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beerandblood
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Jul 17, 2001, 10:14 PM
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kagunkie


Jul 17, 2001, 10:27 PM
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Sometimes you might want to climb and theres nobody around to belay,what should you do? JUST GO AND CLIMB!!!!! You know your limits, stay within them and youll be OK. Practice your ropework, hauling techniqus, jugging, rappelling, stealing pins, oops scratch that last one, he he he. MOST OF ALL go where you want, thats what climbing is all about anyway, going where you want no matter how dificult it is.


kagunkie


Jul 17, 2001, 10:54 PM
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 Ok..... I got off on a tangent. I love to solo and feel climbing by myself is one of my greatest treasures. Its pure nobody there to interupt the experience. But I have a great respect for GRAVITY and am usually very cautious about where and when Ill do it.


kriso9tails


Jul 17, 2001, 11:04 PM
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You know, external factors cause prople to fall as well. I respect that people should be able to do what they want with their own lives, but in the land of liablility, if there are too many climbing related deaths then schools can't go on climbing trips, crags get shut down, bad stuff happens for the support.

Like I've said before, you may know your limits, but you don't control the bees, and rain, and lightning, and some one will shoot me if I list eveything that can (and has all too often) go wrong.

It's your life and do as you see fit, just consider the weight of your actions and repercutions of your mentality.

[ This Message was edited by: kriso9tails on 2001-07-17 23:06 ]


kriso9tails


Jul 17, 2001, 11:33 PM
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It's not a death wish or or mastery. It's like a lottery, sure you probably won't die, but hey, today might be your lucky day and you beat the odds. So it's that way with all things, but free soloing ups your chances drastcally.

Like I said, It's your life, just don't make it my problem (Not that I want to read about anyone's death, that would be horrible, but if you died doing what you loved and believed in, more power to you.)


kriso9tails


Jul 18, 2001, 12:08 AM
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Think about standing firmly on the ground. Your responses to your environment are limitless.

Now think about yourself on the rock, your hands are tied.

You will react to a stimulus before your brain recieves the message. Some of those reaction will cause you to let go. If you're on the ground you pick yourself and respond. If you're 50 feet off the deck, respond how you want, but gravity's got you now.

Also, free soloing relies on human judgement. People make mistakes.


kriso9tails


Jul 18, 2001, 1:15 AM
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Huh? Belay? That would be neither free nor solo. am I missing something?


kriso9tails


Jul 18, 2001, 10:58 AM
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Human judgement on the behalf of the climber. If you're onsighting 11d then obviuosly a 12d free solo would be a little ridiculus.


kriso9tails


Jul 18, 2001, 11:12 AM
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No, that would be (in my opinion which counts for exactly squat) stupid. If you can't do the moves, then what's the point of working them free solo? This means you only get one chance to do it right (which you probably won't) and then you die. Why not work the moves roped in first. That's how you get better. Fear causes panic, not motivation. Fight or flight response is not good at eighty feet up.

Why not rope in all the time. The majority of climbing accidents that I hear about have nothing to do with skill. It's usually bad luck as well as malpractice. S*** happens, be prepared for when it does.


coach


Jul 18, 2001, 11:24 AM
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Only free soloed once and didn't really mean to; was looking for a route to set up a top rope and just started up an area that looked easy. About 40 feet up it started to get harder and before we knew it, my partner and I were 60 feet up with 20 to go so pushed on. Once on top we realized how stupid it was and I have never made that mistake again. If I can't scramble up easily I tie in. Life is too precious to lose it on a climb.

Climb On


kagunkie


Jul 18, 2001, 9:44 PM
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Deathwishes or mastery, neither of these are involved when Im climbing alone. Sometimes its just a way to get to the top for example to set up a toprope or rappell and clean a route. Other times (less often) just to climb when nobody is around to climb with, its always well below my leading limit. If you know your limits and stay within them it can be very rewarding to exercise the level of controll needed when your ass is on the line and incomparibly exillerating while your up there.


wandt


Jul 18, 2001, 11:47 PM
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I think that free soloeing is also inconsiderate to others. If you're going to do it, alert your next of kin and the authorities of when you should be home safe, so if you're not they can go and scrape your remains up. I know MY climbing day would be thoroughly ruined by wandering up to the base of a climb and finding the two dimensional remnants of a would-be free soloist. Bleah!


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 8:21 AM
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Wandt, you said...
"I think that free soloing is also inconsiderate "
If you find my body I hope youll do the right thing, First check the pockets for spare change, Second find my pack and take whatever you want, then walk out and call the authorities for removal. I am not telling anyone to solo Im just answering...

"Alot of committed climbers do it at some point. Alot of people say there is a death wish involved. General concensus?"

Besides just think of the stories you can tell....he was still breathing and his last words were..or the smell was so bad that...his legs were wraped around his neck...or just say what a traumatic and shocking experience it was.

"I know MY climbing day would be thoroughly ruined by wandering up to the base of a climb and finding the two dimensional remnants of a would-be free soloist. Bleah!"

Sorry if it ruined your day but its just one day. I think its inconsiderate of would-be climbers like you not to be willing to give up one day to see to it that a fellow climber is taken care of after a fatal accident!

Dont forget, someday far far far away in your climbing carreer. YOU may find that YOU are soloing something for whatever reason.

"Nah"

[ This Message was edited by: kagunkie on 2001-07-19 09:00 ]


jsm280


Jul 19, 2001, 10:29 AM
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If you would have asked me to free solo last year I would have laughed and said no way.
I free soloed a 5-6 about a 45 ft pitch a few weeks ago and did not feel any danger. I now know where it starts. The stronger your are the higher the solo you feel solid on.
I admit I would not solo anything I have never climed several times before or is anywhere near my limit. I also have to be in a certain frame of mind...

Be safe... Know and understand your limits and ALL posible outcomes.


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 6:08 PM
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A word to the wise...... The price of a slip is death or worse, tread very carefully my friend.


[ This Message was edited by: kagunkie on 2001-07-19 18:10 ]


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 10:29 PM
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 Its not the death part that bothers me its the worse than death senario thats truely frightening to me. To lay at the bottom of some rock somewhere with a broken neck and not be able to stop the vultures from pecking out your eyes, youch thats gotta hurt!


kriso9tails


Jul 19, 2001, 10:39 PM
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At least at eighty feet you're probably gonna die if you bail. If it were me and I fell, I would try to go down head first so that there was no chance of becomming a quadraplegic (seriously).

Again, I've fallen before on easy climbs because of breaking holds, rain, a wasp flying up my shorts. What if I were free soloing? Why risk it?

If you fall free solo, what do you yell, rock, rope, or comming down get the hell out of my...( I'm assuming you would hit the ground before finishing).

"If you ever fall off the CN Tower, just go real limp, because maybe you'll look like a dummy and people will try to catch you because, hey, free dummy. "

"If you go parachuting, and your parachute doesn't open, and you friends are all watching you fall, I think a funny gag would be to pretend you were swimming."

Quotes: Jack Handy, SNL






[ This Message was edited by: kriso9tails on 2001-07-19 22:46 ]


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 10:42 PM
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Dont forget to scream on the way down!!!!!!!


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 10:45 PM
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 Im not concidering it anytime soon, for sure but if your gonna climb without ropes you better think about what it would be like!


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 11:05 PM
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If you just have somekind of cartoon picture in your head that youll just land on your feet or jump to a tree or even that the death would be quick your not in reality. Just think about it, in two hundred feet your probably traveling over seventy or eighty miles per hour. Imagine hitting a solid surface at that speed, not a pretty picture. You wouldnt survive most likely but you may live for a time afterwards, maby a long time. Its not a thought that is very comfortable but it is reality.


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 11:07 PM
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This is a very sticky subject but we may as well carry it out to its conclusion.


kriso9tails


Jul 19, 2001, 11:13 PM
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People have lived with out serious injury from such hights, but the odds against are too high for my computer to calculate.

People have also lived and spent the rest of their miserable lives in a hospital, never ever mving freely again. That tends to make it hard to send that 514d project.


kagunkie


Jul 19, 2001, 11:28 PM
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We each decide for ourselves and have to live with the consiquences of our decisions. Its a personal choice for each person is alittle different and nobody has the right to make it for us. Im tired of being "protected" and told that something is dangerous and that Im not allowed. For gods sake Im over twentyone years old and can make my own damn decision. Thats all.


kriso9tails


Jul 19, 2001, 11:44 PM
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That's not all. Crags can be shut down because of negligent climbers. If a private landowner allows climbing on his property, how is that person going to feel after a death. Do you think conservation authorities look well on climbers after a needless death?

If you're over 21 that gives you the right to drink, but does it give you the right to drive drunk? You are not just hurting yourself if something happens (in fact if you're dead you won't hurt at all) you're hurting the sport and it's reputation.


kagunkie


Jul 20, 2001, 12:38 AM
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Here we go with the death thing again.
Quote:Do you think conservation authorities look well on climbers after a needless death?

I have yet to see a climbers death that was needed, your starting to sound like Oprah. IV had enough.
AND NOW THAT YOU HAVE A FULL UNDERSTANDING OF THE DANGERS INVOLVED MABY YOU CAN MAKE YOUR OWN DECISION IN THE MATTER. Wich is what I demand for myself!


[ This Message was edited by: kagunkie on 2001-07-20 10:18 ]

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