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animal
May 6, 2003, 2:14 AM
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i'm looking to make a couple of extra bucks for some extras for my trad rack and i've noticed there is a lot of items at m.e.c. that won't be shipped to the states....well i was thinking what if i took the orders from our fellow americans and purchased these items and shipped them to where you are....of course we're talking CANADIAN DOLLARS....the buyer pays shipping (cost will depend where you live and how you want it shipped) plus 5% for my time...there is still a major savings for our american friends....pm me and let me know...if there is enough interest who knows....
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orangekyak
May 6, 2003, 2:11 PM
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dude, don't you have like a 15% sales tax?
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tim
May 6, 2003, 2:22 PM
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It's a crushing deal when you buy certain items from MEC.
I bought 2 Mammut 7.5mm twins from MEC for $99.50 each. I can't remember whether that was Canadian or USD. I think it was USD.
Regardless, the price for purchase ended up being $213 USD for both. The closest I could find from a US retailer was over $325 USD. There is no competition whatsoever... I had the ropes backordered and shipped to a friend in Montreal, then inter-office shipment got them down here.
The ropes are great. They're like twine ;-). No more rope drag :-D.
MEC crushes all. Well, except for Maple Leaf Corp. and Snow Leopard Mountain Sports. MEC could only get down to $175 USD on the BD Vipers I wanted. SLMS and MLC sold me Viper adzes for $115 apiece. That ruled. Now I just need to get a new hacksaw blade to remove the adze piece, and I'm all set for autumn alpine routes back in CA :-).
MEC rules. (REI rules too -- you can return ANYTHING, including, say, a pair of $400 mountaineering boots that were "lightly used" for 20 days of climbing in Ecuador, then developed hot spots... ask my man Rich about that... ;-))
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darkside
May 6, 2003, 3:02 PM
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The reason M.E.C.'s prices are so low is they are a not for profit co-op. The reason they do not ship to the States is that US distributers threatened to stop supplying them for undercutting US retailers prices. :(
Selling gear wholesale to the US like this could endanger things again but having said that, I have taken things to the States for friends. Don't forget that when things are shipped forward, they are subject to customs duties and taxes as they enter the US.
Some gear can be shipped directly to the US but much climbing gear can't be so check first and if you can save some money this way then more power to you.
Just remember it is the US distributers that are screwing folks, not the M.E.C. :evil:
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bsperes
May 6, 2003, 3:45 PM
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when I used to order from Euro websites there was always a disclaimer about paying customs duties and taxes coming into the states. Never once did I pay anything.
If my buddy in Canada sends something used (that is without tags) to me via UPS there should be no issues with this.
Animal, the best way to make $$ on this is on Arcteryx gear. I was in Toronto for work a few months back and people were begging me to bring stuff bag. Hell I managed to stuff a Bora 80 pack for myself into my suitcase.
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bigdrop
May 6, 2003, 4:28 PM
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1)
Have you looked into the legalities of what your are suggesting? This is not a flame or anything.. Really I’m just curious if its legal to resell new merchandise for a profit (I believe it might be tax evasion unless you are going to pay the tax on the extra 5% you are charging.)
Think of it this way..
If your idea is legal stores could sell you something at say an 80% discount but then charge you a trivial 80% service fee.
-The customer saves 80% of the 15% sales tax (the customer saves money)
-The store earns the same amount of money (to the retailer the sale hasn’t changed)
-The government collects 80% LESS tax from the sale. (the government is being ripped off)
Since no stores do this I’m assuming its not legal. Then again by background is engineering not finance, I could be TOTALLY wrong. :-)
2)
-The US dollar is currently trading for $0.7099 CND
-Sales TAX is 15% in Ontario (I’m assuming you are in Ontario)
-Your fee is 5%
So an item that is listed as $100 CND will cost a US buyer $85.188USD (right??)
Add to that shipping fees and insurance and customs/duty fees.
Is it really still worth it?
~JC
P.S. I HAVE NO IDEA HOW MY FIRST POST WAS ENTERED UNDER ANOTHER ACCOUNT?!?!?!?!??!?!
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acrophobic
May 6, 2003, 4:57 PM
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Woah these boards are messed up... I posted that last message
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estwing
May 6, 2003, 5:03 PM
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Wow guys, you should all come out to La Cordee in the fine province of Quebec. If you guys think that MEC is cheap, you will be impressed, $62 for wild country cams, vs $69 at MEC. I don't work there, its just that I like to share a good deal.
Have a nice day,
Sam
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pico23
May 6, 2003, 5:39 PM
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In reply to: The reason M.E.C.'s prices are so low is they are a not for profit co-op. The reason they do not ship to the States is that US distributers threatened to stop supplying them for undercutting US retailers prices. :( Selling gear wholesale to the US like this could endanger things again but having said that, I have taken things to the States for friends. Don't forget that when things are shipped forward, they are subject to customs duties and taxes as they enter the US. Some gear can be shipped directly to the US but much climbing gear can't be so check first and if you can save some money this way then more power to you. Just remember it is the US distributers that are screwing folks, not the M.E.C. :evil:
Yep MEC is a coop but there prices are less both because of that and because the US market pays more. It's not to cover retailers higher cost here in the states. Petzl sets a minimum on there US retail prices and retailers have to sell at or above that. Basically we pay just because we are willing to pay more and when it became clear we weren't willing to pay more they closed the European loophole. The Free world market is TOTAL BULLSHIT. just ask petzl about free market. Take a look at Barrabes and other european retailers that you could once get peztl products for 50% of US retail after $40 shipping (which wasn't that bad considering I got the gear in 24hours). I'm not sure why price fixing is legal but apparently it is. I understand the competition in europe is primarily what brings prices down there but it still seems that if La Sportiva could make a profit on the Mythos at $55 US in spain then they should be able to make one at something near that in the US. Just for the record in the US the Mythos steadily sells at $137.50 at most retailers unless its a sale and then you might pay $120.
In the US americans spend more of there income then anyother country other then England (not sure who is #1 but I think we are but it's close). Manufacturers know this and screw us royally.
Anyway as far as MEC. the rest of canadas retailers also sell there gear at 20% less then US retail. It's a good deal if you go to canada. You get your sales tax back if you spend over $200 CDN (if the rules haven't changed) when crossing the border. I frequently made trips to MEC when my bro went to school in Ottawa. Too far now but with the montreal store oppening I'll be back up there this spring.
That said if anyone wants to pay for my gas I'll gladly bring items back just to fuck the manufacturers monopoly.
As a side note I am pretty sure you don't pay US customs taxes on items under $200 US shipped to the US. I could be wrong but that seemed to be the case when I used to order from Europe. Even if you do pay taxes it's just a couple of bucks on hundreds of dollars of savings. I saved over $1000 from europe and paid $20 in duties. Seems like a good deal.
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climberer
May 6, 2003, 5:52 PM
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I love the co-op, but I buy some of my gear at Coast Mountain Sports cause it waaaaay cheaper that even the MEC. (Even though Coast's staff is totally useless)
think about these examples:
Petzl Attache locking biners $18.50 vs. $22 at the MEC
Arcteryx Targa harness $60 vs. $68
Austrialpin notchless locking biners (light as hell) $12
CANADIAN prices.
i could go on and on.
don't get me wrong. I still love the MEC and for helpful staff and the convenience I'll go there any day.
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pico23
May 6, 2003, 5:52 PM
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I might just have to do that. Is La Cordee in southern quebec? Montreal perhaps. It's a reasonable drive to montreal for me so I'll have to check it out. There are some other shops in the Montreal area that have good prices. Thanks for the tip.
Edited: Checked out the website and I've been there before. It's right on Rue St. Catherines. I'll be making a trip up there next month for my B-day presents.
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estwing
May 6, 2003, 6:01 PM
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Hi, to find store locations click the link, and the "contact us" near the top on the left of the page. There is also Blacks and Yeti, but hey do not have much selection. There used to be other stores, but everyone is going out of business these days.
http://www.lacordee.com/mainframe.php?langue=anglais
http://www.rockclimbing.com/routes/listState.php?CountryStateID=166
Have a good one,
Sam
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psych
May 6, 2003, 6:31 PM
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I thought it was really interesting actually, I was just on MEC's site looking at crashpads, and noticed they had a Flashed pad there (Sensei). I think it was $200 CAN approximately. So, looking for more info on the pad I went to flashed.com and viewed it there. Same pad, $40 higher. Holy...go MEC!
But yeah, not all items can be shipped to the states, though more can now than ever before unless I've not been keeping up. I think it's mainly the US items, like a Cordless pad, things like that, which can ship. I'm not sure that any MEC branded items can...?
Mike...
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pico23
May 6, 2003, 7:03 PM
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In reply to: I thought it was really interesting actually, I was just on MEC's site looking at crashpads, and noticed they had a Flashed pad there (Sensei). I think it was $200 CAN approximately. So, looking for more info on the pad I went to flashed.com and viewed it there. Same pad, $40 higher. Holy...go MEC! But yeah, not all items can be shipped to the states, though more can now than ever before unless I've not been keeping up. I think it's mainly the US items, like a Cordless pad, things like that, which can ship. I'm not sure that any MEC branded items can...? Mike...
No way. When I first became a MEC member I used have my brother bring the stuff home for me or go up and visit him but that was only to save the shipping (after paying gas and tolls I didn't save anything but I was visiting my brother so I didn't account for that since I'd have made the trip regardless of MEC being in Ottawa or not). Back then everything was available to be shipped. Now you can get killer deals on clothing but HARD goods are off limits from most manufacturers US or not. Even Arc Teryx is off limits and they are made in canada. It's gotten tighter and tighter over the last 3 years. Now when I look at the catalog almost everything has the little blue globe indicating no shipment out of canada. Oh, well, montreal is a great city so now i've got more reasons to make the trip. Less then a month till my B-day.
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maynardgkrebs
May 6, 2003, 7:29 PM
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Everyone wants to blame the manufacturers, when one of the main reasons that things are more expensive in the US is because of the consumer. There is an absurd American concept of "Customer Service" which, in the long run, makes everything more expensive.
Places like REI accept for return things such as mountaineering boots that some guy wore in Ecuador for 20 days...In Europe, that guy would have been told to go @#$% himself, and rightly so. For some reason, no one wants to blame the scammer or even REI (for taking back the boots when they shouldn't have.)
Another thing no one seems to understand is the fact that these manufacturers aren't necessarily the same companies as the distributors--Petzl USA might not be the same thing Petzl Canada (I have no idea--I'm just using them as an example.) Duties and taxes on things being imported into the U.S. will be different than on things going to Canada. Petzl Canada might have a contract forbidding them to sell to the U.S. market. When some Canadian shop sends a Gri Gri to an American, this is a violation of the contract, and it's what's known as "gray marketing." Not necessarily illegal, but shady none the less.
Eventually, this will all work itself out. I know a lot of American distributors already require a receipt for returns/exchanges/other forms of customer service. This is necessary nowadays to prevent consumers from buying products from a European company (such as Barrabes) and then STEALING (yes, it is stealing) customer service from an American company. If you call up Barrabes and tell them your shoes wore out too fast, they'll laugh in your face. In America, where the customer is always right, REI will give you your money back for those shoes that lasted "only" two seasons. There is a price for this. If you think things in America are too expensive, then don't patronize store like REI and don't let your friends scam U.S. distributors.
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sunsation
May 6, 2003, 8:02 PM
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Arcteryx has a "seconds" store attached to their warehouse here in Vancouver. You get great deals and whatever flaw there might be, is reaaaally miniscule.
So here's the solution:
-one climbing trip to squamish
-one, or more trips to MEC
-one or more trips to the Acteryx store
If you stay in Canada for more than a few days you can bring back all sorts of stuff duty free. That way you get cheap gear PLUS a wicked climbing trip.
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bigdrop
May 6, 2003, 8:22 PM
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In reply to: Woah these boards are messed up... I posted that last message
how dare you puts words in my mouth!! :mrgreen:
~jc
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psych
May 7, 2003, 1:00 AM
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In reply to: Arcteryx has a "seconds" store attached to their warehouse here in Vancouver. You get great deals and whatever flaw there might be, is reaaaally miniscule. So here's the solution: -one climbing trip to squamish -one, or more trips to MEC -one or more trips to the Acteryx store If you stay in Canada for more than a few days you can bring back all sorts of stuff duty free. That way you get cheap gear PLUS a wicked climbing trip.
Ok, next time I'm in Van, I'm definitely looking for gear manufacturer's stores...I had no idea they even existed until someone mentioned a 5.10 store in Boulder (or somewhere down there). Factory seconds RULE!
Mike...
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rockzen
May 7, 2003, 3:15 AM
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MEC is a cool store - mostly because it is huge. I can spend half the day there shopping for more toys. :D
I must say that one really has to know their prices when comparing one Canadian store to another Canadian store. There are plenty of items at MEC that I have found elsewhere for the same price or cheaper. That said, there are some good prices too. Unfortunately they frequently don't carry the brands I want. :cry:
There is potential to save some cash at MEC, but in my opinion, I'd just rather support my local shops, even if it costs me a couple of extra bucks. Ya ya... kinda dumb on my part, but hey, I don't have to make any special trips to TO, and I can usually get what I want same day! :D
RockZen
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onemistakebigpancake
May 7, 2003, 3:33 AM
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contrary to belief, MEC is NOT the cheapest place to get things. I just bought a Petzl helmet from there for $92 (plus the disgusting taxes)... a couple weeks later I saw the exact same helmet across the street for $78 :evil:. I think they just sell at the going rate at best. go figure!!
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pico23
May 7, 2003, 5:17 AM
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In reply to: Everyone wants to blame the manufacturers, when one of the main reasons that things are more expensive in the US is because of the consumer. There is an absurd American concept of "Customer Service" which, in the long run, makes everything more expensive
your partly right but not totally. See if you were right then REI and EMS would charge more then places like Campmor ( where you buy it you own it like in europe) however while you can get a killer sale deal at campmor you can do better at EMS and you can take you 4 year old resoled 2x backpacking boots back cause they cause hotspots. So I think you need to reconsider your theory.
Like I posted on page one manufacturers actually price based on what the market will bare in the US. It's pretty schrewd. The truth is the goal is to keep as many retailers in business. In Europe (france specifically) the competition is frikkin fierce. In Chamonix they frequently have price wars and sell for almost no profit. In the US at best you can by gear at that much a reduction only if it is something that has no demand. Again, look at my post. In the US and UK gear is more because it is priced based on expendable income. Italians save a good amount of there income per year vs. the US and UK. That means they spend less, which also means they demand less. The result are lower prices to increase sales. Clearly Petzl still makes a more money if they only make $5 on a harness in Italy or France then if they didn't sell any at all by overpricing. In the US they overprice but we pay for it because we are willing. Unfortunately we weren't willing to pay for it and went to Europe and they cut that off. So in the end our choice is A) buy the gear and climb B) don't by the gear and hope what you have last a really long time till you can make a trip to France, buy gear, use it (to avoid the dutie and import limitations), and come home with all new gear for 50% of US retail.
Overall it doesn't have anything to do with customer service or even distribution its just price fixing base on the purchasing power of a given country. There isn't anything wrong with it from a business standpoint (hell it's genius, make $60 in the US when you can only make $5 in france) but I don't like the fact that I can't even choose to look elsewhere because the companies have closed all my options thus eliminating a free market where the consumer dictates the price they are willing to pay.
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maynardgkrebs
May 8, 2003, 12:27 AM
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Big box stores like EMS and REI are cheaper because they're giant corporations with a huge amount of leverage (in the form of dollars) to use against distributors and manufactuers.
If Vasque tells REI to stop refunding money to people who return their boots because they turned dark when they were waterproofed, then REI just says "Well, next season we'll buy a million dollars worth of some other company's boot."
Vasque, rather than losing a million bucks, will simply raise the cost of each pair of their boots a little to cover their costs of doing business with REI. REI doesn't really even help absorb this cost, because they already get huge discounts based on volume buying.
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flying_dutchman
May 8, 2003, 2:08 AM
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just checking out the new mec catologue; prices for cams have gone up an average of like 8 to 10 bucks this year. Glad i bought most of my rack last year. They pretty much still have the cheapest gear in Canada but they never have sales, unlike most other stores, so stuff can be had for less elsewhere from time to time.
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xtonemonkey
May 14, 2003, 6:48 AM
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Hey, are u interested in shipping to Asia? If u are, I could get some orders together and do a big one.
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danl
May 14, 2003, 12:32 PM
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Look at it this way you're not really getting screwed by the manufacturers..too badly. Keep in mind that you make a crap load more money in the US vs other countries.
In reply to: Italians save a good amount of there income per year vs. the US and UK.
are you on crack? you realize how depressed the italian economy is?
Look at it this way... because you are a filthy rich capitolist pig you can afford to pay more thus gear companies can charge less in other more impoverished nations and those less priveledged can afford to climb
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