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bumblie
May 23, 2003, 12:33 PM
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In reply to: Many Bubbas, especially in the South, are not inclined to hire blacks.
That's a harsh stereotype that race-baiters like to promote. Doesn't have much to do with reality.
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extrememountaineer
May 21, 2003, 4:24 AM
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I think that reporter fiasco from NY Times is another nail in the coffin of affirmative action. What are your thoughts?
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brianthew
May 21, 2003, 4:41 AM
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individual merit > racial background.
Judge people on what they do, not what color they are. To do otherwise is racism.
If we're concerned about people from bad schools and bad neighborhoods being unfairly hindered (valid enough), then weight things according to social class, not race. Realize that there are whites in the same crappy schools and shady neighborhoods with parents making the same low wages.
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niceporch
May 21, 2003, 4:49 AM
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JUST AS HERTZ SAYS, EXACTLY.
OR FOR THOSE OLD FOLKS THAT DESPISE IT, WORD.
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one900johnnyk
May 21, 2003, 5:11 AM
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hold on explain to me why you think that is more damaging to affirmative action. i thought that fiasco just adds to the pile of increcibly s hitty writers/content that's been going on at the NYT for so long... i hate that trash because i'm.. uh.. literate.. but i'm glad to see another blow to the NYT. as for affirmative action, that's so last millenium.. it just promotes racial inequality
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curt
May 21, 2003, 5:16 AM
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In reply to: I think that reporter fiasco from NY Times is another nail in the coffin of affirmative action. What are your thoughts?
I am not personally convinced that affirmative action is the culprit here, rather a different type of racial favoritism. The reporter in question, who had been challenged repeatedly by his colleagues for unethical behavior, was protected by a head editor who happened to be of the same race.
Curt
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climber1
May 21, 2003, 5:31 AM
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hey Jody,
we actually agree on something.
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vertically_challanged
May 21, 2003, 11:15 AM
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I live in Scotland, someone please fill me in or provide a link.....
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mojorisin
May 21, 2003, 11:33 AM
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I have never, at any point in my life, been so proud to be white trash.
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bumblie
May 21, 2003, 1:09 PM
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When is The Supreme Court supposed to rule on that Michigan case?
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extrememountaineer
May 21, 2003, 11:58 PM
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I actually think that affirmative action influenced the whole NY Times debacle. He hadn't even graduated from journalism school when they hired him in the "Interest of Diversity". He was counseled on lying a gfew years ago and they kept him on in the "Interest of Diversity". Heck, they even promoted him and gave him importantant assignments because of his skin color. He obviously wasn't qualified. Affirmative action is nothing more than rassigning the discrimination and it does nothing to help minorities succeed.
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jules
May 22, 2003, 12:35 AM
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Affirmative action is absolute bulls---.
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climbinganne
May 22, 2003, 12:37 AM
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hey jules...where were you???
we are trying to figure out rumney... :roll:
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jules
May 22, 2003, 1:02 AM
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i dunno, my mind wanders off a lot. last thing i knew, it was 3pm.
check yer b.com PMs...
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hugepedro
May 22, 2003, 1:04 AM
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Does 1 bad apple mean that affirmative action doesn't work?
Do you folks think that whites don't have a huge advantage in our society over minorities?
Ever think about how many white guys are incompetent but kept on the job because they are golfing buddies with the boss?
I'll guarantee you, there are far more white people benefiting from the ingrained, institutional, "white affirmative action" that is inherent in our society than there are minorities benefitting from any official affirmative action program.
Here we have one example of someone who appears to have benefited from affirmative action, turns out to be lacking integrity, and you are making the gross generalization that all who have benefitted from affirmative action do not deserve the opportunity it afforded them? I fail to understand such reasoning.
Peter
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jules
May 22, 2003, 1:11 AM
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Affirmative action == trying to discourage racism by mandating it.
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curt
May 22, 2003, 1:32 AM
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In reply to: Affirmative action == trying to discourage racism by mandating it.
Juliana is right on the money.
In reply to: I'll guarantee you, there are far more white people benefiting from the ingrained, institutional, "white affirmative action" that is inherent in our society than there are minorities benefitting from any official affirmative action program.
Although this may occur, it is wrong and should be ended. Affirmative action simply puts another form of institutionalized racism in place, instead of trying to eliminate racism altogether.
Two wrongs do not make a right (three lefts do though, I guess)
Curt
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hugepedro
May 22, 2003, 3:51 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: I'll guarantee you, there are far more white people benefiting from the ingrained, institutional, "white affirmative action" that is inherent in our society than there are minorities benefitting from any official affirmative action program. Although this may occur, it is wrong and should be ended. Affirmative action simply puts another form of institutionalized racism in place, instead of trying to eliminate racism altogether. Curt
So, how would you propose to right the original wrong, Curt?
Come on, I want to hear a real solution, not more of that typical conservative crap. ;)
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bumblie
May 22, 2003, 4:58 PM
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HP,
What are we talking about here? Sin of the fathers?
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curt
May 22, 2003, 5:19 PM
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In reply to: In reply to: In reply to: I'll guarantee you, there are far more white people benefiting from the ingrained, institutional, "white affirmative action" that is inherent in our society than there are minorities benefitting from any official affirmative action program. Although this may occur, it is wrong and should be ended. Affirmative action simply puts another form of institutionalized racism in place, instead of trying to eliminate racism altogether. Curt So, how would you propose to right the original wrong, Curt? Come on, I want to hear a real solution, not more of that typical conservative crap. ;)
I have no immediate solution for you. However, I truly believe that the root problem should be addressed rather than a symptom of the problem. I am also equally convinced that following a blatantly racist program such as "affirmative action" which disadvantages others, solely based on their race, is not the solution.
Curt
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lynnie
May 22, 2003, 5:28 PM
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so, just to toughen the question some --
if two young men, one white, one not, are both equally ququalifie dt enter medical school --same grades, same MCAT, same extra-cacurrics from an IVY league institution, good refs, etc. ququantifiably equal.
is is WRONG to choose the "non-white guys" because he might "add to the diversity" of the class? he might add a non-quantifiable experiential aspect to learning...
if you picked from two names in a hat, there is a 50% chance that he would get chosen anyway.
like the michigan case, right?
what do people think you SHOULD do in this situation? what is RIGHT? what is right for the kids, and right for the class as a whole? id like to hear peoples ideas on that.
editted for spelling
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bumblie
May 22, 2003, 5:50 PM
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Lynnie,
Your example isn't applicable. It compares two equally qualified candidates. The issue w/ Affirmative Action in admissions has to do with accepting lesser qualified minorities, while passing up more qualified whites, for the sake of diversity.
Here's another example - African-American goes to private school and does so-so in school and gets into the college of his choice due to affirmative action. Meanwhile, you have a poor white kid, who went to a lousy high school, studied hard and has slighter better academic records than the other candidate. He loses out because he's not a minority.
The just thing to do would be to admit the white guy because he needs the "aid". I'm all for helping the less fortunate, but Affirmative Action helps solely on minority status.
This an extreme example, but it still makes the point.
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lynnie
May 22, 2003, 5:58 PM
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thanks for the clarification, bumblie,
but im confused... the michigan case (at least the law school part of it) is exactly what i mentioned, i think, except it was a female who was denied admission instead of a male. the woman who is suing the school claims that she was looked over because she was white, while a non-white candidate (of equal standing, at least what is quantifiable) got a spot in the class.
if im wrong correct me, but i think thats also part of affirmative action. if not, what is that? and is it still ok to make a choice, then, based on race/religion/ethnicity, etc?
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bumblie
May 22, 2003, 6:03 PM
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In reply to: the woman who is suing the school claims that she was looked over because she was white, while a non-white candidate (of equal standing, at least what is quantifiable) got a spot in the class.
It was my understanding that she was more qualified. I could be wrong.
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