serious.
I use my extensive kung-fu meditation experience, gained from not only watching crouching tiger hidden dragon a whopping 16 times but also from watching several kung fu videos on youtube. I keep talking about starting to do yoga and sometimes I do cat-camel bends to improve my thoracic spine flexibility so that can only help my mental resilience.
With my mind at one with my body I do the moves. They're hard but I breathe deeply and focus on my balance being just right, I grab the handholds and put my feet on the footholds and mvoe upwards. The moves are all that matter, but sometimes it is hard to focus since the heady fumes from the valcano are making me kinda high. I finsih the pitch but my partner has succumb to the fumes and is completely KO'ed, so I hand-over-hand haul him up. Since there was no pro left in the whole pitch I bring him right to the top. We are on Castle ridge so I sling him over my shoulders 'nam style and sprint along the top of the ridge and to the summit.
Realizing that the lava flow is headed right for Fort William I realize something has to be done so I run to the lava and light my PAS on fire, quickly running back up the the summit plateau and using the smoldering nylon to light the small pile of dayssacks and goretex we've made on the rocks. I try to smoke signal the fire department to let them know there is a volcano, but the fire isn't big enough.
I end up having to add my clothes to the pile, which does the trick. I hike back down to the town in just my Rab merino wool boxers (which make me look pretty hung for once), which was saved by the firefighters, and am welcomed by a grateful crowd, who tell me that I am the real hero for saving the town and also that my abs are p. good and my package looks legit.
I'm not sure how exactly this lines up with RL but I hope that the spirit forged in expensive electricity bills will see me true if I ever fuck up and find myself facing a really serious fall on tough ground.
(This post was edited by sungam on Jun 2, 2015, 5:14 PM)
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sungam
Jun 2, 2015, 5:24 PM
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God I wish I could 5star my own posts.
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viciado
Jun 3, 2015, 12:33 PM
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"Mount" Ben Nevis is a bit repetitive isn't it? Does that mean you only get the redpoint even for an FA?
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jacques
Jun 4, 2015, 12:23 PM
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I was climbing a 5.10 route. hard move where you have to commit yourself.
we we were in an up draft, so it was raining around us, but not on the cliff where we were. I start the last pitch and forget two cam. i went back to the belay and bridge between a small hole and a good stand for my left foot. the small hole broke and I was falling.
My belayer gave me the cam at the same time. But he keep is hand on the rope and stop my fall. that ten second was not really intense,. but the fall was a 150 falls on rock. My partner was there and save my life in ten second
what are you going to do for training? are you going to use the same belay as in a gym or work out with your partner different kind of belay that are good in different condition?
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viciado
Jun 4, 2015, 4:18 PM
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Not a hard concept here... train or practice doing right and you will likely do it right when it counts. But as sungam's epic (post) shows... you can't predict everything.
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jacques
Jun 8, 2015, 7:23 AM
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viciado wrote: Not a hard concept here... train or practice doing right and you will likely do it right when it counts. But as sungam's epic (post) shows... you can't predict everything.
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marc801
Jun 8, 2015, 3:51 PM
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jacques wrote: For that women, the ten second of her life didh't have a happy ending as we see people with sport sling on trad route, we can understand that there is some work to do.
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jacques
Jun 8, 2015, 7:47 PM
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marc801 wrote: You realize that the Gunks was one of the places where sport slings - quick draws - were invented and that it was common to carry 4-6 short slings. In the 60's, when many of the classic routes were put in, it was common practice to just clip two biners to a piton.
from two biner to a piton and clipping bolt...we are very close to sport climbing.
Because I learned in remote area in Quebec, I focus more in what I saw when I climbed, the challenge of the climb and safety. For me, climbing 5.11 was not fun because I didn't have the hand (carpal tunel) for it. I am very far from the fight between sport and trad to know who is the best climber (in the 70 I think)
I moved to the new generation where people choose to train for ten second of there life or to train to compete with the best climber. As you know, most piton, with the ice and 90 degree of the summer, are not so safe. We leave the piton in place but back them up if we are safe. This have nothing to do with who is going to climb 5.12 because a climber can died in a 5.7 moved... as the women did last year in a sport style and ethic.
I like to think that some days, people will make a distinction between sport and trad as strong as the distinction between alpine skying and cross country skying and that people will workout more there safety in trad and more there climbing movement in sport. That doesn't means that some one couldn't do both, but that people will know that if you want to climb in the gunks trad route...you most know better on safety than how do to the move... do the move and risk your life as the women did in a 5.7 to free the 5.11 route
(This post was edited by jacques on Jun 9, 2015, 6:41 AM)
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Toast_in_the_Machine
Jun 9, 2015, 4:06 AM
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sungam wrote: God I wish I could 5star my own posts.
Does that involve sitting in a shower?
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marc801
Jun 9, 2015, 6:56 PM
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jacques wrote: As you know, most piton, with the ice and 90 degree of the summer, are not so safe. We leave the piton in place but back them up if we are safe. This have nothing to do with who is going to climb 5.12 because a climber can died in a 5.7 moved... as the women did last year in a sport style and ethic. I like to think that some days, people will make a distinction between sport and trad as strong as the distinction between alpine skying and cross country skying and that people will workout more there safety in trad and more there climbing movement in sport. That doesn't means that some one couldn't do both, but that people will know that if you want to climb in the gunks trad route...you most know better on safety than how do to the move... do the move and risk your life as the women did in a 5.7 to free the 5.11 route
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sungam
Jun 10, 2015, 9:46 PM
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Toast_in_the_Machine wrote: sungam wrote: God I wish I could 5star my own posts. Does that involve sitting in a shower?
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jacques
Jun 11, 2015, 3:49 PM
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marc801 wrote: Do you not remember all the discussion, of which you were a part, that occurred after that incident? To refresh you memory - her death had nothing to do with sport mentality or a sport climbing approach.
I do remember that those guy who don't make a distinction between sport and trad don't see the sport mistake.
If you train for ten second of your life, you will know that a fall can kill you at that place and place a gear to protect it. It is the trad mentality.
In sport, you do like the women. You climb it a first time in top rope and came the next week to send it, You eliminate every thing that can be a problem at your success, like the pro, and just solo what is under your belt.
I talked whit many people and a lot of them told me that they often scare and have no pleasure at sport climbing at a too high level too fast. As people will understand that people feel the danger before they understand what is the danger...most people will be aware of training for ten second of there life.
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marc801
Jun 12, 2015, 4:26 PM
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jacques wrote: If you train for ten second of your life, you will know that a fall can kill you at that place and place a gear to protect it. It is the trad mentality.
jacques wrote: In sport, you do like the women. You climb it a first time in top rope and came the next week to send it, You eliminate every thing that can be a problem at your success, like the pro, and just solo what is under your belt.
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6pacfershur
Jun 13, 2015, 4:26 AM
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jacques wrote: In sport, you do like the women..... climb it a first time in top rope and came the next week to send it........
try talking that shit to lynn hill.....or sasha digiulian
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jacques
Jun 15, 2015, 7:49 AM
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6pacfershur wrote: try talking that shit to lynn hill.....or sasha digiulian
i saw some video of her climb of the nose and thing that he pro is very well place to protect an injury, for ten second of there life, not to protect a long fall (whymper). I am from that mentality and those of peter croft and edlinger. Edlinger was a sport climber, but he place the base of how to train to became autonomous in the field and have fun. It is a must for climbing, even if I admit that training for trad is different then training for sport.
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marc801
Jun 16, 2015, 4:42 PM
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6pacfershur wrote: jacques wrote: In sport, you do like the women..... climb it a first time in top rope and came the next week to send it........ try talking that shit to lynn hill.....or sasha digiulian
Frankly I've given up on jacques ever understanding that this huge difference between sport and trad is mostly in his head and not reality.
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cracklover
Jun 16, 2015, 8:42 PM
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marc801 wrote: 6pacfershur wrote: jacques wrote: In sport, you do like the women..... climb it a first time in top rope and came the next week to send it........ try talking that shit to lynn hill.....or sasha digiulian Jacques English is so poor I couldn't figure out if he was talking about women climbers in general: "...the women..." or if it was about "...the woman..." who was killed in a fall from The Yellow Wall at the Gunks last year. I went with the latter in my response. Frankly I've given up on jacques ever understanding that this huge difference between sport and trad is mostly in his head and not reality.
“Never wrestle with pigs. You both get dirty and the pig likes it.”
- George Bernard Shaw
GO
(This post was edited by cracklover on Jun 16, 2015, 8:52 PM)
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