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supertopoz
Mar 17, 2003, 2:13 AM
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Mr Pass and Mr Russ.
I be wondering one thing, I am very interested in climbing Aid faster, I know Mr Pass does not go out of his way to climb fast, I know how important it is to top step in tradional aid ladders, and I can do this quite well. So long as it is not some dodgy hook. When I am top stepping my knees are past my current piece of gear.
Can I get this same kind of height with the russian aid system?
I don't have the russian set up, but I want to climb faster
Which system will be the better way in the future. :twisted:
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beyond_gravity
Mar 17, 2003, 2:20 AM
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You won’t be able to get your knees above the piece and still take advantage of the Russian aider system because the hook that you attach your “foot straps” into the aider is just below your knee.. However, on vertical and slightly overhanging walls, you won’t need to fifi as you would using traditional aiders, saving you time. So it’s kind of a catch 22. I’m not an experienced aid climber at all so I could be way off here. Dr. Piton will be able to give you a lot better answer.
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passthepitonspete
Mar 17, 2003, 4:27 AM
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If you are getting your knees past your gear, then you are either on less-than-vertical terrain, or you are Superman.
What kind of rock are you climbing? What's the gear like? Top-stepping in regular aiders is hard. Not impossible, just hard. It's a heckuva lot easier in Russkies, at least on steep ground, which is where I tend to hang out on El Cap. This is because of the calf-heel camming action that you realize with the stirrup and the rigidity of your tibia. It is entirely possible to put the hook of the Russian Aider directly into the sling of your skyhook - even a dodgy hook - which makes for some very rad top-stepping with unparalleled confidence.
Unquestionably Russian Aiders have improved my climbing, be it fast, or be it slow. It's less clusterf*ck, and greater reach.
Look, just because I don't usually climb fast doesn't mean that I can't climb fast when I am motivated to do so. Just ask Tom. It's amazing what I can do when I'm about to run out of water cuz I dropped his pig! A few observers in the Meadows later told us they were amazed when our leisurely pitch-a-day pace suddenly quadrupled.
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supertopoz
Mar 17, 2003, 10:11 AM
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Chears mr P.
The rock I'm on is perhapes just slightly vertical. I don't find top stepping all that difficult, what I find difficult is doing any kind of testing on the next piece of gear when I am riding it high. And my knees often go a long way past the gear. I guess the gear is about level with my middle thigh.
The russian system seems a lot more logical and better to me. correct me if I am wrong but the plus points seem to be.
1. You don't have to fiddle about getting you feet in a twist ladder.
2. There is the leverage which means you don't need to fifi all the time.
3. It all seems a lot quicker.
Pete do you have some beta on the russian system. I use much of your suggestions already, a run down of how to use them would be helpful to us all.
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tim
Mar 17, 2003, 1:50 PM
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I have 2 pair of Russians (one mine, one Jeff Wright's) and I find it easier to top-step in them than anything else. For hooks and aliens, you can actually jam the knee-hook right into the loop, and "stand" directly on the piece. That's rad, and it's tough to do with traditional ladder aiders :-)
One thing that strikes me funny about your response, though, you say that your piece is about level with your middle thigh, yet you say that your knees are often above the piece. This does not make sense to me.
Either you're built upside down, or we're thinking of different things when someone says "middle thigh". You mean the part of your leg between your knee and your hip, right? That would place your knees below your piece, unless I'm mistaken.
Anyways, I'd never go back to ladder aiders. The ease of switching to free climbing, the ease of top stepping, and the enormous reduction in cluster fuck all add up to a much more efficient and satisfied aid climber (for me).
YMMV, of course. Ammon is a hyper-studly guy and he uses Yates ladders. Then again he is sponsored by Yates, and would probably climb faster than me if he just aided with slings.
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twrock
Mar 17, 2003, 3:04 PM
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You might want to look here for a height comparison:
Russian Aider thread link
YMMV, but I have not found the Russian Aiders to be "faster." I have found them to be preferable due to the leverage advantage. Top-stepping in traditional aiders might gain a slight height advantage, but I sure feel more secure hooked into the top rings of my RA's. Since I'm not trying to set any speed records, I definitely prefer them over traditional aiders.
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passthepitonspete
Mar 17, 2003, 5:34 PM
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Er, uh - this like doesn't make sense, eh? What you describe is mutually exclusive:
In reply to: "And my knees often go a long way past the gear. I guess the gear is about level with my middle thigh."
When you say your knees go past the gear, I assumed you meant that you really were top-stepping, and that the gear was below your knees. What you describe with the gear at mid-thigh is barely top-stepping - I would call that the ol' Texas Two-Step.
If you want to know to find out how to REALLY topstep, then you can click here to Ask Dr. Piton: What is the Better Way to topstep?
I maintain that the Russian Aiders are ETS, and that they will be the recognized norm for aid climbing within the next few years, as soon as someone gets their lazy ass round to actually making enough to meet the demand. Like Russ Walling. [HINT]
Please click here to read DR. PITON'S COMMENTS and see COOL PHOTOS of the Russian Aiders.
Always remember - if you're looking for stuff I've written, before you Ask Dr. Piton, be sure to first check out the INDEX TO DR. PITON STUFF.
Cheers,
The Doc
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supertopoz
Mar 18, 2003, 12:16 AM
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Yeps!
One was not feeling ones best yesterday, you are right I am not built up side down.
I meant
Middle calf not thigh.
Sorry.
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